Coronavirus prep
Replies
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For the person who wondered why Type 1 diabetes is not on the list of predisposing conditions. Type 1 diabetics is an autoimmune condition. Something causes the immune system to mistakenly attack a persons pancreatic tissue, it similar way to thyroid antibodies attack the thyroid and in MS its the nerve coatings which are damaged by the immune system. The problem is a reaction to something which is a close match for the persons tissue, its called, molecule mimicry. It is not unheard of for a person with one autoimmune condition to acquire others.
Yes, but that doesn't mean we T1D's will be ok if we get Covid. Since SARS-COV-2 relies on glycosalation of ACE2 receptors to enter cells, I would argue that T1D's are at higher risk because we get a higher viral load entering our cells. That is, unless we have non-diabetic BG's. Outside of Dr. Bernstein, most T1D's do not have non-diabetic BG's. In fact, I don't eat plants in order to imprive glycemic control and my last HbA1C was still 6.2% (better than most T1D's, but still not even close to non-diabetic).7 -
I'm surprised autoimmune conditions aren't on that list.0
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"It's been 85 days since Queensland last recorded a COVID-19 case acquired in the community.
Thank you Queensland - keep it up!"
This was todays message from our Queensland Premiere. I really hope it stays that way since it looks like we won't start getting the vaccine till maybe March next year. It's wonderful so many Aussie though can visit family for Christmas now with so many boarders open interstate.
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I'm 38 and severely obese (BMI >50). Covid was my wake-up call. I always thought I had time to lose weight and get healthy. Unfortunately, it took Covid for me to realize how precious time was, and that I may not make it through the year because of my weight.
The past several months I've lost a lot of weight (avg. 3-4lbs a week lost) and have made dramatic changes to my diet. However, although it's possible to lose weight you can't do it overnight. My reality is I will likely remain "high-risk" for the duration of this pandemic, even though I will continue to do my best to lose weight. I wish now, I began this weight loss journey earlier. All I can do is look ahead, and continue to hope and pray my family and I continue to avoid catching this terrible virus.
I wish there were more positive testimonials of overweight people who have recovered from COVID because the news can make you feel that if you catch it and are obese you die. It's a scary reality some of us have to live with despite knowing we have to change.
I hope you all stay safe and healthy.37 -
@glp2323
Congratulations on your success to date. Keep doing what you’re doing to get healthier. It’s an amazing gift to yourself and loved ones👏🏻
Follow the guidelines for what you can do to lessen the likelihood of getting the virus. Face covering, social distancing, hand washing, avoiding social gatherings outside of those you live with.
Hoping for the best for all.8 -
I'm 38 and severely obese (BMI >50). Covid was my wake-up call. I always thought I had time to lose weight and get healthy. Unfortunately, it took Covid for me to realize how precious time was, and that I may not make it through the year because of my weight.
The past several months I've lost a lot of weight (avg. 3-4lbs a week lost) and have made dramatic changes to my diet. However, although it's possible to lose weight you can't do it overnight. My reality is I will likely remain "high-risk" for the duration of this pandemic, even though I will continue to do my best to lose weight. I wish now, I began this weight loss journey earlier. All I can do is look ahead, and continue to hope and pray my family and I continue to avoid catching this terrible virus.
I wish there were more positive testimonials of overweight people who have recovered from COVID because the news can make you feel that if you catch it and are obese you die. It's a scary reality some of us have to live with despite knowing we have to change.
I hope you all stay safe and healthy.
Thanks for sharing and best of success.
In time I am starting to understand how it is foolish for me to be slamming others for not being PC in this Pandemic because I only have control over me.11 -
Not that this is probably news to most here, but ICU capacity is running out in a lot of places. My county has 3 beds left according to the map, but that is 74% full since we only have 14 beds total.
Intensive Care Beds Are Nearing Capacity Across the Country, New Data Shows https://nyti.ms/3n51mZG
Edit to add that I don't know how good these numbers are. Some places have been including NICU beds in the total because they are an ICU bed... but that doesn't help us adults.4 -
Theoldguy1 wrote: »missysippy930 wrote: »Theoldguy1 wrote: »missysippy930 wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Theoldguy1 wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Theoldguy1 wrote: »Small rant on public health messages on Covid. We hear wear masks, distance, wash hands and those with comorbidities are more susceptible to complications from Covid.
Where is the messaging to take positive steps to reduce comorbidities? Lose weight, positive steps for better nutrition, etc.
My answer to that would be because simple messages hit home.
If one tries to have a message about, for example, getting regular pap smears - one doesnt throw in getting regular FOBT's and regular general check ups and vaccinations, and surgery is open x time to do it and the turn around time for results is x and if result is positive or negative, x is next step and other relevant but TLDR and now nobody is getting any message at all.
Simple poster: get a pap smear every 5 years.
Simple poster, "lose weight, reduce your chance of complications from Covid".
Yes if that is the main message you want to convey.
However it seems a secondary message to me..
If we want the message of masks, hand washing, social distancing hitting home, then dont muddy the waters with secondary messages.
Posters work better when simple and direct.
I totally agree❤️
And if you want a secondary message to resonate with people, don’t single, one comorbidity out. List them all. There’s a lot of risk factors that can cause severe cases of covid leading to death. Even if there is a high number of deaths among overweight people who have died from covid. It’s not the only preexisting factor, or the only preventable one.
Let’s not forget the survivors of covid who are suffering from neurological disorders, some from very mild cases of covid. Take into consideration long term affects from surviving covid may be appearing well into the future. No one knows for sure.
The single best preventative measure, face covering, social distancing, and hand washing. Most everyone can, and should, be complying with this.
Take the time to read this article about what caregivers in ICU units are going through. It’s heartbreaking.
https://apple.news/ArQx9d9CfSvKqfRyNx7DLtw
From the CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/need-extra-precautions/people-with-medical-conditions.html
"Adults of any age with the following conditions are at increased risk of severe illness from the virus that causes COVID-19:
Cancer
Chronic kidney disease
COPD (chronic obstructive pulmonary disease)
Heart conditions, such as heart failure, coronary artery disease, or cardiomyopathies
Immunocompromised state (weakened immune system) from solid organ transplant
Obesity (body mass index [BMI] of 30 kg/m2 or higher but < 40 kg/m2)
Severe Obesity (BMI ≥ 40 kg/m2)
Pregnancy
Sickle cell disease
Smoking
Type 2 diabetes mellitus"
Please review the list, the only factors one can directly control are obesity, smoking and pregnancy. Other than cancer and sickle cell anemia the other risk factors are all made more severe by obesity.
Never have I said that face coverings, distancing, etc. should be ignored or messaging reduced. My point is losing weight, quitting smoking and improving the nutritional content of one's diet are realistically the only things an individual can do to make the impact of the disease less severe if one should contract it. This fact should be publicized.
I'm well aware of the sufferings of our health care professionals ands pray for them daily. Wouldn't it be nice if there was messaging out there that working on obesity and quitting smoking would result in less serious cases and less load on the health care providers? Perhaps someone at the start of all this would have worked on weight loss and would be 50 pounds lighter they would be quarantining in home due to improved health rather than in an ICU bed if blunt messaging about the impact of obesity and smoking was out there early.
Or are we just concerned with misplaced political correctness?
Whose misplaced PC?
My husband is an essential worker. Six year cancer survivor with a slowly growing cancer at the sight of original cancer that was surgically removed. Being monitored at this time every three months for growth. Untreatable at the moment.
I’m well aware of the increased risks for people with existing conditions you so kindly pointed out to me.
Show a little compassion for others that aren’t able to live up to exalted standards others think they should be capable of overcoming.
Please wear face coverings and social distance. It’s not too much to ask.
Sorry for your family's issues. Of course wear masks and social distance, but also take steps that you personally can to make the impact of Covid less severe if one gets it.
Only problem is Covid doesn't feel real to someone until it becomes real for them. DH has tried to quit smoking so many times throughout his 69 years, it's unbelievable. His dad died from lung cancer; his mom had emphysema and lived with oxygen for many years. Even that hasn't made it real enough to him.
He *knows* the risks but he'll likely be caught in one of those scenarios eventually and only then think....why didn't I listen?
Sooo many people cannot do the change that hurtful habits need. Myself included. 16 -
I'm 38 and severely obese (BMI >50). Covid was my wake-up call. I always thought I had time to lose weight and get healthy. Unfortunately, it took Covid for me to realize how precious time was, and that I may not make it through the year because of my weight.
The past several months I've lost a lot of weight (avg. 3-4lbs a week lost) and have made dramatic changes to my diet. However, although it's possible to lose weight you can't do it overnight. My reality is I will likely remain "high-risk" for the duration of this pandemic, even though I will continue to do my best to lose weight. I wish now, I began this weight loss journey earlier. All I can do is look ahead, and continue to hope and pray my family and I continue to avoid catching this terrible virus.
I wish there were more positive testimonials of overweight people who have recovered from COVID because the news can make you feel that if you catch it and are obese you die. It's a scary reality some of us have to live with despite knowing we have to change.
I hope you all stay safe and healthy.
Kudos to you for making changes!!!
And I agree with you about the news being a bit more positive. But then maybe more people would feel it's nothing to be afraid of after all and go about their merry ways? IDK. I wish there was a way to put a positive spin on contracting it and doing better than you think you will, but I don't think this is a virus with any guarantees. Just wish it wasn't so scary and unknown Hopefully all that will change as we continue to learn, experience and find better treatments/vaccines. 3 -
Indiana update!
5,457 new cases
124 new deaths
14% positivity rate for all new tests
16 counties are now RED (the worst level we have)
My county is actually seeing improvement, but I doubt that will last once the Thanksgiving numbers really hit.
We have 20.9% of ICU beds available. 43.8% of beds in use are Covid related.
As for myself... I am trying to figure out how to tell my family that gathering for Christmas is a stupid idea and I am not going to risk myself and others to do so. It sucks. Do I WANT to be alone for Christmas? No. I struggle with the holidays as it is when it comes to my depression and being with my family helps me get through it. But I also don't want to die or be a part of something that could cause another person I love to die. I want to continue to be able to spend the holidays with my family... one year is not worth losing that. So I have no idea what to do. The logical part of my brain is saying stay away (which I KNOW is the right thing to do), but it is hard to drown out the emotional part that doesn't want to be alone. The fun that is anxiety and depression.15 -
The news here is that Tucson ran out of ICU beds. Been confirmed by several people that I know in the medical community. I guess it's just sending them out with drugs, oxygen and hoping for the best at this point.
Our population is very old here. The demographic in my "family friendly" neighborhood is average age of 65. You see kids but they aren't prevalent. And my area is young compared to Green Valley, South of Tucson.11 -
I’m really struck by the general tone of this thread. I don’t think people realize how hospitals and ICUs are run in general. I worked as an RN in a telemetry unit, which is a step down from ICU. Every single year during the flu season, the hospital filled up, as did the ICU. It was not unusual to people to come into the ER, and either have to wait 12-24 hours because there were no beds available or even the hospital would direct ambulances away, because they were full. There were many times when the ICU was full and so they would send the patient who needed to be in the ICU onto the telemetry unit with a ICU nurse to take care of them.
This was a normal occurrence in a city with a large number of hospitals.
They didn’t just send patients out on their own and say “Oh well!”.
I do get annoyed when I hear non medical people really freaking out about full hospitals and ICUs, as though this just shows this is the end of the world. This always happens every year. COVID is just highlighting the real problems with the system. Hospitals operate to maximize their profits. They don’t want empty beds sitting around. If there are too many for too long, they either cut staff or offer new services.
A real part of this problem is the way hospitals are run. They are operating on a knife’s edge for profit. Not once have I heard this being addressed. Even in normal times, RNs have a burnout time of about 2 years because they are so overworked. So when I hear people freaking out about how nurses are overworked, it’s nothing new.
Full hospitals and overworked nurses are not shocking things. Of course it’s worse than normal, but but definitely not shocking.18 -
gracegettingittogether wrote: »I’m really struck by the general tone of this thread. I don’t think people realize how hospitals and ICUs are run in general. I worked as an RN in a telemetry unit, which is a step down from ICU. Every single year during the flu season, the hospital filled up, as did the ICU. It was not unusual to people to come into the ER, and either have to wait 12-24 hours because there were no beds available or even the hospital would direct ambulances away, because they were full. There were many times when the ICU was full and so they would send the patient who needed to be in the ICU onto the telemetry unit with a ICU nurse to take care of them.
This was a normal occurrence in a city with a large number of hospitals.
They didn’t just send patients out on their own and say “Oh well!”.
I do get annoyed when I hear non medical people really freaking out about full hospitals and ICUs, as though this just shows this is the end of the world. This always happens every year. COVID is just highlighting the real problems with the system. Hospitals operate to maximize their profits. They don’t want empty beds sitting around. If there are too many for too long, they either cut staff or offer new services.
A real part of this problem is the way hospitals are run. They are operating on a knife’s edge for profit. Not once have I heard this being addressed. Even in normal times, RNs have a burnout time of about 2 years because they are so overworked. So when I hear people freaking out about how nurses are overworked, it’s nothing new.
Full hospitals and overworked nurses are not shocking things. Of course it’s worse than normal, but but definitely not shocking.
This is true... when my dad blew a heart valve his bed sat in a random storeroom off one side of the ER filled with stuff like extra catheters and other medical equipment for 8 hours while they tracked down a bed in a cardiac unit somewhere in the city - and that’s Memphis, a major medical center where we have more beds per person than most places in the country. When I had my ovarian torsion I ended up in a bed in a hallway for several hours because all rooms were full.
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gracegettingittogether wrote: »I’m really struck by the general tone of this thread. I don’t think people realize how hospitals and ICUs are run in general. I worked as an RN in a telemetry unit, which is a step down from ICU. Every single year during the flu season, the hospital filled up, as did the ICU. It was not unusual to people to come into the ER, and either have to wait 12-24 hours because there were no beds available or even the hospital would direct ambulances away, because they were full. There were many times when the ICU was full and so they would send the patient who needed to be in the ICU onto the telemetry unit with a ICU nurse to take care of them.
This was a normal occurrence in a city with a large number of hospitals.
They didn’t just send patients out on their own and say “Oh well!”.
I do get annoyed when I hear non medical people really freaking out about full hospitals and ICUs, as though this just shows this is the end of the world. This always happens every year. COVID is just highlighting the real problems with the system. Hospitals operate to maximize their profits. They don’t want empty beds sitting around. If there are too many for too long, they either cut staff or offer new services.
A real part of this problem is the way hospitals are run. They are operating on a knife’s edge for profit. Not once have I heard this being addressed. Even in normal times, RNs have a burnout time of about 2 years because they are so overworked. So when I hear people freaking out about how nurses are overworked, it’s nothing new.
Full hospitals and overworked nurses are not shocking things. Of course it’s worse than normal, but but definitely not shocking.
I appreciate the insight. The two points I disagree with are that this is nothing new. I have many nurses in the family as well and this is VERY new according to all of them and the one in ICU right now (my god daughter) would beg to differ. My other niece graduated in May and will not get a job in a hospital because her mom (my sis, another RN) told her she'd better not. This is nothing like any of them have ever seen.
The "razor thin margins" might be true for some rural hospitals, or independents, but this is the forecast from last year on HCA, one of the largest in the US. They were hardly going broke. I've been to Europe (and will continue to go) for elective surgeries. I pay 1/10th there for what I would pay there, have a nice vacation and have immensely better care. My wife had surgery in Belgium a few years back and was given a private room and 12 hours to recover (she could have stayed all night if she wanted with no charge). Here, they wheel you out unconscious (happened 3 times before with ACL surgeries for my wife and kids) -- ALL about profit here.
Your point on ICU beds, though, is appreciated.
https://www.modernhealthcare.com/finance/hca-revenue-beats-hospital-chains-expectations-2019#:~:text=The Nashville-based hospital chain's revenue rounded out 2019,end of its guidance, which was $9.75 billion.10 -
kshama2001 wrote: »AlexandraFindsHerself1971 wrote: »I think part of the reason that obesity gets so much blowback is that weight isn't simple. It's about our relationship with food and pleasure and there's often a whole lot of trauma there. If you can't or won't treat the trauma, then the weight loss won't happen...and if it does, you'll put that weight back on quick. I watched that with my ex. He went into the hospital and spent three months in an induced coma and lost 150 pounds. Another 50-75 pounds, and he would have been at normal weight. And his response? He ate constantly and put it all back on in six months. Because he still had deep unresolved trauma around food.
And of course there's the fact that if you quit smoking, you are an ex-smoker and your risks go down from day one. Wash your clothes, and you don't smell any more. Give it a week to sweat out of your system and no one will smell it in your body. But I've been eating very carefully to lose weight for nearly an entire year, and I'm still fat. I'm not as fat as I was, but I'm still objectively fat, not normal, not skinny. It may take me another whole year, since I can't go to the gym cause COVID, so I have to do it all with diet. And you have to exist as fat while you're losing, and it's not like there's a sign "Don't harass me for my weight, I lost two pounds last week and twenty total so far!" over your head as you walk around in daily life.
People have to get their heads to the right point to work on weight and their relationship with food, and where that is is highly individual. COVID may do it for some. If it does, that's great. Whatever works.
I get plenty of exercise but haven't belonged to a gym since I moved in 2016 and didn't care for any of the gyms here. If you are interested in getting tips for being able to exercise without a gym, you could start a new thread for this topic
Yeah, @AlexandraFindsHerself1971, it's do-able. I haven't had a gym membership since I was 17. Well over 2 decades ago. I have a space and have built up a collection of mats, videos (both purchased and streamed from YouTube), kettlebells, resistance bands, and adjustable dumbbells.5 -
What I meant by knife’s edge, is not that the hospitals are not doing well, but because they are so eager for profits, they want as few empty beds as possible, which causes problems even in normal times. I was working in a big city, btw.
And yes, I know that nurses are even more overworked. My point was that they always are, and now it’s worse. But it’s not like they aren’t overworked to begin with normally.
And now it’s worse.
Maybe, if they hadn’t been so overworked to begin with, it wouldn’t be as bad now. If hospitals hadn’t insisted on overloading RNs with patients in normal times, they would be better equipped to deal with unusual times.7 -
gracegettingittogether wrote: »I’m really struck by the general tone of this thread. I don’t think people realize how hospitals and ICUs are run in general. I worked as an RN in a telemetry unit, which is a step down from ICU. Every single year during the flu season, the hospital filled up, as did the ICU. It was not unusual to people to come into the ER, and either have to wait 12-24 hours because there were no beds available or even the hospital would direct ambulances away, because they were full. There were many times when the ICU was full and so they would send the patient who needed to be in the ICU onto the telemetry unit with a ICU nurse to take care of them.
This was a normal occurrence in a city with a large number of hospitals.
They didn’t just send patients out on their own and say “Oh well!”.
I do get annoyed when I hear non medical people really freaking out about full hospitals and ICUs, as though this just shows this is the end of the world. This always happens every year. COVID is just highlighting the real problems with the system. Hospitals operate to maximize their profits. They don’t want empty beds sitting around. If there are too many for too long, they either cut staff or offer new services.
A real part of this problem is the way hospitals are run. They are operating on a knife’s edge for profit. Not once have I heard this being addressed. Even in normal times, RNs have a burnout time of about 2 years because they are so overworked. So when I hear people freaking out about how nurses are overworked, it’s nothing new.
Full hospitals and overworked nurses are not shocking things. Of course it’s worse than normal, but but definitely not shocking.
I respect your experience in your city, but my mom is an NP at a major hospital system in Memphis and she's been working in hospitals for about twenty years. What she is seeing isn't normal flu season stuff. My brother-in-law is an ICU nurse at another hospital in Memphis, he's got about five years experience. What he is seeing isn't normal flu season stuff.
So while it may be normal to have a high occupancy rate in some areas, I think it's legitimate for people to be concerned about the current high occupancy rates given how many people are dying and how many people -- in some areas -- are being sent home or being given care that is less than ideal.
I do absolutely agree that we need to take better care of our nurses and think about health care access in terms beyond just profitability.
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A couple of worthwhile links:
https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20201208/will-decembers-covid-19-crush-overwhelm-hospitals
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/hospital-icus-running-space-due-covid-19-surges/story?id=74169792
Doesn't seem like things are at all normal.6 -
gracegettingittogether wrote: »I’m really struck by the general tone of this thread. I don’t think people realize how hospitals and ICUs are run in general. I worked as an RN in a telemetry unit, which is a step down from ICU. Every single year during the flu season, the hospital filled up, as did the ICU. It was not unusual to people to come into the ER, and either have to wait 12-24 hours because there were no beds available or even the hospital would direct ambulances away, because they were full. There were many times when the ICU was full and so they would send the patient who needed to be in the ICU onto the telemetry unit with a ICU nurse to take care of them.
This was a normal occurrence in a city with a large number of hospitals.
They didn’t just send patients out on their own and say “Oh well!”.
I do get annoyed when I hear non medical people really freaking out about full hospitals and ICUs, as though this just shows this is the end of the world. This always happens every year. COVID is just highlighting the real problems with the system. Hospitals operate to maximize their profits. They don’t want empty beds sitting around. If there are too many for too long, they either cut staff or offer new services.
A real part of this problem is the way hospitals are run. They are operating on a knife’s edge for profit. Not once have I heard this being addressed. Even in normal times, RNs have a burnout time of about 2 years because they are so overworked. So when I hear people freaking out about how nurses are overworked, it’s nothing new.
Full hospitals and overworked nurses are not shocking things. Of course it’s worse than normal, but but definitely not shocking.
Appreciate your perspective and I have no doubt that hospitals run normally at high capacity...but my step brother is an ICU nurse at one of the hospitals in Albuquerque and he says he's never seen anything like this and I've never seen him look so haggard in my life. He says that can't just park a patient somewhere waiting for a few hours for a bed to open up because no beds are going to open up because people aren't in there for a few days being treated...they're in there for weeks. He's never not been able to find a bed somewhere in the city and have to send a patient 4 hours away because a bed finally opened up in a rural hospital somewhere. I've also never seen hospital tents going up or freezer trucks on standby.17 -
I just typed a long response and it got lost.
I’m not sure why people are responding as though I said that Covid is normal, because I didn’t. I said it’s worse than than normal.
However it is true that hospitals are full and nurses are overworked every winter. Every winter, patients receive less than ideal care and are sent home too early because their bed is needed for someone else. Not every patient, but enough to make me quit nursing because of it.
COVID did not cause these problems in the healthcare system. They have existed for many years. I left nursing years ago because of them. What it has done, is magnify them.
Any significant new disease was bound to showcase these already existing problems. And it has. But they existed long before Covid reared its ugly head. The magnitude of these problems is concerning, but that these problems exist is not new.
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They are interviewing medical workers every day here. The plea is unanimous. They know how, and are protecting themselves, on the job, and are doing a fantastic job. There’s just too many covid patients. ICU’s and ER’s are being inundated with covid patients. They are pleading with the public to practice safety measures in public. Wear face coverings, social distancing etc.
They need us all to follow guidelines to lessen the spread.
I try to understand and accept others points of view, on this, but, it just doesn’t make sense.10 -
gracegettingittogether wrote: »I’m really struck by the general tone of this thread. I don’t think people realize how hospitals and ICUs are run in general. I worked as an RN in a telemetry unit, which is a step down from ICU. Every single year during the flu season, the hospital filled up, as did the ICU. It was not unusual to people to come into the ER, and either have to wait 12-24 hours because there were no beds available or even the hospital would direct ambulances away, because they were full. There were many times when the ICU was full and so they would send the patient who needed to be in the ICU onto the telemetry unit with a ICU nurse to take care of them.
This was a normal occurrence in a city with a large number of hospitals.
They didn’t just send patients out on their own and say “Oh well!”.
I do get annoyed when I hear non medical people really freaking out about full hospitals and ICUs, as though this just shows this is the end of the world. This always happens every year. COVID is just highlighting the real problems with the system. Hospitals operate to maximize their profits. They don’t want empty beds sitting around. If there are too many for too long, they either cut staff or offer new services.
A real part of this problem is the way hospitals are run. They are operating on a knife’s edge for profit. Not once have I heard this being addressed. Even in normal times, RNs have a burnout time of about 2 years because they are so overworked. So when I hear people freaking out about how nurses are overworked, it’s nothing new.
Full hospitals and overworked nurses are not shocking things. Of course it’s worse than normal, but but definitely not shocking.
Thanks for saying it so well3 -
gracegettingittogether wrote: »I’m really struck by the general tone of this thread. I don’t think people realize how hospitals and ICUs are run in general. I worked as an RN in a telemetry unit, which is a step down from ICU. Every single year during the flu season, the hospital filled up, as did the ICU. It was not unusual to people to come into the ER, and either have to wait 12-24 hours because there were no beds available or even the hospital would direct ambulances away, because they were full. There were many times when the ICU was full and so they would send the patient who needed to be in the ICU onto the telemetry unit with a ICU nurse to take care of them.
This was a normal occurrence in a city with a large number of hospitals.
They didn’t just send patients out on their own and say “Oh well!”.
I do get annoyed when I hear non medical people really freaking out about full hospitals and ICUs, as though this just shows this is the end of the world. This always happens every year. COVID is just highlighting the real problems with the system. Hospitals operate to maximize their profits. They don’t want empty beds sitting around. If there are too many for too long, they either cut staff or offer new services.
A real part of this problem is the way hospitals are run. They are operating on a knife’s edge for profit. Not once have I heard this being addressed. Even in normal times, RNs have a burnout time of about 2 years because they are so overworked. So when I hear people freaking out about how nurses are overworked, it’s nothing new.
Full hospitals and overworked nurses are not shocking things. Of course it’s worse than normal, but but definitely not shocking.
Thanks for that input. I think the fact that the flu season is just getting started in the US makes this especially worrisome, for both patients and healthcare workers. I have a number of students who work in healthcare, and I know the demands can be overwhelming.3 -
Absolutely! That’s my point. It’s not that Covid is not overwhelming, but that healthcare in normal times is overwhelming.
Case in point, I used to pray desperately every time I walked into the hospital for a shift that I wouldn’t kill someone by missing something because I was so rushed. I never did, and was told by multiple physicians and nurses that I was a good nurse, but it was so easy to have done, plus I saw so much suffering, physical and mental that I knew I could alleviate but I simply didn’t have time, although I never took a full lunch break and certainly never shorter breaks.
Even a smaller increase of patients would overwhelm such a system, much less something like Covid.7 -
gracegettingittogether wrote: »I just typed a long response and it got lost.
I’m not sure why people are responding as though I said that Covid is normal, because I didn’t. I said it’s worse than than normal.
However it is true that hospitals are full and nurses are overworked every winter. Every winter, patients receive less than ideal care and are sent home too early because their bed is needed for someone else. Not every patient, but enough to make me quit nursing because of it.
COVID did not cause these problems in the healthcare system. They have existed for many years. I left nursing years ago because of them. What it has done, is magnify them.
Any significant new disease was bound to showcase these already existing problems. And it has. But they existed long before Covid reared its ugly head. The magnitude of these problems is concerning, but that these problems exist is not new.
I don't think anyone was arguing that our (US) health care system was great and Covid wrecked it. What I think most would acknowledge is that our system was not prepared for a crisis and was already failing a lot of people.8 -
gracegettingittogether wrote: »Absolutely! That’s my point. It’s not that Covid is not overwhelming, but that healthcare in normal times is overwhelming.
Case in point, I used to pray desperately every time I walked into the hospital for a shift that I wouldn’t kill someone by missing something because I was so rushed. I never did, and was told by multiple physicians and nurses that I was a good nurse, but it was so easy to have done, plus I saw so much suffering, physical and mental that I knew I could alleviate but I simply didn’t have time, although I never took a full lunch break and certainly never shorter breaks.
Even a smaller increase of patients would overwhelm such a system, much less something like Covid.
OK, now I think I understand where you're coming from, and that makes sense.
I read your initial post (rather casually, probably, I admit), and thought you were saying "this is no big deal, it happens regularly", which is something a lot of non-medical people around me seem to be saying to minimize the seriousness of the situation. From replies, I suspect some others read it the same way.
Since you've clarified, it sounds more like "our health system was already bursting at the seams during local peaks, so that's not a new thing". That makes sense.
I'm not an expert, but one current thing that does seem somewhat novel to me is that so many hospitals in so many places are simultaneously peaking capacity with Covid patients, so that some of the usual-times safety valves (inter-hospital transfers, deferring non-crisis procedures, etc.) aren't working. I have read about specific hospitals/systems sending people home with oxygen, people whom they'd normally admit, though I have no direct personal knowledge to confirm the reports.
I can't even begin to imagine how difficult and stressful your job is during *normal* circumstances. I've been in hospitals (as a patient or family caregiver) in the past more than I'd like to have needed to be, including in ICUs, and it's been clear that the nursing staff is overworked and distracted, despite being kind, energetic, and dedicated people, i.e., that there is understaffing. Adding peak loads, with a challenging still-novel illness . . . mega unimaginable.
Sending gratitude, and beaming strength-rays from my safe perch on the couch.
8 -
I am on a COVID taskforce committee and at our last conference call, the hospitals said that they expect a peak starting today and into the first part of next week. They can't take anymore patients, so they will have to resort to treating them in the hallway once they are brought by ambulance with oxygen or whatever therapy to help them breathe, then they will have to be transported back home and hope they don't get any worse. The concern with the city is that it will create 2 ambulance calls per patient, one to take them to the hospital, then go back hours later to pick them up after they have had treatment to bring them home. Scary.13
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So for a while we were saying that the death rates were declining because we were understanding how to treat this better. The death rates seem to be climbing like crazy. Why are the treatments not working or are there just that many more people that are sick?3
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SummerSkier wrote: »So for a while we were saying that the death rates were declining because we were understanding how to treat this better. The death rates seem to be climbing like crazy. Why are the treatments not working or are there just that many more people that are sick?
My understanding: It's that so many more people are sick.
The morality rate (the chance of dying if you get it) is going down, while the deaths caused by Covid (the number of people actually dying) aren't connected in a pure way. The morality rate can go down, but if your infection rate is skyrocketing your deaths will still go up.
Better treatment and prevention should be happening together, but many seem to have given up completely on the second part.9 -
I read your initial post (rather casually, probably, I admit), and thought you were saying "this is no big deal, it happens regularly", which is something a lot of non-medical people around me seem to be saying to minimize the seriousness of the situation. From replies, I suspect some others read it the same way.
Yes, I did, especially since I recalled some earlier posts about how we were overreacting to covid with the shutdowns (long after pretty much everything seemed to have reopened, for the most part), so read it in that light.
Glad I was wrong.Since you've clarified, it sounds more like "our health system was already bursting at the seams during local peaks, so that's not a new thing". That makes sense.
Agreed, although what I've read suggests things are significantly worse and patients who otherwise would get care are potentially not going to be able to get it in a new way, some places, so I do think that aspect is a new or different thing from how it normally is.I'm not an expert, but one current thing that does seem somewhat novel to me is that so many hospitals in so many places are simultaneously peaking capacity with Covid patients, so that some of the usual-times safety valves (inter-hospital transfers, deferring non-crisis procedures, etc.) aren't working. I have read about specific hospitals/systems sending people home with oxygen, people whom they'd normally admit, though I have no direct personal knowledge to confirm the reports.
Yes, this.1
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