Coronavirus prep
Replies
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T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »I'm at the laundromat and am the only person here in compliance with the county mask mandate. To be fair, half the people here can't figure out how to wear pants. Maybe masks are truly too much to ask.
Sounds like Tennessee alright!
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T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »Chef_Barbell wrote: »I remember when this thread was toilet paper and eating cat food 😂😜
And I still can't understand the toilet paper issue. Was never a problem where I live.
People were just buying up all the TP as soon as it got to stores, so many of us never could find any because others bought it before we had a chance.
Fortunately, I have a ton of leftovwr turkey because I got an almost 20 lb. turkey for Thanksgiving and live alone. Granted, I don't eat plants, but this is several days worth of food by itself.
While TP is still on the shelves at our Walmart currently this past summer it was overflowing and we restocked well so we'll be fine since we just replace as we use it.
As a kid in the 50's I remember dad going to town in the old Pickup and load it up with can goods, sugar, flour, 25 pound tin of hog lard and TP for the winter. Still today we only buy mainly 24-48 roll packs.
I think the mindset in rural America is still impacted by Great Depression and 1918 Spanish Flu pandemic because we heard those stories from our parents and grandparents. We don't hoard but we do stock up for potential hard times.
This is a good point. My grandparents were depression-era kids and they keep and hoard absolutely everything from magazines to plastic containers (and glass, of course). In fact, I have seen them rinse and re-use paper cups from fast food for days on end. My grandpa died in April and my grandma is in a nursing home now. I've not been in the house they lived in for decades, but I don't think either of them have been there for a long time either. It's in such poor condition, in part due to their hoarding, that it hasn't been livable for years. As they got old and couldn't climb over all their stuff, they became more and more restricted about what part of the house they could even go to. I know they haven't gone upstairs for years... and it is probably a good thing because last time I was there (2011), there was so much stuff in the 2nd floor that the ceiling on the main floor was visibly bowing.
Of course, not everyone in their generation is at that level of hoarding. Nonetheless, there is definitely a habit within older American generations to obtain items that could be useful and keep anything that might have some purpose at some point.
Can confirm. My grandmother was an Oakie who traveled from Oklahoma to Cali during the Depression and ended up helping pick strawberries in fields to help support her family. Her pantries were always full to bursting and her garage was full. She hoarded everything and even though Grandfather ended up doing well financially, they even hoarded their wealth and lived thriftily day-to-day.
Similarly, Hubby and I grew up poor in Appalachia. As soon as we clawed our way into middle class, Hubs learned the lessons of his Depression era grandparents, whom he was close to, and his experience being below the poverty level and began to systematically build up a nice stockpile and freezer and kept it up over the years. We were sitting very well during the TP and the food shortages in the spring. Not always what we wanted to eat (especially for me since I'm lowish carb), but good wholesome stuff to keep growing kids healthy and obnoxious.
I do think the stories and mindset have been passed down for sure. Every time there's a snow forecast, everybody goes bonkers!
It's really not that much snow, people. Buying up all the bread and milk and such....Lord!
There's something else at play here too though. Unfortunately for rural folk, so many of us are still struggling and living paycheck to paycheck so they can't afford to build up a pantry, and they were having to do without often. We already had a bustling food bank for this population in the Before Times. There are summer food delivery programs to fed a lot of kids when they weren't getting food from school. There's even an on-going charity that sends kids home care-packages of food for the weekends. Food insecurity is a huge issue here and has been. Then the exact people who didn't need to be losing their work got hit by the shutdown. I think that's a legit reason to feel quite a bit of panic for some folk when they already were barely making it.
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baconslave wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »Chef_Barbell wrote: »I remember when this thread was toilet paper and eating cat food 😂😜
And I still can't understand the toilet paper issue. Was never a problem where I live.
People were just buying up all the TP as soon as it got to stores, so many of us never could find any because others bought it before we had a chance.
Fortunately, I have a ton of leftovwr turkey because I got an almost 20 lb. turkey for Thanksgiving and live alone. Granted, I don't eat plants, but this is several days worth of food by itself.
While TP is still on the shelves at our Walmart currently this past summer it was overflowing and we restocked well so we'll be fine since we just replace as we use it.
As a kid in the 50's I remember dad going to town in the old Pickup and load it up with can goods, sugar, flour, 25 pound tin of hog lard and TP for the winter. Still today we only buy mainly 24-48 roll packs.
I think the mindset in rural America is still impacted by Great Depression and 1918 Spanish Flu pandemic because we heard those stories from our parents and grandparents. We don't hoard but we do stock up for potential hard times.
This is a good point. My grandparents were depression-era kids and they keep and hoard absolutely everything from magazines to plastic containers (and glass, of course). In fact, I have seen them rinse and re-use paper cups from fast food for days on end. My grandpa died in April and my grandma is in a nursing home now. I've not been in the house they lived in for decades, but I don't think either of them have been there for a long time either. It's in such poor condition, in part due to their hoarding, that it hasn't been livable for years. As they got old and couldn't climb over all their stuff, they became more and more restricted about what part of the house they could even go to. I know they haven't gone upstairs for years... and it is probably a good thing because last time I was there (2011), there was so much stuff in the 2nd floor that the ceiling on the main floor was visibly bowing.
Of course, not everyone in their generation is at that level of hoarding. Nonetheless, there is definitely a habit within older American generations to obtain items that could be useful and keep anything that might have some purpose at some point.
Can confirm. My grandmother was an Oakie who traveled from Oklahoma to Cali during the Depression and ended up helping pick strawberries in fields to help support her family. Her pantries were always full to bursting and her garage was full. She hoarded everything and even though Grandfather ended up doing well financially, they even hoarded their wealth and lived thriftily day-to-day.
Similarly, Hubby and I grew up poor in Appalachia. As soon as we clawed our way into middle class, Hubs learned the lessons of his Depression era grandparents, whom he was close to, and his experience being below the poverty level and began to systematically build up a nice stockpile and freezer and kept it up over the years. We were sitting very well during the TP and the food shortages in the spring. Not always what we wanted to eat (especially for me since I'm lowish carb), but good wholesome stuff to keep growing kids healthy and obnoxious.
I do think the stories and mindset have been passed down for sure. Every time there's a snow forecast, everybody goes bonkers! It's really not that much snow, people. Buying up all the bread and milk and such....Lord!
There's something else at play here too though. Unfortunately for rural folk, so many of us are still struggling and living paycheck to paycheck so they can't afford to build up a pantry, and they were having to do without often. We already had a bustling food bank for this population in the Before Times. There are summer food delivery programs to fed a lot of kids when they weren't getting food from school. There's even an on-going charity that sends kids home care-packages of food for the weekends. Food insecurity is a huge issue here and has been. Then the exact people who didn't need to be losing their work got hit by the shutdown. I think that's a legit reason to feel quite a bit of panic for some folk when they already were barely making it.
Not just rural folks. There is food insecurity in the cities too. And panic buying as a result.10 -
Chef_Barbell wrote: »baconslave wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »Chef_Barbell wrote: »I remember when this thread was toilet paper and eating cat food 😂😜
And I still can't understand the toilet paper issue. Was never a problem where I live.
People were just buying up all the TP as soon as it got to stores, so many of us never could find any because others bought it before we had a chance.
Fortunately, I have a ton of leftovwr turkey because I got an almost 20 lb. turkey for Thanksgiving and live alone. Granted, I don't eat plants, but this is several days worth of food by itself.
While TP is still on the shelves at our Walmart currently this past summer it was overflowing and we restocked well so we'll be fine since we just replace as we use it.
As a kid in the 50's I remember dad going to town in the old Pickup and load it up with can goods, sugar, flour, 25 pound tin of hog lard and TP for the winter. Still today we only buy mainly 24-48 roll packs.
I think the mindset in rural America is still impacted by Great Depression and 1918 Spanish Flu pandemic because we heard those stories from our parents and grandparents. We don't hoard but we do stock up for potential hard times.
This is a good point. My grandparents were depression-era kids and they keep and hoard absolutely everything from magazines to plastic containers (and glass, of course). In fact, I have seen them rinse and re-use paper cups from fast food for days on end. My grandpa died in April and my grandma is in a nursing home now. I've not been in the house they lived in for decades, but I don't think either of them have been there for a long time either. It's in such poor condition, in part due to their hoarding, that it hasn't been livable for years. As they got old and couldn't climb over all their stuff, they became more and more restricted about what part of the house they could even go to. I know they haven't gone upstairs for years... and it is probably a good thing because last time I was there (2011), there was so much stuff in the 2nd floor that the ceiling on the main floor was visibly bowing.
Of course, not everyone in their generation is at that level of hoarding. Nonetheless, there is definitely a habit within older American generations to obtain items that could be useful and keep anything that might have some purpose at some point.
Can confirm. My grandmother was an Oakie who traveled from Oklahoma to Cali during the Depression and ended up helping pick strawberries in fields to help support her family. Her pantries were always full to bursting and her garage was full. She hoarded everything and even though Grandfather ended up doing well financially, they even hoarded their wealth and lived thriftily day-to-day.
Similarly, Hubby and I grew up poor in Appalachia. As soon as we clawed our way into middle class, Hubs learned the lessons of his Depression era grandparents, whom he was close to, and his experience being below the poverty level and began to systematically build up a nice stockpile and freezer and kept it up over the years. We were sitting very well during the TP and the food shortages in the spring. Not always what we wanted to eat (especially for me since I'm lowish carb), but good wholesome stuff to keep growing kids healthy and obnoxious.
I do think the stories and mindset have been passed down for sure. Every time there's a snow forecast, everybody goes bonkers! It's really not that much snow, people. Buying up all the bread and milk and such....Lord!
There's something else at play here too though. Unfortunately for rural folk, so many of us are still struggling and living paycheck to paycheck so they can't afford to build up a pantry, and they were having to do without often. We already had a bustling food bank for this population in the Before Times. There are summer food delivery programs to fed a lot of kids when they weren't getting food from school. There's even an on-going charity that sends kids home care-packages of food for the weekends. Food insecurity is a huge issue here and has been. Then the exact people who didn't need to be losing their work got hit by the shutdown. I think that's a legit reason to feel quite a bit of panic for some folk when they already were barely making it.
Not just rural folks. There is food insecurity in the cities too. And panic buying as a result.
Right! The convo may have been about us rural weirdos, but this is def a huge "All-American" issue everywhere.
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baconslave wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »Chef_Barbell wrote: »I remember when this thread was toilet paper and eating cat food 😂😜
And I still can't understand the toilet paper issue. Was never a problem where I live.
People were just buying up all the TP as soon as it got to stores, so many of us never could find any because others bought it before we had a chance.
Fortunately, I have a ton of leftovwr turkey because I got an almost 20 lb. turkey for Thanksgiving and live alone. Granted, I don't eat plants, but this is several days worth of food by itself.
While TP is still on the shelves at our Walmart currently this past summer it was overflowing and we restocked well so we'll be fine since we just replace as we use it.
As a kid in the 50's I remember dad going to town in the old Pickup and load it up with can goods, sugar, flour, 25 pound tin of hog lard and TP for the winter. Still today we only buy mainly 24-48 roll packs.
I think the mindset in rural America is still impacted by Great Depression and 1918 Spanish Flu pandemic because we heard those stories from our parents and grandparents. We don't hoard but we do stock up for potential hard times.
This is a good point. My grandparents were depression-era kids and they keep and hoard absolutely everything from magazines to plastic containers (and glass, of course). In fact, I have seen them rinse and re-use paper cups from fast food for days on end. My grandpa died in April and my grandma is in a nursing home now. I've not been in the house they lived in for decades, but I don't think either of them have been there for a long time either. It's in such poor condition, in part due to their hoarding, that it hasn't been livable for years. As they got old and couldn't climb over all their stuff, they became more and more restricted about what part of the house they could even go to. I know they haven't gone upstairs for years... and it is probably a good thing because last time I was there (2011), there was so much stuff in the 2nd floor that the ceiling on the main floor was visibly bowing.
Of course, not everyone in their generation is at that level of hoarding. Nonetheless, there is definitely a habit within older American generations to obtain items that could be useful and keep anything that might have some purpose at some point.
Can confirm. My grandmother was an Oakie who traveled from Oklahoma to Cali during the Depression and ended up helping pick strawberries in fields to help support her family. Her pantries were always full to bursting and her garage was full. She hoarded everything and even though Grandfather ended up doing well financially, they even hoarded their wealth and lived thriftily day-to-day.
Similarly, Hubby and I grew up poor in Appalachia. As soon as we clawed our way into middle class, Hubs learned the lessons of his Depression era grandparents, whom he was close to, and his experience being below the poverty level and began to systematically build up a nice stockpile and freezer and kept it up over the years. We were sitting very well during the TP and the food shortages in the spring. Not always what we wanted to eat (especially for me since I'm lowish carb), but good wholesome stuff to keep growing kids healthy and obnoxious.
I do think the stories and mindset have been passed down for sure. Every time there's a snow forecast, everybody goes bonkers! It's really not that much snow, people. Buying up all the bread and milk and such....Lord!
There's something else at play here too though. Unfortunately for rural folk, so many of us are still struggling and living paycheck to paycheck so they can't afford to build up a pantry, and they were having to do without often. We already had a bustling food bank for this population in the Before Times. There are summer food delivery programs to fed a lot of kids when they weren't getting food from school. There's even an on-going charity that sends kids home care-packages of food for the weekends. Food insecurity is a huge issue here and has been. Then the exact people who didn't need to be losing their work got hit by the shutdown. I think that's a legit reason to feel quite a bit of panic for some folk when they already were barely making it.
I had a chest freezer when I owned a house in Iowa, but left that with the house along with other appliance since I was going to renting here in Tennessee. There, I would often buy large quantities of meat when it was on sale and then not when it wasn't on sale. I also would hunt / fish and have a little bit of food from that. But here, I just have the apartment-provided refrigerator/freezer and can keep a few weeks of food on hand. The limit is more in the freezer size because as a carnivore, I can only keep so much of the food I eat in the refrigerator without it going bad. If I fill up the refrigerator with meat, most of that meat will not last long enough to eat. It would be better to have a small refrigerator on top of a large freezer.5 -
T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »GaleHawkins wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »Chef_Barbell wrote: »I remember when this thread was toilet paper and eating cat food 😂😜
And I still can't understand the toilet paper issue. Was never a problem where I live.
People were just buying up all the TP as soon as it got to stores, so many of us never could find any because others bought it before we had a chance.
Fortunately, I have a ton of leftovwr turkey because I got an almost 20 lb. turkey for Thanksgiving and live alone. Granted, I don't eat plants, but this is several days worth of food by itself.
While TP is still on the shelves at our Walmart currently this past summer it was overflowing and we restocked well so we'll be fine since we just replace as we use it.
As a kid in the 50's I remember dad going to town in the old Pickup and load it up with can goods, sugar, flour, 25 pound tin of hog lard and TP for the winter. Still today we only buy mainly 24-48 roll packs.
I think the mindset in rural America is still impacted by Great Depression and 1918 Spanish Flu pandemic because we heard those stories from our parents and grandparents. We don't hoard but we do stock up for potential hard times.
This is a good point. My grandparents were depression-era kids and they keep and hoard absolutely everything from magazines to plastic containers (and glass, of course). In fact, I have seen them rinse and re-use paper cups from fast food for days on end. My grandpa died in April and my grandma is in a nursing home now. I've not been in the house they lived in for decades, but I don't think either of them have been there for a long time either. It's in such poor condition, in part due to their hoarding, that it hasn't been livable for years. As they got old and couldn't climb over all their stuff, they became more and more restricted about what part of the house they could even go to. I know they haven't gone upstairs for years... and it is probably a good thing because last time I was there (2011), there was so much stuff in the 2nd floor that the ceiling on the main floor was visibly bowing.
Of course, not everyone in their generation is at that level of hoarding. Nonetheless, there is definitely a habit within older American generations to obtain items that could be useful and keep anything that might have some purpose at some point.
I see a similar mindset in my father, who was a young child during WWII in Britain. Even after the war, rationing and shortages persisted for quite some time. Fortunately it has also made him very compliant with regard to government authority and restrictions during emergency situations so he hasn't balked at being housebound since March. But this is a man who grew up with blackouts and air raids and running to bomb shelters in the middle of the night so "stay at home to stay safe" is a walk in the park for him.24 -
My OH and I are among these 13 million:
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/06/13-million-people-could-lose-unemployment-benefits-by-end-of-december.html
More than 13 million people could lose their unemployment benefits at the end of December20 -
I heard on NPR that there is a concern that decreases in cases will result because of holiday testing and lab closures. The expectation is that there will be a temporary decrease in new cases reported and some may incorrectly see that as a sign that the spread is decreasing.5
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This seemed like a good pretty-short summary of what we know about Covid immunity, reinfection, whether immunity lasts, whether vaccine immunity and post-disease immunity behave in the same way - lots of questions I've seen along the way in this thread. (Twelve minutes of audio, or there's a transcript.)
https://www.sciencefriday.com/segments/covid-reinfection/4 -
T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »I heard on NPR that there is a concern that decreases in cases will result because of holiday testing and lab closures. The expectation is that there will be a temporary decrease in new cases reported and some may incorrectly see that as a sign that the spread is decreasing.
Yeah, the main source I follow for results in my state does a good job of specifying when holidays/backlogs are potentially impacting the results, but that's a level of nuance that probably isn't clear from every source.6 -
janejellyroll wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »I heard on NPR that there is a concern that decreases in cases will result because of holiday testing and lab closures. The expectation is that there will be a temporary decrease in new cases reported and some may incorrectly see that as a sign that the spread is decreasing.
Yeah, the main source I follow for results in my state does a good job of specifying when holidays/backlogs are potentially impacting the results, but that's a level of nuance that probably isn't clear from every source.
I hope I’m wrong, but it may become a moot point when the real numbers start coming in, in the next few days and weeks.
Interesting story on CBS Sunday Morning News yesterday. It featured the virus and vaccine. How special containers are being built to keep it cold and how UPS, and Fed Ex, are gearing up to handle the shipping once approval by the FDA is made. I wonder how that’s going to affect, or if it even will affect, delivery of all the on line shopping deliveries. It’s cyber Monday. We may want to get our shopping done ASAP. I ordered some things from Bath and Bodyworks last week, and they said due to high volumes, shipments may be delayed, just from more on line shopping.0 -
missysippy930 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »I heard on NPR that there is a concern that decreases in cases will result because of holiday testing and lab closures. The expectation is that there will be a temporary decrease in new cases reported and some may incorrectly see that as a sign that the spread is decreasing.
Yeah, the main source I follow for results in my state does a good job of specifying when holidays/backlogs are potentially impacting the results, but that's a level of nuance that probably isn't clear from every source.
I hope I’m wrong, but it may become a moot point when the real numbers start coming in, in the next few days and weeks.
Interesting story on CBS Sunday Morning News yesterday. It featured the virus and vaccine. How special containers are being built to keep it cold and how UPS, and Fed Ex, are gearing up to handle the shipping once approval by the FDA is made. I wonder how that’s going to affect, or if it even will affect, delivery of all the on line shopping deliveries. It’s cyber Monday. We may want to get our shopping done ASAP. I ordered some things from Bath and Bodyworks last week, and they said due to high volumes, shipments may be delayed, just from more on line shopping.
Many shippers have contractual obligations with major online retailers - that is, they've already committed what they need to ship to meet projected holiday shopping needs. That said, if people are ordering ABOVE that amount (and it looks like that could be a real possibility due to the reduction in in-person shopping this year), wait times will absolutely be a possibility. Complicating factors: I'm sure not every retailer did a great job of predicting what their volume needs would be and this is all assuming both retailers and shipping companies doing have serious staffing impacts due to a post-Thanksgiving spike in Covid.
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kshama2001 wrote: »My OH and I are among these 13 million:
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/06/13-million-people-could-lose-unemployment-benefits-by-end-of-december.html
More than 13 million people could lose their unemployment benefits at the end of December
Same here.12 -
gesundundmunter wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »My OH and I are among these 13 million:
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/06/13-million-people-could-lose-unemployment-benefits-by-end-of-december.html
More than 13 million people could lose their unemployment benefits at the end of December
Same here.
Thankfully I was only off work for half the maximum unemployment benefit period.4 -
I found this article quite thought-provoking, but will admit that I didn't yet read the underlying study, and the article has some markers that would usually make me question whether it's a fair/full interpretation of the study per se:
https://www.princeton.edu/news/2020/09/30/largest-covid-19-contact-tracing-study-date-finds-children-key-spread-evidence
It reports on ". . . the largest contact tracing study . . . conducted in the world for any disease."
Provocative bit, IMO, not unexpected: " . . . 71% of infected individuals did not infect any of their contacts, while a mere 8% of infected individuals accounted for 60% of new infections."2 -
missysippy930 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »I heard on NPR that there is a concern that decreases in cases will result because of holiday testing and lab closures. The expectation is that there will be a temporary decrease in new cases reported and some may incorrectly see that as a sign that the spread is decreasing.
Yeah, the main source I follow for results in my state does a good job of specifying when holidays/backlogs are potentially impacting the results, but that's a level of nuance that probably isn't clear from every source.
I hope I’m wrong, but it may become a moot point when the real numbers start coming in, in the next few days and weeks.
Interesting story on CBS Sunday Morning News yesterday. It featured the virus and vaccine. How special containers are being built to keep it cold and how UPS, and Fed Ex, are gearing up to handle the shipping once approval by the FDA is made. I wonder how that’s going to affect, or if it even will affect, delivery of all the on line shopping deliveries. It’s cyber Monday. We may want to get our shopping done ASAP. I ordered some things from Bath and Bodyworks last week, and they said due to high volumes, shipments may be delayed, just from more on line shopping.
If late arrival of Christmas packages is the only downside, I think we shouldn't need to be too distressed about that. (Late delivery of things like prescription drugs is a different matter.)11 -
Check and gift cards are the best presents to give this year.
I am preparing a care package for my two kids and their families. It includes gift cards to the stores that they usually shop (they already sent me their choices), checks, disposable masks, disinfectant wipes, disinfectant gels, and coffee from Hawaii. All wrapped up in lots and lots of love
They can use the gift card to buy on line what ever they need, and the same with the checks, after the holidays or when things get better. I am not going inside the malls this year, just in-and-out to stores where I can get gift cards easily or I get the cards on line.10 -
I think the stress is hitting more people now. I don't know if it's due to election results, holiday/family stuff, possibly realizing the warnings about things getting bad this winter were true or maybe something else entirely. One formerly sensible poster on another forum has started screaming about the CDC plans to lock up vulnerable people (aka FEMA camps).
I can only imagine the meltdowns on facebook.8 -
I think the stress is hitting more people now. I don't know if it's due to election results, holiday/family stuff, possibly realizing the warnings about things getting bad this winter were true or maybe something else entirely. One formerly sensible poster on another forum has started screaming about the CDC plans to lock up vulnerable people (aka FEMA camps).
I can only imagine the meltdowns on facebook.
More people seem to be awaking to the realization that the physical, emotional and financial pain will be with many for decades to come with or without successful vaccines especially those without access to the internet and basic food needs.2 -
I found this article quite thought-provoking, but will admit that I didn't yet read the underlying study, and the article has some markers that would usually make me question whether it's a fair/full interpretation of the study per se:
https://www.princeton.edu/news/2020/09/30/largest-covid-19-contact-tracing-study-date-finds-children-key-spread-evidence
It reports on ". . . the largest contact tracing study . . . conducted in the world for any disease."
Provocative bit, IMO, not unexpected: " . . . 71% of infected individuals did not infect any of their contacts, while a mere 8% of infected individuals accounted for 60% of new infections."
And this is why I almost run from the little superspeaders without masks in the grocery store. Unless they were my kids, never been a huge fan
Although I never met an animal I didn't instantly love.12 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »I found this article quite thought-provoking, but will admit that I didn't yet read the underlying study, and the article has some markers that would usually make me question whether it's a fair/full interpretation of the study per se:
https://www.princeton.edu/news/2020/09/30/largest-covid-19-contact-tracing-study-date-finds-children-key-spread-evidence
It reports on ". . . the largest contact tracing study . . . conducted in the world for any disease."
Provocative bit, IMO, not unexpected: " . . . 71% of infected individuals did not infect any of their contacts, while a mere 8% of infected individuals accounted for 60% of new infections."
And this is why I almost run from the little superspeaders without masks in the grocery store. Unless they were my kids, never been a huge fan
Although I never met an animal I didn't instantly love.
Any wonder why teachers are skidish about in person learning8 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »I found this article quite thought-provoking, but will admit that I didn't yet read the underlying study, and the article has some markers that would usually make me question whether it's a fair/full interpretation of the study per se:
https://www.princeton.edu/news/2020/09/30/largest-covid-19-contact-tracing-study-date-finds-children-key-spread-evidence
It reports on ". . . the largest contact tracing study . . . conducted in the world for any disease."
Provocative bit, IMO, not unexpected: " . . . 71% of infected individuals did not infect any of their contacts, while a mere 8% of infected individuals accounted for 60% of new infections."
And this is why I almost run from the little superspeaders without masks in the grocery store. Unless they were my kids, never been a huge fan
Although I never met an animal I didn't instantly love.
Having now read the actual article in Science**, it appears that the "little superspreaders" are significantly spreading within their own age cohort:. . . analyses stratified by case and contact age identified the highest probability of transmission, given exposure, within case-contact pairs of similar age (Fig. 2C and table S8). These patterns of enhanced transmission risk in similar-age pairs were strongest among children aged 0 to 14 years and among adults aged ≥65 years
So, keep breathing that tall air, and you may be OK. 😉
But, yes, I appreciate it when people mask their children in stores, and it will be a good way of acclimating them to the mask for the benefit of their age-mates in school or day care.
Departing from just replying to Mike, and going back to general comments about the article: I recommend reading it. There are some interesting nuggets of statistical specifics in there:Among decedents in the two Indian states, the most prevalent comorbid conditions were diabetes (45.0%), sustained hypertension (36.2%), coronary artery disease (12.3%), and renal disease (8.2%; table S9). Although prevalence of any comorbidity was highest among decedents at older ages, this pattern differed across conditions; diabetes was most prevalent among decedents aged 50 to 64 years, and liver disease and renal disease were most prevalent in fatal cases at ages 0 to 17 years and 18 to 29 years, respectively. At least one comorbid condition was noted among 62.5% of fatalities, in comparison to 22% of fatalities in the United States as of 30 May 2020 (34).
I'm sure I could find this out, still too lazy ATM, but it would be interesting to see if there's an effect of obese bodyweight per se, or if that's a risk factor as a result of being associated with the other conditions, if that could be teased out. Possibly not a variable available in the India data; dunno.. . . test-positive individuals identified through contact tracing were, on average, 1.3 years (bootstrap 95% confidence interval, 1.1 to 1.5 years) younger and 4.5% (3.7 to 5.4%) less likely to be male than the overall population of COVID-19 cases in the two states (table S4).
IOW, probable secondary cases tended to be slightly younger, and more female, than the person whose positive test triggered tracing.Assuming that test-positive contacts were infected by the index case to whom they were traced, we estimated that the overall secondary attack rate (or risk of transmission from an index case to an exposed contact) was 10.7% (10.5 to 10.9%) for high-risk contacts, who had close social contact or direct physical contact with index cases without protective measures, and 4.7% (4.6 to 4.8%) for low-risk contacts, who were in the proximity of index cases but did not meet these criteria for high-risk exposure (tables S6 and S7).
IOW, risky behavior has consequences . . . for other people, at least.
There's more, that's just a sampling.
** https://science.sciencemag.org/content/370/6517/6915 -
I think the stress is hitting more people now. I don't know if it's due to election results, holiday/family stuff, possibly realizing the warnings about things getting bad this winter were true or maybe something else entirely. One formerly sensible poster on another forum has started screaming about the CDC plans to lock up vulnerable people (aka FEMA camps).
I can only imagine the meltdowns on facebook.
For me, it hit hard when the second Dr. died of Corona in 2 months in our town of about 20,000.
You just kinda think a Dr. builds up some immunity To everything, so will be stronger against it.
Also, a Dr. knows how to fight sickness, and is surrounded by the medical community, nurses and other Docs who know
What to do and do it for one of their own.
If they can’t survive it, how can the common man hope to?17 -
corinasue1143 wrote: »I think the stress is hitting more people now. I don't know if it's due to election results, holiday/family stuff, possibly realizing the warnings about things getting bad this winter were true or maybe something else entirely. One formerly sensible poster on another forum has started screaming about the CDC plans to lock up vulnerable people (aka FEMA camps).
I can only imagine the meltdowns on facebook.
For me, it hit hard when the second Dr. died of Corona in 2 months in our town of about 20,000.
You just kinda think a Dr. builds up some immunity To everything, so will be stronger against it.
Also, a Dr. knows how to fight sickness, and is surrounded by the medical community, nurses and other Docs who know
What to do and do it for one of their own.
If they can’t survive it, how can the common man hope to?
I've mentioned this before. We've had PAGES of our newspapers dedicated to doctors dead of COVID since March. Their photos and names were there. So sad. Then there are the nurses. For Italians, they are heroes, and there are many murals painted on buildings in their honor.17 -
corinasue1143 wrote: »I think the stress is hitting more people now. I don't know if it's due to election results, holiday/family stuff, possibly realizing the warnings about things getting bad this winter were true or maybe something else entirely. One formerly sensible poster on another forum has started screaming about the CDC plans to lock up vulnerable people (aka FEMA camps).
I can only imagine the meltdowns on facebook.
For me, it hit hard when the second Dr. died of Corona in 2 months in our town of about 20,000.
You just kinda think a Dr. builds up some immunity To everything, so will be stronger against it.
Also, a Dr. knows how to fight sickness, and is surrounded by the medical community, nurses and other Docs who know
What to do and do it for one of their own.
If they can’t survive it, how can the common man hope to?
It's sad of course when anyone dies from Covid. Don't know if it's the situation for the 2 doctors in your community but nothing about being a medical professional prevents one from having comorbidities some of which could be reduced by lifestyle choices.7 -
Major easing of Covid restrictions in NSW.. 🙂
Dance floors are set to reopen in NSW, with caps also removed on weddings, funerals and religious events under a major easing of COVID restrictions.
From December 7, restrictions on the number of people allowed in hospitality venues, places of worship, stadiums, theatres will ease to only be the two-square metre rule.
Maximum capacity caps will be removed, subject to the rule, and will include weddings, funerals and corporate events
From Monday, 100 people can gather outside and up to 5000 people can gather for an outdoor event that is fenced, ticketed and seated.
Up to 3000 people can gather outside for organised events, subject to the two-square-metre rule.
Nightclubs and gyms will be subject to the four-square-rule, with a maximum of 50 people allowed in gym classes or on the dancefloor at nightclubs.
At pubs, people will still need to sit down inside but will be able to stand up at outdoor venues.
(Full list of eased restrictions)
Venues (including hospitality venues, retail and places of worship)
1 person per 2sqm
Stadiums and theatres
Outdoors: 100 per cent seated capacity, and 1 person per 2sqm rule for outdoor seating areasIndoors: 75 per cent seated capacity
Gatherings in outdoor public spaces
Up to 100 people for outdoor gatherings (increased from 50)Up to 5000 people for outdoor events that are fenced, ticketed and seated (subject to the 2sqm rule)Up to 3000 people for other organised outdoor events (subject to the 2sqm rule)
Dance floors
Up to 50 people indoors
Singing
Up to 50 performers indoors, no maximum cap outdoorsCongregation and audience advised to continue wearing masks if singing
Maximum capacity caps removed (subject to the 2sqm rule) for:
Bookings at hospitality venuesWeddingsFuneralsRegional agricultural showsCorporate eventsReligious events
25 days of no community transmission in NSW 👏16 -
Good news for you Slimgirljo!!! Stay safe and get social
I have a question, these places with limited capacity, such as stores....I went to a store that had a sign up saying 'only 71 people allowed'. But how do they get that number and who counts them?? There is no one in there tapping patrons on the head going 'ok, you're # 59, cone on in'. So are the signs merely another governmental mandate that's being ignored like the no mask-no entry signs?
And another thing that makes no sense to me is we're not allowed to cross the state border 15 minutes away to shop in a different small town BUT we can travel 80 miles to shop in our state's biggest city where Covid has killed many.
If I wanted to shop in that small town 15 minutes away, my dh would technically have to self-quarantine for 10-14 days.
SMH2 -
Good news for you Slimgirljo!!! Stay safe and get social
I have a question, these places with limited capacity, such as stores....I went to a store that had a sign up saying 'only 71 people allowed'. But how do they get that number and who counts them?? There is no one in there tapping patrons on the head going 'ok, you're # 59, cone on in'. So are the signs merely another governmental mandate that's being ignored like the no mask-no entry signs?
And another thing that makes no sense to me is we're not allowed to cross the state border 15 minutes away to shop in a different small town BUT we can travel 80 miles to shop in our state's biggest city where Covid has killed many. If I wanted to shop in that small town 15 minutes away, my dh would technically have to self-quarantine for 10-14 days.
SMH
Bigger stores here do have a person counting those coming in and out. Really small stores don't need that, since it's obvious (this is true for most of the little places in my neighborhood shopping district), and they often have their max numbers posted on the door. Some other places seem to have other means -- initially my local supermarket was trying to do it by requiring everyone to take a cart (and only one person per party), and having limited carts and someone handing them out and wiping off the handles, but this was a flop.
State borders aren't enforced from what I can see (not at all, and I don't think it's possible in the US), but if they were (and from the beginning) like in Australia, I think we'd be better off, so I don't consider that necessarily unreasonable as an idea. Your state has certain rules but if people come and go from states that are more lax (my state/area is near states that are more lax, which is part of why we have had a new spike where I am, IMO, even though we have the unenforceable quarantine rules), it does little good. It's true that in some cases traveling throughout a state can do the same thing, but it's even less possible to limit that (or require quarantine for going to another county). Some places outside of the US have recommended limiting travel to quite close around your house, but I don't think anywhere in the US has tried that (maybe NY?).3 -
Good news for you Slimgirljo!!! Stay safe and get social
I have a question, these places with limited capacity, such as stores....I went to a store that had a sign up saying 'only 71 people allowed'. But how do they get that number and who counts them?? There is no one in there tapping patrons on the head going 'ok, you're # 59, cone on in'. So are the signs merely another governmental mandate that's being ignored like the no mask-no entry signs?
And another thing that makes no sense to me is we're not allowed to cross the state border 15 minutes away to shop in a different small town BUT we can travel 80 miles to shop in our state's biggest city where Covid has killed many. If I wanted to shop in that small town 15 minutes away, my dh would technically have to self-quarantine for 10-14 days.
SMH
Bigger stores here do have a person counting those coming in and out. Really small stores don't need that, since it's obvious (this is true for most of the little places in my neighborhood shopping district), and they often have their max numbers posted on the door. Some other places seem to have other means -- initially my local supermarket was trying to do it by requiring everyone to take a cart (and only one person per party), and having limited carts and someone handing them out and wiping off the handles, but this was a flop.
State borders aren't enforced from what I can see (not at all, and I don't think it's possible in the US), but if they were (and from the beginning) like in Australia, I think we'd be better off, so I don't consider that necessarily unreasonable as an idea. Your state has certain rules but if people come and go from states that are more lax (my state/area is near states that are more lax, which is part of why we have had a new spike where I am, IMO, even though we have the unenforceable quarantine rules), it does little good. It's true that in some cases traveling throughout a state can do the same thing, but it's even less possible to limit that (or require quarantine for going to another county). Some places outside of the US have recommended limiting travel to quite close around your house, but I don't think anywhere in the US has tried that (maybe NY?).
Yeah most states have literally hundreds of roads connecting with neighboring states. Impossible to patrol all of them.4 -
Good news for you Slimgirljo!!! Stay safe and get social
I have a question, these places with limited capacity, such as stores....I went to a store that had a sign up saying 'only 71 people allowed'. But how do they get that number and who counts them?? There is no one in there tapping patrons on the head going 'ok, you're # 59, cone on in'. So are the signs merely another governmental mandate that's being ignored like the no mask-no entry signs?
And another thing that makes no sense to me is we're not allowed to cross the state border 15 minutes away to shop in a different small town BUT we can travel 80 miles to shop in our state's biggest city where Covid has killed many. If I wanted to shop in that small town 15 minutes away, my dh would technically have to self-quarantine for 10-14 days.
SMH
You are in NH, yes? Looks like visits to Maine, Vermont, Massachusetts, Connecticut, and Rhode Island are currently excluded from needing to quarantine.
https://www.covidguidance.nh.gov/out-state-visitors1
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