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Height-ism?
Replies
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janejellyroll wrote: »psychod787 wrote: »SuzySunshine99 wrote: »I think it's actually good to know up front if someone is that shallow...it saves everyone from wasting their time.
So true. Just swipe past all those folks.
I was married before online dating became the big thing it it now. Do people not meet through friends, at parties, through shared hobbies/interests any longer?
Not in the age of COVID.
And even before COVID, I live in rural Appalachia. Single women my age are generally pillbillies, Pentecostal, or otherwise tragic in some way.
Dating during Covid19 hasn't been that bad. When I put on my mask, I go from a 4 to a solid 6... lol
Mine will have to read... must be able to deal with a slightly neurotic, always moving, never missed a gym date, routines, mad man..... so, a Pentecostal might fit the bill... lol
I used to live in an area with a lot of Pentecostal woman and I went to a gym where many of them were members. Talk about consistency! They lifted pretty heavy too. They were lifting in ankle-length skirts, but they were there rain or shine. I would be over in the corner with my baby weights while they took care of business.
Long dress and deadlifts... hmmmm...🥰3 -
When a man keeps his eye on what matters most, everything is possible for him. The world needs more men like you. ^^
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Onedaywriter wrote: »People like what they like.
My daughter for example is pretty tall and occasionally wears heels when “dressing up.” She definitely prefers men who are taller because being with less tall men makes her feel awkwardly tall. I’ve seen her change shoes like ten times before going out because she likes the higher ones but then she feels goofy when wearing them. In her case it’s more about the way she feels about herself.
My mom used to joke that it’s just as easy to fall in love with a rich girl as a poor girl. Of course- that didn’t happen lol!!
THIS!!!
The tall women I know do prefer taller men, not because they're more attracted to them, but because they feel awkward themselves when they're taller than their partner. Throws back to tradition, I guess - you know, man should be bigger/stronger/faster than woman (not saying I agree with this, just that it's a subconscious thing that's kind of hard-wired into a lot of people). Whatever it is, they're not going to make themselves feel awkward on a date if they can help it.
For me, a non-issue since I'm 5'3" there's not a whole lot of men who are shorter than me! Yet I ended up with a 6'4" husband, so go figure. At one year old, my son was over half my height and now he's almost two and at my navel already. Safe to say he's got his father's genes I think!6 -
I was having a bad day when I made this topic! Forgive my childishness!
FWIW, I'm nearing 41and have, essentially, never been on a date. And it's starting to wear on me ever so slightly. In the past few months, I've spent probably $500 on dating app memberships for the privilege of sending missives into the void.
Younger Zamphir definitely fell into the trap of "hurr durr women don't like nice guys, only a-holes" nonsense. I've outgrown that, thank God. I realize I'm the common denominator in my one-sided equation. I just can't figure out what's wrong with me.
I read this article recently from a guy who works in mental health or recovery in some capacity. He talks about a client named "Jerry" who is receiving court-ordered counseling for being an abusive alcoholic and poly-addict. Jerry has kids by 4 different women. He's never held down a job; he has a long criminal record; he's functionally illiterate; and in spite of all that he's never without someone who wants to have his next child. And the guy doing his intake is childless, single, and lonely, and he thinks, "I don't expect to have a supermodel on my arm. But I expect to be doing better than Jerry." And that's sort of how I feel sometimes.33 -
I was having a bad day when I made this topic! Forgive my childishness!
FWIW, I'm nearing 41and have, essentially, never been on a date. And it's starting to wear on me ever so slightly. In the past few months, I've spent probably $500 on dating app memberships for the privilege of sending missives into the void.
Younger Zamphir definitely fell into the trap of "hurr durr women don't like nice guys, only a-holes" nonsense. I've outgrown that, thank God. I realize I'm the common denominator in my one-sided equation. I just can't figure out what's wrong with me.
I read this article recently from a guy who works in mental health or recovery in some capacity. He talks about a client named "Jerry" who is receiving court-ordered counseling for being an abusive alcoholic and poly-addict. Jerry has kids by 4 different women. He's never held down a job; he has a long criminal record; he's functionally illiterate; and in spite of all that he's never without someone who wants to have his next child. And the guy doing his intake is childless, single, and lonely, and he thinks, "I don't expect to have a supermodel on my arm. But I expect to be doing better than Jerry." And that's sort of how I feel sometimes.
Based on your earlier description of single females in your area which I assume ( although I may be wrong) extends to many of the other residents, why don't you move?6 -
Exactly.janejellyroll wrote: »IMO, whatever a person prefers is what they prefer. If you don't fit that criteria, then why care? Isn't the idea of online dating finding the person that actually fits YOUR PREFERENCE anyway? Personally for me, I've stayed within or very close to my race because I've just seen too many issues with couples of different cultural backgrounds clash. I say this anecdotally of course, but over the years many of my clients open up to me about their relationships and the ones that were biracial couple seemed to have the most conflicts when it came to certain cultural values. Not saying that people shouldn't date outside of their race or culture, but for me, the less I have to worry about the better. Relationships are hard enough as it is with just trying to figure each other out emotionally.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Setting aside the issue of whether it is right or wrong to have certain preferences, the truth is that you're just wasting someone's time if you don't exercise pre-screening based on the factors you KNOW you want in a mate. And you're wasting your own time. I can have the stupidest, pettiest, most shallow, or bigoted expectations possible (this is not directed at any preferences expressed by people in this thread) but it doesn't matter because they're my preferences.
We can argue that I'm morally incorrect or have poor taste or don't truly understand what makes a relationship work or that I'm shallow, but that doesn't change the fact that I want to be with who I want to be with. Anyone who falls outside my criteria is likely just going to waste their time if they try to make me change my mind by dating me.
Short guys should be grateful that these women are upfront about what they want. They don't have to be grateful that so many women are writing them off, but they should be grateful that at least it's out in the open and they're not having to waste their time going on first dates with women who just won't be into them. Let's say a guy only wanted to date women with large breasts. I don't have to be grateful for the general social agreement that larger breasts are more desirable than small ones, but I would be grateful not to have my time wasted by dating someone who wasn't going to be truly attracted to me.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Lol, maybe you need to move.Theoldguy1 wrote: »SuzySunshine99 wrote: »I think it's actually good to know up front if someone is that shallow...it saves everyone from wasting their time.
So true. Just swipe past all those folks.
I was married before online dating became the big thing it it now. Do people not meet through friends, at parties, through shared hobbies/interests any longer?
Not in the age of COVID.
And even before COVID, I live in rural Appalachia. Single women my age are generally pillbillies, Pentecostal, or otherwise tragic in some way.
Surprised with this outlook you don't have women beating down your door to date you.
Maybe it wasn't clear, but I'm referring to single women around my age in my rural area. So it's not really an outlook so much as an observation.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition 3 -
#1 Men and women can sense neediness a mile away
#2 Work on your confidence and that comes from putting yourself out there. Consistently. Consistently. Consistently.
#3 It cannot be overstated. Be yourself.
"If "manners maketh man" as someone said
He's the hero of the day
It takes a man to suffer ignorance and smile
Be yourself no matter what they say
I don't take coffee, I take tea, my dear
I like my toast done on one side
And you can hear it in my accent when I talk
I'm an Englishman in New York
See me walking down Fifth Avenue
A walking cane here at my side
I take it everywhere I walk
I'm an Englishman in New York"
STING
Float like a butterfly and sting like a bee. If a man wants to meet a woman you've simply got to quit writing long lists of the attributes you'd like or positive confessions or using apps out of fear and desperation or talking about it.
Take ACTION.
Oooo, Desperado
Desperado
Why don't you come to your senses?
You've been out ridin' fences for so long now
Oh, you're a hard one
I know that you got your reasons
These things that are pleasin' you
Will hurt you somehow
Pick yourself UP and dust yourself off. So you're up for your first rodeo. Take the bull by the horns.
You better get on this bull and ride. Wring everything you can out of this life. Be kind. Stay sweet.
The girls will love you but you've got to put yourself out there.
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You're ASSUMING that just because they may be American that they DON'T carry their culture with them. WRONG.
At the risk of starting a "too hot for MFP" discussion...(...) Personally for me, I've stayed within or very close to my race because I've just seen too many issues with couples of different cultural backgrounds clash. I say this anecdotally of course, but over the years many of my clients open up to me about their relationships and the ones that were biracial couple seemed to have the most conflicts when it came to certain cultural values. Not saying that people shouldn't date outside of their race or culture, but for me, the less I have to worry about the better. Relationships are hard enough as it is with just trying to figure each other out emotionally.
Race and culture are really not synonymous. A Finn and a Spaniard would have much, MUCH less in common than two Americans of which one happens to be white and the other black.
Racial preferences are fine, but they're aesthetic IMO. No different from preferring a certain hair colour... or height.
We have many people who are born in American of say Asian decent, and I've seen MANY TIMES where they get involved or marry outside of their race and have issues because they STILL CARRY CULTURAL differences. Especially when it comes to the type of foods one desires to eat. My cousin loves to cook fried fish and other Filipino dishes she feeds to the kids and her husband really can't stand the food. And it's been a topic of argumentation because when she attends a party, HE DOESN'T come because he knows that all we'll really be eating is Filipino food.
And again, I deal with this with clientele as well. I mentioned they open up to me about. No reason for them to lie to me about. What's your actual experience in dealing with people when they may have to adhere to family cultural traditions even though born in the USA?
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition 6 -
When are you going to meet someone?
When you're ready to meet someone.
Fear is holding you back.3 -
(...) And again, I deal with this with clientele as well. I mentioned they open up to me about. No reason for them to lie to me about. What's your actual experience in dealing with people when they may have to adhere to family cultural traditions even though born in the USA?
My opinion comes from being an immigrant, having lived in multiple countries (among which the US) as an adult and having spent most of my career in a field where people frequently move around the world.
But in any case, that wasn't the point I was trying to make. I was only pointing out that race, i.e. appearance, doesn't tell you much about the person's culture.
ETA: but we're getting pretty far off-topic now
ETA 2: and to say something relevant to OP, don't sweat the height thing too much. I have a "type" too but have certainly dated girls that didn't conform to it. If she likes you, she likes you (and will probably think you're taller than you are if you're short because the halo effect is a thing).5 -
(...) And again, I deal with this with clientele as well. I mentioned they open up to me about. No reason for them to lie to me about. What's your actual experience in dealing with people when they may have to adhere to family cultural traditions even though born in the USA?
My opinion comes from being an immigrant, having lived in multiple countries (among which the US) as an adult and having spent most of my career in a field where people frequently move around the world (academia).
But in any case, that wasn't the point I was trying to make. I was only pointing out that race, i.e. appearance, doesn't tell you much about the person's culture.
Race is about way more than appearance. You can't compare it to hair color or height. People who don't want to date outside of their own race have reasons other than not liking the way someone's skin tone looks.
Racism and racial bias is real, and you really can't simplify it by saying it's just about appearance.11 -
I was having a bad day when I made this topic! Forgive my childishness!
FWIW, I'm nearing 41and have, essentially, never been on a date. And it's starting to wear on me ever so slightly. In the past few months, I've spent probably $500 on dating app memberships for the privilege of sending missives into the void.
Younger Zamphir definitely fell into the trap of "hurr durr women don't like nice guys, only a-holes" nonsense. I've outgrown that, thank God. I realize I'm the common denominator in my one-sided equation. I just can't figure out what's wrong with me.
I read this article recently from a guy who works in mental health or recovery in some capacity. He talks about a client named "Jerry" who is receiving court-ordered counseling for being an abusive alcoholic and poly-addict. Jerry has kids by 4 different women. He's never held down a job; he has a long criminal record; he's functionally illiterate; and in spite of all that he's never without someone who wants to have his next child. And the guy doing his intake is childless, single, and lonely, and he thinks, "I don't expect to have a supermodel on my arm. But I expect to be doing better than Jerry." And that's sort of how I feel sometimes.
I bet Jerry is always out at bars or events where he knows women are going to be.
I bet he's flirty.
I bet he has no problem being rejected because he knows it's a numbers game.
I bet he's not particularly choosy. (Sorry Jerry, but bringing a UHaul on a first date is a dead-giveaway to your lack of standards.)
So Zamphir, ask out everyone who you think may possibly be "okay" - not necessarily have-my-baby awesome, but just okay. It really is about putting yourself out there as much as possible, not looking for Ms Perfect.:)
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I mean, how have you not been on a date at age 41?????
That's you, my friend, not the Pentecostals.6 -
cmriverside wrote: »I mean, how have you not been on a date at age 41?????
That's you, my friend, not the Pentecostals.
Especially when he says he's been married. I mean, yes, arranged marriages are a thing, but I wasn't picking up on anything in Zamphir's posts that suggested that was part of his background or culture. Of course, people do often leave things out of their OPs that turn out to be kind of relevant.1 -
I think you need to fricken relax bro. Women are not that different than we are. They have a little different plumbing and hormones, but not that different. They still eat, sleep, drink, fart, ect... except @cmriverside. I think her gas just dissipate into the ether. Lol9
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lynn_glenmont wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I mean, how have you not been on a date at age 41?????
That's you, my friend, not the Pentecostals.
Especially when he says he's been married. I mean, yes, arranged marriages are a thing, but I wasn't picking up on anything in Zamphir's posts that suggested that was part of his background or culture. Of course, people do often leave things out of their OPs that turn out to be kind of relevant.
Right? Like that girl who was upset with her female friend losing weight more easily...then five pages in it turns out her friend is really her significant other and she's ...I don't even remember...then she got mad because we didn't mind-read that whole scenario...
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10582739/pissing-me-off/p1psychod787 wrote: »I think you need to fricken relax bro. Women are not that different than we are. They have a little different plumbing and hormones, but not that different. They still eat, sleep, drink, fart, ect... except @cmriverside. I think her gas just dissipate into the ether. Lol
You tagged me. I have no idea what your post means. Apparently my reading skills have now become non-existent. I always agree with you though, so ^^ What He Said!
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cmriverside wrote: »I was having a bad day when I made this topic! Forgive my childishness!
FWIW, I'm nearing 41and have, essentially, never been on a date. And it's starting to wear on me ever so slightly. In the past few months, I've spent probably $500 on dating app memberships for the privilege of sending missives into the void.
Younger Zamphir definitely fell into the trap of "hurr durr women don't like nice guys, only a-holes" nonsense. I've outgrown that, thank God. I realize I'm the common denominator in my one-sided equation. I just can't figure out what's wrong with me.
I read this article recently from a guy who works in mental health or recovery in some capacity. He talks about a client named "Jerry" who is receiving court-ordered counseling for being an abusive alcoholic and poly-addict. Jerry has kids by 4 different women. He's never held down a job; he has a long criminal record; he's functionally illiterate; and in spite of all that he's never without someone who wants to have his next child. And the guy doing his intake is childless, single, and lonely, and he thinks, "I don't expect to have a supermodel on my arm. But I expect to be doing better than Jerry." And that's sort of how I feel sometimes.
I bet Jerry is always out at bars or events where he knows women are going to be.
I bet he's flirty.
I bet he has no problem being rejected because he knows it's a numbers game.
I bet he's not particularly choosy. (Sorry Jerry, but bringing a UHaul on a first date is a dead-giveaway to your lack of standards.)
So Zamphir, ask out everyone who you think may possibly be "okay" - not necessarily have-my-baby awesome, but just okay. It really is about putting yourself out there as much as possible, not looking for Ms Perfect.:)
Also, I'm thinking that Jerry's relationships may have an element of mmm . . . drama that many of us would find unfavorable. I've known people who never lack for a partner despite addiction struggles, frequent arrests, employment issues, and a long history of failed relationships. They may not be lonely at night, but there is often a level of conflict and chaos in these relationships that would make me long to be single.
I'd rather be alone than be in the thunderdome that one of my uncles creates in every one of the (many) relationships he's been in. I've gone my whole life without ever having the police get involved in one of my domestic disputes. I don't think my uncle has gone a YEAR without having that happen, for multiple decades now. I realize even level-headed people get in bad situations and have domestic situations get out of hand sometimes, but when it's a way of life with at least a dozen different partners? No thanks.
Someone with a string of partners often isn't doing "better" than someone who takes longer between relationships. They're different, they aren't feeling the particular challenges of not having a partner, but many times it really isn't what I would call better.
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As a viking warrior I know nothing of what you speak. Now let me just get into my Formula 1 ca. . . .ohhh.5
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cmriverside wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I mean, how have you not been on a date at age 41?????
That's you, my friend, not the Pentecostals.
Especially when he says he's been married. I mean, yes, arranged marriages are a thing, but I wasn't picking up on anything in Zamphir's posts that suggested that was part of his background or culture. Of course, people do often leave things out of their OPs that turn out to be kind of relevant.
Right? Like that girl who was upset with her female friend losing weight more easily...then five pages in it turns out her friend is really her significant other and she's ...I don't even remember...then she got mad because we didn't mind-read that whole scenario...
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10582739/pissing-me-off/p1psychod787 wrote: »I think you need to fricken relax bro. Women are not that different than we are. They have a little different plumbing and hormones, but not that different. They still eat, sleep, drink, fart, ect... except @cmriverside. I think her gas just dissipate into the ether. Lol
You tagged me. I have no idea what your post means. Apparently my reading skills have now become non-existent. I always agree with you though, so ^^ What He Said!
Sorry, dry nerd humor. Basically you are a unicorn and they don't fart. From reading, your flatulence is converted into rainbows and drifts into the ether....
On the topic of height. I'm nearly 6'3", 6'5" in heels, and I am sure I intimidated smaller gals. Jmho6 -
Heightism is a real thing. Not only in dating but in business. I've seen it in business for decades. Some guys can be the biggest morons in the room, but if they are 6 foot 3 and blue eyes, they will get promoted. I witnessed it first hand at two companies I worked at for a long time. Probably part of the reason I started my own company many years ago and was in commissioned sales before that -- not reliant on any one to promote me, just got ahead based on me.
I'm your height and my son is 5'7" max. But he has no problem finding dates. Not at all. He is very self assured but not arrogant about it. And he's hysterical. Gets my wife's sense of humor, which is much better than mine!
You seem like you have a great personality. Just keep working on self love and acceptance and that will radiate outward. Someone will see that and you probably won't be trying as hard when that happens. And it will. Maybe instead of dating apps, when Covid-19 settles down, join some clubs or activities in things you like to do. Sometimes a common interest can work as an initial bond and friendship and more from there.8 -
cmriverside wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I mean, how have you not been on a date at age 41?????
That's you, my friend, not the Pentecostals.
Especially when he says he's been married. I mean, yes, arranged marriages are a thing, but I wasn't picking up on anything in Zamphir's posts that suggested that was part of his background or culture. Of course, people do often leave things out of their OPs that turn out to be kind of relevant.
Right? Like that girl who was upset with her female friend losing weight more easily...then five pages in it turns out her friend is really her significant other and she's ...I don't even remember...then she got mad because we didn't mind-read that whole scenario...
https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10582739/pissing-me-off/p1psychod787 wrote: »I think you need to fricken relax bro. Women are not that different than we are. They have a little different plumbing and hormones, but not that different. They still eat, sleep, drink, fart, ect... except @cmriverside. I think her gas just dissipate into the ether. Lol
You tagged me. I have no idea what your post means. Apparently my reading skills have now become non-existent. I always agree with you though, so ^^ What He Said!
If it turns out this OP (Zamphir) eventually tells us he "is sleeping with her," it really will turn the thread on its head!2 -
When I say I've never been on a date, I mean in the traditional sense of going out with someone you're not yet intimate with to figure out if you'd like to progress with them or not. Also, the sense where numbers are important: "first date," "second date," etc. My handful of relationships have always been with fellow party girls where we just sort of ... start hanging out a bit more, and then start being more than friends, just organically. One of these girls wanted to get married, and I was a "go with the flow" person who ended up in a long-term relationship (and marriage) I didn't really want to be in. That ended 8 years ago, and I've been single ever since. I've also been clean and sober for most of those years and trying to check off all the "adulting" boxes I ignored through my 20s and beyond.
Thanks for listening Dr. MFP.17 -
I'm 5'7" and think everyone over 5'10" should be put in a zoo for lanky freaks of nature lol12
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I think for a lot of women, it's about the crap they get for being tall. Comments from strangers that are magnified when next to someone smaller than them. So it becomes a "must" for them. I'm a very tall woman and I always preferred tall men as short men could be weird about a woman's height. It makes you feel like some sort of giant monster. I know women who can only wear flats with a partner as the man gets insecure about her towering over him. Google "prince Diana height Charles". It's quite interesting that they were the same height but pictures were always posed to make her appear 6 inches or so shorter than him.
Additionally, I don't see the point in lying in dating profiles, do you want to waste your time on a woman who isn't interested? I'm tall and overweight so if I was looking at a man's profile and he had an issue with that I'd rather see "looking for a slim petite" woman rather than waste my time messaging him. "No big fatties" would be unacceptable but there is a difference. Just like "looking for a man who is taller than me" isn't the same as "no short arses".4 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »Heightism is a real thing. Not only in dating but in business. I've seen it in business for decades. Some guys can be the biggest morons in the room, but if they are 6 foot 3 and blue eyes, they will get promoted. I witnessed it first hand at two companies I worked at for a long time. Probably part of the reason I started my own company many years ago and was in commissioned sales before that -- not reliant on any one to promote me, just got ahead based on me.
I'm your height and my son is 5'7" max. But he has no problem finding dates. Not at all. He is very self assured but not arrogant about it. And he's hysterical. Gets my wife's sense of humor, which is much better than mine!
You seem like you have a great personality. Just keep working on self love and acceptance and that will radiate outward. Someone will see that and you probably won't be trying as hard when that happens. And it will. Maybe instead of dating apps, when Covid-19 settles down, join some clubs or activities in things you like to do. Sometimes a common interest can work as an initial bond and friendship and more from there.
The bolded would typically be a good idea but the OP has the following observation/opinion regarding the single women in his area. If those are his thoughts on the women, most likely extend to the males also so most likely not a good candidate for club membership.
Just my $0.02
"And even before COVID, I live in rural Appalachia. Single women my age are generally pillbillies, Pentecostal, or otherwise tragic in some way."3 -
Theoldguy1 wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »Heightism is a real thing. Not only in dating but in business. I've seen it in business for decades. Some guys can be the biggest morons in the room, but if they are 6 foot 3 and blue eyes, they will get promoted. I witnessed it first hand at two companies I worked at for a long time. Probably part of the reason I started my own company many years ago and was in commissioned sales before that -- not reliant on any one to promote me, just got ahead based on me.
I'm your height and my son is 5'7" max. But he has no problem finding dates. Not at all. He is very self assured but not arrogant about it. And he's hysterical. Gets my wife's sense of humor, which is much better than mine!
You seem like you have a great personality. Just keep working on self love and acceptance and that will radiate outward. Someone will see that and you probably won't be trying as hard when that happens. And it will. Maybe instead of dating apps, when Covid-19 settles down, join some clubs or activities in things you like to do. Sometimes a common interest can work as an initial bond and friendship and more from there.
The bolded would typically be a good idea but the OP has the following observation/opinion regarding the single women in his area. If those are his thoughts on the women, most likely extend to the males also so most likely not a good candidate for club membership.
Just my $0.02
"And even before COVID, I live in rural Appalachia. Single women my age are generally pillbillies, Pentecostal, or otherwise tragic in some way."
But that contradicts having dating apps and the hyper selective types on there. So perhaps hyperbole??2 -
When I say I've never been on a date, I mean in the traditional sense of going out with someone you're not yet intimate with to figure out if you'd like to progress with them or not. Also, the sense where numbers are important: "first date," "second date," etc. My handful of relationships have always been with fellow party girls where we just sort of ... start hanging out a bit more, and then start being more than friends, just organically. One of these girls wanted to get married, and I was a "go with the flow" person who ended up in a long-term relationship (and marriage) I didn't really want to be in. That ended 8 years ago, and I've been single ever since. I've also been clean and sober for most of those years and trying to check off all the "adulting" boxes I ignored through my 20s and beyond.
Thanks for listening Dr. MFP.
oooooohhh.
The Page Three Reveal.
I get this.
I was a party girl.
I married one of those guys. It didn't go well.
I do think you could seriously work on that 4th and 5th Step.
I know not everyone is into AA, but when I got sober I had a lot of work to do, not the least of which was to take myself down a notch or two. The judgemental attitude you have about women and dating doesn't work too well and women are going to pick up on that. Maybe you aren't meant to be with someone, for that matter. Have you considered you may be a life-long single? There's nothing wrong with that. I think at a certain age it may be time to look at that as an option if you can't start seeing women as whole people with preferences of their own. It isn't just about sex.
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janejellyroll wrote: »cmriverside wrote: »I was having a bad day when I made this topic! Forgive my childishness!
FWIW, I'm nearing 41and have, essentially, never been on a date. And it's starting to wear on me ever so slightly. In the past few months, I've spent probably $500 on dating app memberships for the privilege of sending missives into the void.
Younger Zamphir definitely fell into the trap of "hurr durr women don't like nice guys, only a-holes" nonsense. I've outgrown that, thank God. I realize I'm the common denominator in my one-sided equation. I just can't figure out what's wrong with me.
I read this article recently from a guy who works in mental health or recovery in some capacity. He talks about a client named "Jerry" who is receiving court-ordered counseling for being an abusive alcoholic and poly-addict. Jerry has kids by 4 different women. He's never held down a job; he has a long criminal record; he's functionally illiterate; and in spite of all that he's never without someone who wants to have his next child. And the guy doing his intake is childless, single, and lonely, and he thinks, "I don't expect to have a supermodel on my arm. But I expect to be doing better than Jerry." And that's sort of how I feel sometimes.
I bet Jerry is always out at bars or events where he knows women are going to be.
I bet he's flirty.
I bet he has no problem being rejected because he knows it's a numbers game.
I bet he's not particularly choosy. (Sorry Jerry, but bringing a UHaul on a first date is a dead-giveaway to your lack of standards.)
So Zamphir, ask out everyone who you think may possibly be "okay" - not necessarily have-my-baby awesome, but just okay. It really is about putting yourself out there as much as possible, not looking for Ms Perfect.:)
Also, I'm thinking that Jerry's relationships may have an element of mmm . . . drama that many of us would find unfavorable. I've known people who never lack for a partner despite addiction struggles, frequent arrests, employment issues, and a long history of failed relationships. They may not be lonely at night, but there is often a level of conflict and chaos in these relationships that would make me long to be single.
I'd rather be alone than be in the thunderdome that one of my uncles creates in every one of the (many) relationships he's been in. I've gone my whole life without ever having the police get involved in one of my domestic disputes. I don't think my uncle has gone a YEAR without having that happen, for multiple decades now. I realize even level-headed people get in bad situations and have domestic situations get out of hand sometimes, but when it's a way of life with at least a dozen different partners? No thanks.
Someone with a string of partners often isn't doing "better" than someone who takes longer between relationships. They're different, they aren't feeling the particular challenges of not having a partner, but many times it really isn't what I would call better.
My sister always has a Jerry in her life and there is always maximum drama involved. On the questionably positive side, she has no filters for race, height, age, etc. She usually meets them through friends. Her minimum requirements are low to non-existent; one guy cleaned her bathroom on his first visit then moved in.4 -
cmriverside wrote: »...
Have you considered you may be a life-long single? There's nothing wrong with that.
...
I have considered it, and my therapist has even assured me that it's perfectly OK. And I do more or less like my life. I do what I want, when I want. It's comfortable and yet, somewhat paradoxically, I've also received steady advice to "get out of my comfort zone" as part of recovery. And for me, few things are as uncomfortable as ... this stuff.
But there is the little voice inside me that says, "Lonely! Lonely Bad! Me Hurt and Lonely!" I look at friends who have started families and now have kids entering college. They're in an entirely different world. I'm sure there are times they look at my life with a little envy, too.
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