Coronavirus prep
Replies
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May be scales have just dropped from my eyes! Someone saying about contracting things from packed letuce! That had to be enteritis, right? If your food hygiene system is so poor that bagged lettuce is not prepared properly so that covid 19 can be contracted from it, I totaly dispare for any of you.0
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@missysippy930 Altho this isn't covid related, I agree the situation in the Twin Cities is devastating. I have family in Mpls area & my niece manages a Trader Joes in St Paul that was looted. Luckily all were safe. Havent heard about last night.
Related to the virus, altho Iowa is still having quite a few cases we are still reopening most everything. Personally, I have relaxed a little..no longer wipe all groceries, just try to quarantine them for a while if possible. Just couldn't keep it up & stay sane, lol.5 -
RetiredAndLovingIt wrote: »@missysippy930 Altho this isn't covid related, I agree the situation in the Twin Cities is devastating. I have family in Mpls area & my niece manages a Trader Joes in St Paul that was looted. Luckily all were safe. Havent heard about last night.
Related to the virus, altho Iowa is still having quite a few cases we are still reopening most everything. Personally, I have relaxed a little..no longer wipe all groceries, just try to quarantine them for a while if possible. Just couldn't keep it up & stay sane, lol.
If I lived in USA I'd be not relaxing at all. Be ultra careful. Please. You have the biggest death rates in the world. Do every thing you can to be safe please. I do and we had no cases in over 50 days here. Wake up please. Go to a hospital if you think this isn't real FFS. Sorry this isn't for you but for the dumb f's that think just because you can't see it then it's not real.8 -
cmriverside wrote: »rheddmobile wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »Well sure. In the U.S. ( not sure where you are, Fuzzi ) we have the same regulations.
I've worked for many years in the food industry.
It's only as safe as its weakest link.
If you go out to the park or the beach, do you disinfect your shoes before you get in the car or before you walk in the house? How about washing your clothes every time you wear them? Without letting them touch anything else in your house? So that would mean disrobing immediately when you get in your house, showering and washing those clothes and disinfecting those shoes.
But then - you have the car to worry about? Are you giving it 10 days between using it? If not, how are you dealing with contaminants in the carpet and on the upholstery?
Now let's extrapolate that out to every human who touches every item that you might touch?
Like I said, I worked in the food industry for decades. I'm surprised more people don't die just from eating out. It's a super unsafe industry - even though you think it's safe. That 20 year old girl who works at Mickey Dees? You think she never touches the brim of your cup or scratches her nose then bags your order? Ha.
Same goes for grocery stores. Is every person disinfecting?
Yeah, I did restaurant management for several years and one of the hardest things was just ensuring basic food safety in the face of (relative) employee indifference. Basic things like handwashing, not picking things up off the floor, changing gloves after touching personal areas, etc. Then you add all the stuff about making them care that the FOOD actually stays safe by staying at a proper temperature, etc.
It's not that they were malicious, it's just hard to get buy-in to prevent "invisible" dangers.
Especially when the vulnerability to the invisible dangers comes from below-conscious behaviors, and in a busy context.
I see this in myself as I try to put in place sensible anti-virus measures to keep my house "clean" (in the viral sense - I'm still a desultory housekeeper generally
).
I can tell myself (say) I'm going to take my shoes off at the door, but I forget and just carry the bag to the kitchen, now and then, on autopilot. I can adopt a certain method for handling maybe-suspect foods/packages/items, but it's easy to drop and pick up, grab something by reflex and not notice, etc.
The above may suggest a level of fear or obsession that I don't think I have or feel, in practice; but I'm making a point about unconscious chinks in our armor, in the midst of busy routines, despite being well-informed, and making best conscious effort. It doesn't worry me deeply, but I know those chinks are facts. And they're not due to lack of awareness, lack of caring, or any form of intent.
Why so much focus on shoes? Yes, my shoes are dirty, and they spread dirt to my floor. They do that normally when there is no covid because the ground is covered in tetanus and e.coli, among millions of other infectious agents. For that reason, I never put my shoes on a surface which ever contacts my face or something likely to touch my face. I wash my hands after doing push-ups, for example. I don’t lick my floors, or drop food on them and then eat it, or set plates on them. The floor is and has always been a non-safe surface. I tend to take my shoes off or change to indoor shoes when I come home simply because my shoes are uncomfortable for wearing around the house, but I would consider this true even if I lived Japanese-style and took my shoes off every time before entering, because I don’t regularly wash my feet as I wash my hands, so my feet are likely to be germy.
Covid isn’t absorbed through the skin, if you can avoid sticking your shoe in your mouth (either directly or indirectly) you should be fine.
Don't put your feet up on the couch, table or bed without washing them. Because once it's on the furniture or in your bed, it's transferable to your hands, body, face. Don't use throw blankets on the couch when it's cold...same thing. Don't pet your dog or cat who sleeps on the floor...etc.
Sorry but if one is that worrined about it, might as well take the dog or cat to the pound as all domestic dogs/cats will be lying/rolling on the floor at sometime and they want/need to be petted.6 -
Theoldguy1 wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »rheddmobile wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »Well sure. In the U.S. ( not sure where you are, Fuzzi ) we have the same regulations.
I've worked for many years in the food industry.
It's only as safe as its weakest link.
If you go out to the park or the beach, do you disinfect your shoes before you get in the car or before you walk in the house? How about washing your clothes every time you wear them? Without letting them touch anything else in your house? So that would mean disrobing immediately when you get in your house, showering and washing those clothes and disinfecting those shoes.
But then - you have the car to worry about? Are you giving it 10 days between using it? If not, how are you dealing with contaminants in the carpet and on the upholstery?
Now let's extrapolate that out to every human who touches every item that you might touch?
Like I said, I worked in the food industry for decades. I'm surprised more people don't die just from eating out. It's a super unsafe industry - even though you think it's safe. That 20 year old girl who works at Mickey Dees? You think she never touches the brim of your cup or scratches her nose then bags your order? Ha.
Same goes for grocery stores. Is every person disinfecting?
Yeah, I did restaurant management for several years and one of the hardest things was just ensuring basic food safety in the face of (relative) employee indifference. Basic things like handwashing, not picking things up off the floor, changing gloves after touching personal areas, etc. Then you add all the stuff about making them care that the FOOD actually stays safe by staying at a proper temperature, etc.
It's not that they were malicious, it's just hard to get buy-in to prevent "invisible" dangers.
Especially when the vulnerability to the invisible dangers comes from below-conscious behaviors, and in a busy context.
I see this in myself as I try to put in place sensible anti-virus measures to keep my house "clean" (in the viral sense - I'm still a desultory housekeeper generally ).
I can tell myself (say) I'm going to take my shoes off at the door, but I forget and just carry the bag to the kitchen, now and then, on autopilot. I can adopt a certain method for handling maybe-suspect foods/packages/items, but it's easy to drop and pick up, grab something by reflex and not notice, etc.
The above may suggest a level of fear or obsession that I don't think I have or feel, in practice; but I'm making a point about unconscious chinks in our armor, in the midst of busy routines, despite being well-informed, and making best conscious effort. It doesn't worry me deeply, but I know those chinks are facts. And they're not due to lack of awareness, lack of caring, or any form of intent.
Why so much focus on shoes? Yes, my shoes are dirty, and they spread dirt to my floor. They do that normally when there is no covid because the ground is covered in tetanus and e.coli, among millions of other infectious agents. For that reason, I never put my shoes on a surface which ever contacts my face or something likely to touch my face. I wash my hands after doing push-ups, for example. I don’t lick my floors, or drop food on them and then eat it, or set plates on them. The floor is and has always been a non-safe surface. I tend to take my shoes off or change to indoor shoes when I come home simply because my shoes are uncomfortable for wearing around the house, but I would consider this true even if I lived Japanese-style and took my shoes off every time before entering, because I don’t regularly wash my feet as I wash my hands, so my feet are likely to be germy.
Covid isn’t absorbed through the skin, if you can avoid sticking your shoe in your mouth (either directly or indirectly) you should be fine.
Don't put your feet up on the couch, table or bed without washing them. Because once it's on the furniture or in your bed, it's transferable to your hands, body, face. Don't use throw blankets on the couch when it's cold...same thing. Don't pet your dog or cat who sleeps on the floor...etc.
Sorry but if one is that worrined about it, might as well take the dog or cat to the pound as all domestic dogs/cats will be lying/rolling on the floor at sometime and they want/need to be petted.
No kidding.
No one is going to be 100% "safe" - that was my point that seems to have gone over your head. I have a cat who walks across my head/pillow at night. However, if I keep my outdoor shoes outdoors I remove the covid danger from my floors. My cat does not go outside, either.
Animals are just another layer in the complexity of trying to keep stuff clean.9 -
Hard to believe anyone would suggest taking a pet to the pound.
Oh wait, people take pets to shelters because they don't match the couch - so, sure. That's a solution.6 -
RetiredAndLovingIt wrote: »
Related to the virus, altho Iowa is still having quite a few cases we are still reopening most everything. Personally, I have relaxed a little..no longer wipe all groceries, just try to quarantine them for a while if possible. Just couldn't keep it up & stay sane, lol.
I've seen many experts saying the risks of the virus being alive on food packaging and surviving the trip home is super small, so this is probably a good place to relax a little for your sanity
I come straight in, put the groceries away, throw out the bags, all while still not touching my face, then wash my hands and wipe down the kitchen surfaces. 12 -
"Our local supermarkets are appealing to shoppers to examine items with their eyes instead of their hands before making a selection. This protects you from having to buy the items I already touched and left on the shelf."
Our's ask the same. Unfortunately, the key nutritional info for diabetics is on the back and if I need to compare items, to pick the one with the lowest carbs per 100g, I need to turn the packets round. If all supermarkets stocked the same cereal so that i could buy the same stuff each time, I'd be fine - but they don't.8 -
[/quote]RetiredAndLovingIt wrote: »@missysippy930 Altho this isn't covid related, I agree the situation in the Twin Cities is devastating. I have family in Mpls area & my niece manages a Trader Joes in St Paul that was looted. Luckily all were safe. Havent heard about last night.
Related to the virus, altho Iowa is still having quite a few cases we are still reopening most everything. Personally, I have relaxed a little..no longer wipe all groceries, just try to quarantine them for a while if possible. Just couldn't keep it up & stay sane, lol.
For every Minnesotan, this tragedy will always be linked with Covid in our minds. It looks like a war zone. The highest amount of deaths recorded from Covid yesterday. The National Guard has been called in, and the leaders are meeting right now to decide on declaring martial law. I don’t know which is scarier.12 -
I have a daughter with food allergies, so label reading is a way of life. Even previously “safe” items can change so I automatically check nearly everything that goes in my cart.... and some don’t make the cut so they have to go back on the shelf. Never have I been so self conscious shopping!Strudders67 wrote: »"Our local supermarkets are appealing to shoppers to examine items with their eyes instead of their hands before making a selection. This protects you from having to buy the items I already touched and left on the shelf."
Our's ask the same. Unfortunately, the key nutritional info for diabetics is on the back and if I need to compare items, to pick the one with the lowest carbs per 100g, I need to turn the packets round. If all supermarkets stocked the same cereal so that i could buy the same stuff each time, I'd be fine - but they don't.
Had to go to Dollar General today to pick up some mask making materials and caffeine for a brewing migraine. A store that already annoys the heck out of me is suffocating now! The aisles are always narrow and difficult to maneuver through due to random boxes/displays/inventory everywhere, but they seemed especially small today... and the directional arrows make it even more difficult to navigate when I don’t know where I need to go for what. Directional arrows + narrow aisles = aaaahhhhhh! for me. So many times I wanted to stop to look at something, only to have someone come up behind me and I had to move so they could get by (only room enough for one)... and then twice they didn’t go by, but took my place to look at the same thing I was trying to look at. Gaaaahhhh! Migraine probably made me that much more sensitive to things, but by the time I left I wanted to run out screaming.10 -
This is a Corona song. I just had to share it with all'y'all, it's Rolling Stones inspired. The pesky tourists are swarming my home and I can't wait for them to git along lil dogies.
I'm in a lockdown
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=um2HLwseRaI
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Err. Sorry i did not say small pox was spread from excrement. I said the initial contamination from covid came from animals in wet food markents from there once it, the virus knows how to move from person to person it goes from person to person. Had hygene been higher in the markets which it was not because of povity and so on.
It still seems as if you are saying that the issue is that people aren't careful enough about avoiding uncontaminated food (like contaminated lettuce), and adding on that somehow people weren't adequately washing hands and such.
While, sure, things like masks, hand washing, etc., can help reduce the spread of existing diseases, and poor people in poor countries (or countries with lots of poor people) may have conditions that make human to human spread more likely (due to people being in close quarters and such), that's not really the issue with wet markets and especially wet markets that illegally include wildlife (including wildlife that is banned from being there).
Note: I think in this current case there is not clear-cut knowledge as to what happened or that it was related to a pangolin and/or bat as originally stated.
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/animals/2020/04/coronavirus-linked-to-chinese-wet-markets/#close
The issue with the wet markets/wildlife markets is the mixing of live animals that can spread viruses to each other and lead to mutations that allow them to be spread to humans. Again, my understanding about why parts of China have been the source of some of these viruses is that the way farming works -- close contact between ducks (a reservoir for bird flu which humans cannot normally catch) and pigs (who can pass on flu to humans and catch it from ducks, leading to mutations making the bird flu potentially infectious to humans) -- https://old.post-gazette.com/healthscience/20010429chinafluhealth3.asp. Something similar seems likely to happen with the wet markets and might well have been the issue here.
It's the close contact between humans and animals and some types of animals with others (and potentially "exotic" animals with others passing on new viruses that humans had not been exposed to before.3 -
If you do not wash your salad properly as was suggested in the post i was replying to, where that person lives they have high levles of, word escapes me, virus contamination for want of a better term, obviously you can't be sure what is being transferred from hand to mouth. LIke i said we have and practice good hygene standards and things. our bagged salads are washed in clinically checked clean water. loose salads we do at home and its down to you if you don't follow expected standards.
FYI: https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/lettuce-e-coli-contamination-1.4913956#:~:text=Washing the produce at home,not removing 100 per cent.
(And no, I didn't say you got viruses from lettuce. I was responding to your claim that the virus was created due to lack of sanitation. That seems a misunderstanding of how zoonotic diseases occur.)4 -
moonangel12 wrote: »
I have a daughter with food allergies, so label reading is a way of life. Even previously “safe” items can change so I automatically check nearly everything that goes in my cart.... and some don’t make the cut so they have to go back on the shelf. Never have I been so self conscious shopping!Strudders67 wrote: »"Our local supermarkets are appealing to shoppers to examine items with their eyes instead of their hands before making a selection. This protects you from having to buy the items I already touched and left on the shelf."
Our's ask the same. Unfortunately, the key nutritional info for diabetics is on the back and if I need to compare items, to pick the one with the lowest carbs per 100g, I need to turn the packets round. If all supermarkets stocked the same cereal so that i could buy the same stuff each time, I'd be fine - but they don't.
Yes! I feel so guilty looking at items and then putting them back. But I have allergies and other restrictions so I have to look at them. I feel like everyone is watching and judging. Ugh. It's horrible. And you are also correct in that even if an item was safe before, it may not be now. So everything has to be checked!7 -
I give up7
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GaleHawkins wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »Maybe it true there is nothing new under the sun!
https://forbes.com/sites/kionasmith/2020/04/29/protesting-during-a-pandemic-isnt-new-meet-the-anti-mask-league/?fbclid=IwAR3uoi07aM1tK2frpNniJrFT2w-nG0yV5t2-CmxfGvzM8NQieWFLlQhijjE#31c19d2c12f9
Nice piece, and although I'm reasonably sure it was not your intended point (as I have a strong sense you are part of the anti mask contingent, please correct me if I'm wrong), here's a good takeaway quoted from the piece:
"While it’s true that cloth masks are far from a perfect shield against tiny virus particles, but the best available data suggests that they’re much better than nothing when it comes to keeping infected people exhaling virus-laden droplets of spit and mucus all over the people around them. And since it’s possible to spread COVID-19 long before you realize you’re infected, wearing a mask is usually the responsible thing to do, just as it was in 1918."
Feel free to think what ever best meets your needs when it comes to me.
"Watch legendary Dr. Jane Goodall, DBE, Founder of the Jane Goodall Institute and UN Messenger of Peace, talk about why she thinks animals are not to blame for the current pandemic in this Coronavirus special series."
https://youtube.com/watch?v=hStJvTv_Sh0&feature=youtu.be
Dr. Goodall has a wisdom about life that is very rare.
No no no! I DO blame animals: I blame Ratty McEvil Rat
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Strudders67 wrote: »"Our local supermarkets are appealing to shoppers to examine items with their eyes instead of their hands before making a selection. This protects you from having to buy the items I already touched and left on the shelf."
Our's ask the same. Unfortunately, the key nutritional info for diabetics is on the back and if I need to compare items, to pick the one with the lowest carbs per 100g, I need to turn the packets round. If all supermarkets stocked the same cereal so that i could buy the same stuff each time, I'd be fine - but they don't.
Also a diabetic. I generally compare info online, then double check my selection at the store. No need to fondle a bunch of different varieties to find which one is best. (Not that I would ever eat cereal, but that’s another subject.)1 -
rheddmobile wrote: »
Also a diabetic. I generally compare info online, then double check my selection at the store. No need to fondle a bunch of different varieties to find which one is best. (Not that I would ever eat cereal, but that’s another subject.)
I have on more then one occasion done that... then gotten to the store and checked the actual product only to find that something has changed. If I had bought and ate the product based off of the online information and not the REAL information I would have been seriously ill.7 -
Until I get to the supermarket and see what they have, I can't check info - and I'm only going shopping in the bigger supermarkets once a month. The problem is that the supermarket doesn't always stock what I plan to buy. In some cases, what I'd bought previously is now discontinued.5
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I feel bad manhandling the produce...but my grocery store is notorious for putting out less than great produce so I have to pick up each item to examine it before I decide to select it. They like to put the soft or rotten side down so you can’t tell just by looking. I’ll just assume that no one’s going to buy that mushy cucumber anyways.10
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Thanks sweetie. I'm in a very happy mood now. I'm actually going out for the first time in months for a BBQ near the beach with my grandson and the family. Cooking my little heart out. Blueberry lemon drizzle cake is in the oven 11 -
Some interesting discussions about how SARS-COV-2 is not a respiratory disease as much as a blood vessel disease.
https://elemental.medium.com/coronavirus-may-be-a-blood-vessel-disease-which-explains-everything-2c4032481ab2
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30937-5/fulltext4 -
Fascinating, scary, hopeful, scary, @T1DCarnivoreRunner2
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Strudders67 wrote: »Until I get to the supermarket and see what they have, I can't check info - and I'm only going shopping in the bigger supermarkets once a month. The problem is that the supermarket doesn't always stock what I plan to buy. In some cases, what I'd bought previously is now discontinued.rheddmobile wrote: »
Also a diabetic. I generally compare info online, then double check my selection at the store. No need to fondle a bunch of different varieties to find which one is best. (Not that I would ever eat cereal, but that’s another subject.)
I have on more then one occasion done that... then gotten to the store and checked the actual product only to find that something has changed. If I had bought and ate the product based off of the online information and not the REAL information I would have been seriously ill.
Yep, that’s why I said to double check the box information at the store. Not that there’s any guarantee, in case of a discrepancy between the info on the box and the info on the company website, that the box is the correct one.
Even so, if I’m buying something as out there for diabetics as cereal, I know going in from research which varieties of cereal might be low enough in carbs to be candidates. Cereal by definition is cereal grains (straight carbs) processed to be even quicker to digest. An exception to that rule seems like it would be something you would know about before you got there.1 -
@mockchoc Thanks for your concern..I am being as vigilant as possible. Have not been to any store in almost 3 months, do online grocery which dh picks up contactless, have a mask in my pocket at all times in case I need it & try to avoid people when walking.
@kimny72 That is the way I handle our groceries, too..well, except for putting away..anything that doesn’t need to be refrigerated gets put aside to “quarantine” for at least 2-3 days or longer..until I need it. Have always been a hand washer, so no change there. Getting hard to find hand soap tho! No more tp shortage any more, tho.
Iowa has more cases than I am comfortable with, but definitely not an epicenter.5 -
T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »Some interesting discussions about how SARS-COV-2 is not a respiratory disease as much as a blood vessel disease.
https://elemental.medium.com/coronavirus-may-be-a-blood-vessel-disease-which-explains-everything-2c4032481ab2
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30937-5/fulltext
Very interesting. That might explain why (here in Italy) survivors of COVID19 are asked to donate their blood. Andrea Boccelli just donated, and it was all over the News. The plasma is used on those who are fighting the disease. They've had good luck with this approach.4 -
snowflake954 wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »Some interesting discussions about how SARS-COV-2 is not a respiratory disease as much as a blood vessel disease.
https://elemental.medium.com/coronavirus-may-be-a-blood-vessel-disease-which-explains-everything-2c4032481ab2
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30937-5/fulltext
Very interesting. That might explain why (here in Italy) survivors of COVID19 are asked to donate their blood. Andrea Boccelli just donated, and it was all over the News. The plasma is used on those who are fighting the disease. They've had good luck with this approach.
I thought it was because they wanted the antibodies. I know even if I had the antibodies, they wouldn't likely want my blood because I took beef insulin back in the 1990's. I can't donate blood because they are worried about vCJD (i.e. mad cow disease).10 -
The "general" subforum has lost its pages...we can't look at anything that's not on the first page.
I'm bumping this so it will go to the top.2 -
snowflake954 wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »Some interesting discussions about how SARS-COV-2 is not a respiratory disease as much as a blood vessel disease.
https://elemental.medium.com/coronavirus-may-be-a-blood-vessel-disease-which-explains-everything-2c4032481ab2
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30937-5/fulltext
Very interesting. That might explain why (here in Italy) survivors of COVID19 are asked to donate their blood. Andrea Boccelli just donated, and it was all over the News. The plasma is used on those who are fighting the disease. They've had good luck with this approach.
100% of the patients I work with are COVID positive, and we have been giving the plasma to the patients who qualify for it, for around 3 weeks now - the results are astounding! I'm in Chicago, FWIW.14
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