Motivation or "hate speech"?

brower47

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Yes, it does take discipline and dedication to become fit, but that doesn't mean that fat people don't have discipline or dedication either. There is more to being disciplined than having a fit body.

Didn't read the whole article. Does she actually say that anywhere in there?

Yes:

"Maria Kang, known as the "Fit Mom," was temporarily banned from Facebook this week after she wrote a post complaining about the positive media coverage of an online group that encourages plus-sizewomen to post photos of themselves in lingerie to show what "real women" look like."

And then:

"Kang wrote another message on her Facebook page about the controversy, saying she didn't want to shame overweight people but that she believes people are celebrating unhealthy habits.

"I think you should love yourself," Kang told ABCNews.com. "But there's a fine line we're walking between I love myself and accept myself, and I love and accept and want to progress myself.""

So in other words, "No"?

LOL, that's exactly my thinking.

Did the original article outline the overweight lingerie women's habits? Were they unhealthy?... because if not she was criticizing their photo's and their pride in them.

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there's a fine line we're walking between I love myself and accept myself, and I love and accept and want to progress myself

Also there is the path that is I hated myself, then I loved myself and accepted myself, then I WANTED to progress myself. And shaming of women as they are IMO gets in the way of that path.

...she wrote a post complaining about the positive media coverage of an online group that encourages plus-sizewomen to post photos of themselves in lingerie to show what "real women" look like."

This annoys me too and I fit into the 'real women' category that the online group promotes. The fit mom is thin and this ad campaign implies that she's not a real woman. It's body shaming going in the opposite direction. If the ad campaign said something to the effect of 'beautiful at any size' or 'we're beautiful' or anything else that was an empowering statement that didn't have to malign another group in the process then it would be a non issue but they didn't. They said that they are the real women, implying that anyone that doesn't fit into their definition is something akin to a freak.

copselily

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But what if people love themselves and don't even care about "progressing" themselves?

Fine. Then don't. It's a choice but we don't have Olympics for that event.

Well that's fine But maybe Ms Kang should quit equating self love with being fit and thin, because fat people can absolutely love themselves too. Being fit and disciplined has jack to do with loving yourself, what about the people who starve themselves to be thin, or orthorexics for that matter?

Her logic is just totally flawed.

Wow. Upthread you questioned someone's comprehension skills, but you should be questioning your make-believe skills. You've created an entire fantasy world in which complete and total strangers are judging you based on their own criteria for self improvement. A world where people that exercise and watch what they eat are on the same plane as people with eating disorders.

How is the air up there?

My point is that self love is not necessarily synonymous with fitness. For some people (and for myself) it is, but not everyone.

For example, just because someone works out or looks thin doesn't mean they love themselves. They could have a disorder or be harming themselves, like I stated above.

So, just because someone is fat doesn't mean they can't love themselves, which is basically what Kang is implying and has also implied on other occasions too.

I just find her quite toxic in general and don't think she's a good role model for women. That's just my opinion and you have every right to feel otherwise.

MyChocolateDiet

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I hate it when people use the "real woman' tag when referring to overweight. As though the only way to be a real woman is to be fat. If that's all that there is to the controversy, then I agree with the fit mom. I didn't do any additional research to see if she'd done any type of body shaming (which I would then criticize her for).

Yeah, I agree here.

But, also being bothered by the real women phrase is not something I have the energy for either. I just don't care.

I guess I'm just a stickler for avoiding misrepresentation. It only bothers me to the extent that I don't think the woman should be accused of hate speech for pointing out the hypocrisy. Congratulations on your energy saving apathy?

Another I don't like.
"Real men prefer curves, only dogs like a bone."

No, I mean it used to bother me a lot. And I would talk about it. But, it just seems that it's been talked about a lot and I stopped allowing it to get a rise out of me now. This is only about me, not a judgement on any other person. I mean that it seems most people are in agreement now about the real women phrase. But, if people reverted back to the way it was before I would care again. Maybe this is more clear.

Yes, that phrase about real men and bones and dogs is disgusting!!

are you sure it's not just a wee bit giggity? in the right context?

Aaah, I can see that now...:laugh: .

But, the way some people use it is dehumanizing to thin women. And plenty thin women have low self-worth and end up in abusive relationships with men that say they can't do any better.

yeah people throw that phrase around to bash thin women way too much. like it's not okay to say I'm pretty when I'm chubby without adding the illogical consequence "thus you are ugly since you are thin".....so not the point or conclusion. I could start gif bombing the place with beautiful women who might be thought "too fat" or "too thin" by SOMEONE, but you get my point. My pride and beauty at any size need not detract from someone elses at their current size. IMO.

wheird

I read the article, I didn't find anything she said particularly hateful or out of line. For the most part, I agree with her.

ninerbuff

Everyone does not have an hour a day to spend in the gym. I'll admit it's about priorities. I put my husband and three kids above having a ripped body.

One can still prioritize their family and still have an hour to spend on physical fitness. And getting "ripped" is more about eating than working out.

A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

copselily

This annoys me too and I fit into the 'real women' category that the online group promotes. The fit mom is thin and this ad campaign implies that she's not a real woman. It's body shaming going in the opposite direction. If the ad campaign said something to the effect of 'beautiful at any size' or 'we're beautiful' or anything else that was an empowering statement that didn't have to malign another group in the process then it would be a non issue but they didn't. They said that they are the real women, implying that anyone that doesn't fit into their definition is something akin to a freak.

I do agree with you on this. All women are 'real' women, all bodies are good bodies.

MyChocolateDiet

show previous quotes

Yes, it does take discipline and dedication to become fit, but that doesn't mean that fat people don't have discipline or dedication either. There is more to being disciplined than having a fit body.

Didn't read the whole article. Does she actually say that anywhere in there?

Yes:

"Maria Kang, known as the "Fit Mom," was temporarily banned from Facebook this week after she wrote a post complaining about the positive media coverage of an online group that encourages plus-sizewomen to post photos of themselves in lingerie to show what "real women" look like."

And then:

"Kang wrote another message on her Facebook page about the controversy, saying she didn't want to shame overweight people but that she believes people are celebrating unhealthy habits.

"I think you should love yourself," Kang told ABCNews.com. "But there's a fine line we're walking between I love myself and accept myself, and I love and accept and want to progress myself.""

So in other words, "No"?

LOL, that's exactly my thinking.

Did the original article outline the overweight lingerie women's habits? Were they unhealthy?... because if not she was criticizing their photo's and their pride in them.

there's a fine line we're walking between I love myself and accept myself, and I love and accept and want to progress myself

Also there is the path that is I hated myself, then I loved myself and accepted myself, then I WANTED to progress myself. And shaming of women as they are IMO gets in the way of that path.

...she wrote a post complaining about the positive media coverage of an online group that encourages plus-sizewomen to post photos of themselves in lingerie to show what "real women" look like."

This annoys me too and I fit into the 'real women' category that the online group promotes. The fit mom is thin and this ad campaign implies that she's not a real woman. It's body shaming going in the opposite direction. If the ad campaign said something to the effect of 'beautiful at any size' or 'we're beautiful' or anything else that was an empowering statement that didn't have to malign another group in the process then it would be a non issue but they didn't. They said that they are the real women, implying that anyone that doesn't fit into their definition is something akin to a freak.

yeah I still don't like that phrase, I'm right there with you brower. only thing is I don't like her either. in general. in a je ne sais quois kinda way. I wouldn't be surprised to see she does something pretty heinous next. or just gets a reality show.

egrusy

....
Also, my perception is that the OP does not personally think the things she stated in the OP. She was presenting two different ways of thinking about it and was actually being a little bit sarcastic when she said the negative things about the "fit mom" (LOL).
....

^^^ I read it this way too.

Seems to me there's a little bit of body shaming from both. Fit Mom says "What's your excuse?", which can be perceived as shaming those that don't look like her. The lingerie folks claim that this is what "real women" look like. I wouldn't pitch my tent in either camp :ohwell:

copselily

This annoys me too and I fit into the 'real women' category that the online group promotes. The fit mom is thin and this ad campaign implies that she's not a real woman. It's body shaming going in the opposite direction. If the ad campaign said something to the effect of 'beautiful at any size' or 'we're beautiful' or anything else that was an empowering statement that didn't have to malign another group in the process then it would be a non issue but they didn't. They said that they are the real women, implying that anyone that doesn't fit into their definition is something akin to a freak.

yeah I still don't like that phrase, I'm right there with you brower. only thing is I don't like her either. in general. in a je ne sais quois kinda way. I wouldn't be surprised to see she does something pretty heinous next. or just gets a reality show.

Yeah. Seems like she likes the notoriety. We're probably doing her a favour even discussing it. :ohwell:

wheird

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Everyone does not have an hour a day to spend in the gym. I'll admit it's about priorities. I put my husband and three kids above having a ripped body.

One can still prioritize their family and still have an hour to spend on physical fitness. And getting "ripped" is more about eating than working out.

A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

Yup, you could take a bike ride as a family, go to the park, play sports, etc. There are a number of possibilities.

BinaryPulsar

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I hate it when people use the "real woman' tag when referring to overweight. As though the only way to be a real woman is to be fat. If that's all that there is to the controversy, then I agree with the fit mom. I didn't do any additional research to see if she'd done any type of body shaming (which I would then criticize her for).

Yeah, I agree here.

But, also being bothered by the real women phrase is not something I have the energy for either. I just don't care.

I guess I'm just a stickler for avoiding misrepresentation. It only bothers me to the extent that I don't think the woman should be accused of hate speech for pointing out the hypocrisy. Congratulations on your energy saving apathy?

Another I don't like.
"Real men prefer curves, only dogs like a bone."

No, I mean it used to bother me a lot. And I would talk about it. But, it just seems that it's been talked about a lot and I stopped allowing it to get a rise out of me now. This is only about me, not a judgement on any other person. I mean that it seems most people are in agreement now about the real women phrase. But, if people reverted back to the way it was before I would care again. Maybe this is more clear.

Yes, that phrase about real men and bones and dogs is disgusting!!

are you sure it's not just a wee bit giggity? in the right context?

Aaah, I can see that now...:laugh: .

But, the way some people use it is dehumanizing to thin women. And plenty thin women have low self-worth and end up in abusive relationships with men that say they can't do any better.

yeah people throw that phrase around to bash thin women way too much. like it's not okay to say I'm pretty when I'm chubby without adding the illogical consequence "thus you are ugly since you are thin".....so not the point or conclusion. I could start gif bombing the place with beautiful women who might be thought "too fat" or "too thin" by SOMEONE, but you get my point. My pride and beauty at any size need not detract from someone elses at their current size. IMO.

Yeah, I agree!!! :drinker:

Otterluv

show previous quotes

Yes, it does take discipline and dedication to become fit, but that doesn't mean that fat people don't have discipline or dedication either. There is more to being disciplined than having a fit body.

Didn't read the whole article. Does she actually say that anywhere in there?

Yes:

"Maria Kang, known as the "Fit Mom," was temporarily banned from Facebook this week after she wrote a post complaining about the positive media coverage of an online group that encourages plus-sizewomen to post photos of themselves in lingerie to show what "real women" look like."

And then:

"Kang wrote another message on her Facebook page about the controversy, saying she didn't want to shame overweight people but that she believes people are celebrating unhealthy habits.

"I think you should love yourself," Kang told ABCNews.com. "But there's a fine line we're walking between I love myself and accept myself, and I love and accept and want to progress myself.""

So in other words, "No"?

LOL, that's exactly my thinking.

Did the original article outline the overweight lingerie women's habits? Were they unhealthy?... because if not she could only be seen as criticizing their photo's and their pride in them.

show previous quotes

there's a fine line we're walking between I love myself and accept myself, and I love and accept and want to progress myself

Also there is the path that is I hated myself, then I loved myself and accepted myself, then I WANTED to progress myself. And shaming of women as they are IMO gets in the way of that path.

^^^^ this

For some people, feeling like crap about their present state is what gets them moving, but there are many many people who have the complete opposite reaction.

She should not have been torn down for her original poster ("What's your excuse?"), but somehow I doubt that the women in the "post pics of yourself in lingerie" movement were the exact women who tore her down. Maybe some were. And I get that she felt attacked and I agree that being overweight/obese is not the ideal bmi. However, her approach, of going into that group and telling them that it is glorifying in an unhealthy lifestyle (which is what it appeared that she was doing?), is contributing to the "us vs. them" "thin people vs. fat people" mentality that is divisive and pointless, and quite honestly I don't feel that it's the most helpful approach for a huge number of people.

BinaryPulsar

Yeah. Seems like she likes the notoriety. We're probably doing her a favour even discussing it. :ohwell:

I agree

EvgeniZyntx

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But what if people love themselves and don't even care about "progressing" themselves?

Fine. Then don't. It's a choice but we don't have Olympics for that event.

Well that's fine But maybe Ms Kang should quit equating self love with being fit and thin, because fat people can absolutely love themselves too. Being fit and disciplined has jack to do with loving yourself, what about the people who starve themselves to be thin, or orthorexics for that matter?

Her logic is just totally flawed.

Wow. Upthread you questioned someone's comprehension skills, but you should be questioning your make-believe skills. You've created an entire fantasy world in which complete and total strangers are judging you based on their own criteria for self improvement. A world where people that exercise and watch what they eat are on the same plane as people with eating disorders.

How is the air up there?

My point is that self love is not necessarily synonymous with fitness. For some people (and for myself) it is, but not everyone.

For example, just because someone works out or looks thin doesn't mean they love themselves. They could have a disorder or be harming themselves, like I stated above.

So, just because someone is fat doesn't mean they can't love themselves, which is basically what Kang is implying and has also implied on other occasions too.

I just find her quite toxic in general and don't think she's a good role model for women. That's just my opinion and you have every right to feel otherwise.

Oh, I agree with the bold.
I don't like her because she's very much "in your face" attitude about it.

wheird

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Yeah. Seems like she likes the notoriety. We're probably doing her a favour even discussing it. :ohwell:

I agree

I agree as well, but I still think that it is a worthy topic to discuss.

BinaryPulsar

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Yeah. Seems like she likes the notoriety. We're probably doing her a favour even discussing it. :ohwell:

I agree

I agree as well, but I still think that it is a worthy topic to discuss.

It has turned into a good discussion. Especially how people are talking about all the different ways a person can be fit and that it does not mean they have skewed priorities!!

BusyRaeNOTBusty

I find her annoying and smug. But I don't find her that "unrealistic". I also have 3 kids and am fit. It really doesn't take that much time and effort.

But yeah the comments about the obesity group were dumb and uncalled for. Good for those larger ladies being happy with themselves. Their happiness doesn't effect me at all.

servilia

Oh. This again.
There is a lot of hate for a woman who posted a picture oh her with a perfectly flat stomach 4 days after giving birth. She worked out through the pregnancy, didn't gain much and has great genetics. Still people accuse her of all sorts of things.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2515971/Footballers-wife-sparks-outrage-Norway-posting-picture-flat-stomach-days-giving-birth.html

Wow! I'm jealous

copselily

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Yeah. Seems like she likes the notoriety. We're probably doing her a favour even discussing it. :ohwell:

I agree

I agree as well, but I still think that it is a worthy topic to discuss.

Me too, it does get me annoyed though unfortunately.

Not so much at her in general, because I think a lot of people in the fitness community (and the media) perpetuate the kind of things she has to say. She's not saying anything original. It just hits a nerve with me on a personal level because I hate body policing of any sort and know how bad it has made me feel over the years. It's just unacceptable and I have no tolerance for it.

jofjltncb6

In...

...because the last Kang thread was epic.

gramarye

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Most people can probably never look like her, because they have more important things to do in their lives.

It takes an hour a day. Anybody who wants to, can.

That's fine. I think my issue is with the general message that everyone should want to. If one person is happily overweight, that doesn't negate or devalue another person who is happily fit. and vice versa.

Of course, both sides attack the other to make themselves feel better. I'm pretty sure both sides are acting like *kitten* here.

copselily

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Most people can probably never look like her, because they have more important things to do in their lives.

It takes an hour a day. Anybody who wants to, can.

That's fine. I think my issue is with the general message that everyone should want to. If one person is happily overweight, that doesn't negate or devalue another person who is happily fit. and vice versa.

Of course, both sides attack the other to make themselves feel better. I'm pretty sure both sides are acting like *kitten* here.

Totally agree!

MyChocolateDiet

In...

...because the last Kang thread was epic.

^that sounds like a thong.

cmriverside

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In...

...because the last Kang thread was epic.

^that sounds like a thong.

There's a Kang thong?

Pics.

wheird

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Yeah. Seems like she likes the notoriety. We're probably doing her a favour even discussing it. :ohwell:

I agree

I agree as well, but I still think that it is a worthy topic to discuss.

Me too, it does get me annoyed though unfortunately.

Not so much at her in general, because I think a lot of people in the fitness community (and the media) perpetuate the kind of things she has to say. She's not saying anything original. It just hits a nerve with me on a personal level because I hate body policing of any sort and know how bad it has made me feel over the years. It's just unacceptable and I have no tolerance for it.

I do think she tends to lean a little strong in her direction, but what she said does have some merit. Obesity is growing in acceptance these days and could potentially be a bad thing. I don't mean acceptance in terms of obese people not being bullied or made to feel horrible about themselves, because I agree this is a bad thing. But rather I think that the whole Fat Acceptance movement could normalize obesity on a cultural level and cause complacency.

MyChocolateDiet

I now find anyone who doesn't look after themselves exceptionally unattractive, especially when they think it's normal to be fat. I think it's disgusting people posting pictures saying this is what normal people look like, no it isn't, it's what unhealthy people look like. (extremely controversial post)

Please duck. We had just gotten to a happy place in here. Tomatoes may be incoming.

BeachIron

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Most people can probably never look like her, because they have more important things to do in their lives.

It takes an hour a day. Anybody who wants to, can.

That's fine. I think my issue is with the general message that everyone should want to. If one person is happily overweight, that doesn't negate or devalue another person who is happily fit. and vice versa.

Of course, both sides attack the other to make themselves feel better. I'm pretty sure both sides are acting like *kitten* here.

I agree. Alcoholics and drug addicts shouldn't change either. Everyone should be happy just the way they are. Everyone is special in their own special way.

*group hug*

copselily

I do think she tends to lean a little strong in her direction, but what she said does have some merit. Obesity is growing in acceptance these days and could potentially be a bad thing. I don't mean acceptance in terms of obese people not being bullied or made to feel horrible about themselves, because I agree this is a bad thing. But rather I think that the whole Fat Acceptance movement could normalize obesity on a cultural level and cause complacency.

I do understand where you are coming from, and you do have a good point, but I don't think the problem is that the Fat Acceptance movement is NORMALISING obesity, it's that people are misunderstanding what Fat Acceptance is all about.

MyChocolateDiet

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Yeah. Seems like she likes the notoriety. We're probably doing her a favour even discussing it. :ohwell:

I agree

I agree as well, but I still think that it is a worthy topic to discuss.

Me too, it does get me annoyed though unfortunately.

Not so much at her in general, because I think a lot of people in the fitness community (and the media) perpetuate the kind of things she has to say. She's not saying anything original. It just hits a nerve with me on a personal level because I hate body policing of any sort and know how bad it has made me feel over the years. It's just unacceptable and I have no tolerance for it.

I do think she tends to lean a little strong in her direction, but what she said does have some merit. Obesity is growing in acceptance these days and could potentially be a bad thing. I don't mean acceptance in terms of obese people not being bullied or made to feel horrible about themselves, because I agree this is a bad thing. But rather I think that the whole Fat Acceptance movement could normalize obesity on a cultural level and cause complacency.

I think it is already normalized and the culture is already complacent and being a meanie does nothing to correct that. Education however does. Also accessibility. This site provides both. Shaming and name calling on social media or ads do not.

jofjltncb6

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Most people can probably never look like her, because they have more important things to do in their lives.

It takes an hour a day. Anybody who wants to, can.

That's fine. I think my issue is with the general message that everyone should want to. If one person is happily overweight, that doesn't negate or devalue another person who is happily fit. and vice versa.

Of course, both sides attack the other to make themselves feel better. I'm pretty sure both sides are acting like *kitten* here.

I agree. Alcoholics and drug addicts shouldn't change either. Everyone should be happy just the way they are. Everyone is special in their own special way.

*group hug*

Never change...

Never. Change.


Oh, and...