Dairy Alarmism

ashCHB

I'm lactose intolerant, so I stay away from it unless I'm really wanting to experience some explosive diarrhea. LOL! I love ice cream, but it hates me... :sad: Almond milk is my favorite, but it's super expensive, so I don't get it very often...

I've known some people who have lowered their dairy intake and it really helped with skin problems they were having. But I'm guessing they had some sort of sensitivity to it in the first place, because obviously not everyone who drinks milk has skin problems.

So I say if it doesn't have any ill effects, drink it!

TheGymGypsy

This will probably get lost in this long *kitten* post so here goes.

With every cent you spend on dairy, you are supporting a cruel industry that abuses animals. (This goes for eggs and meat too.) Health benefits aside, this is all the reason I need to stay away from the stuff.

Taking a crazy guess here.... You've never been on a dairy farm, have you?

I lived on a dairy farm in Germany for 6 years actually where the cows were treated as humanely as you possibly can treat an animal that you are forcibly impregnating and then stealing it's milk and separating the mother and baby from each other.

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_John_

I'm lactose intolerant, so I stay away from it unless I'm really wanting to experience some explosive diarrhea. LOL! I love ice cream, but it hates me... :sad:

You can get coconut ice cream, but it's like $6 for a tiny little pint!

Yeah, but as far as real ice cream replacements go, it's the best option.

RhineDHP

I'm lactose intolerant, so I stay away from it unless I'm really wanting to experience some explosive diarrhea. LOL! I love ice cream, but it hates me... :sad: Almond milk is my favorite, but it's super expensive, so I don't get it very often...

I've known some people who have lowered their dairy intake and it really helped with skin problems they were having. But I'm guessing they had some sort of sensitivity to it in the first place, because obviously not everyone who drinks milk has skin problems.

So I say if it doesn't have any ill effects, drink it!

Have you tried lactaid pills? I'm also lactose intolerant. I love any kind of creamy sauce for pasta - which indelibly is made of some concoction of dairy goodness - and man does it hate me! But usually when I take a lactaid pill beforehand, I'm fine. I've tried a couple of brands. Some work better than others. This one over the counter from...I think Target has been working pretty well for me as of yet.

nikkihk

This will probably get lost in this long *kitten* post so here goes.

With every cent you spend on dairy, you are supporting a cruel industry that abuses animals. (This goes for eggs and meat too.) Health benefits aside, this is all the reason I need to stay away from the stuff.

Taking a crazy guess here.... You've never been on a dairy farm, have you?

Yeah, you do know that every farm operates like the one they feature on an agenda pushing documentary right? Visiting a real farm to get actual facts is out of the question, I mean how the hell would that support a failing argument?

=D

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MyChocolateDiet

man i really want a glass of milk right now. bad.

VBnotbitter

This will probably get lost in this long *kitten* post so here goes.

With every cent you spend on dairy, you are supporting a cruel industry that abuses animals. (This goes for eggs and meat too.) Health benefits aside, this is all the reason I need to stay away from the stuff.

I'm interested in hearing more about this. How is the dairy industry cruel and abusive? Not trying to roll, but genuinely interested in learning more as I have not read or heard anything about dairy cruelty where I live.

I'm in Australia and there are lots of dairly farms near where I live and a big dairy industry further south. I always see fat cows with their calves grazing in lush green paddocks waiting to get milked. Is it different in your country? I only eat free range and organic chicken, eggs and pork because of the cruel farming practises used in that industry such as sow stalls, caged chickens etc etc but as far as I know this does not happen in our dairy industry?

That said, I only consume organic, raw and grassfed dairy mainly because it tastes so much better than the conventional stuff and I don't like the thought of drinking hormones and antibiotics.

It doesnt happen in our egg industry either (WA). I have my own chooks but if I have to choose between commercial free range or caged eggs here I go for caged. A lot of the commercial free range producers were failed traditional caged egg farmers who switched to make a buck. Their birds are far more susceptible to disease, stress etc. Remember chickens are naturally forest dwellers who want shelter not been kept by the thousands in an open paddock without places to hide. The caged industry in Australia operate to a high standard of hygiene and are closely monitored for welfare breaches. If you can buy barn eggs its the best of both worlds.

Rocbola

This will probably get lost in this long *kitten* post so here goes.

With every cent you spend on dairy, you are supporting a cruel industry that abuses animals. (This goes for eggs and meat too.) Health benefits aside, this is all the reason I need to stay away from the stuff.

Taking a crazy guess here.... You've never been on a dairy farm, have you?

Yeah, you do know that every farm operates like the one they feature on an agenda pushing documentary right? Visiting a real farm to get actual facts is out of the question, I mean how the hell would that support a failing argument?

=D

Visiting a real dairy farm IS out of the question. Big business is in bed with the g-ment, and has created many laws disallowing you from knowing what is going on behind closed doors. In many states, ag-gag laws make it a crime to use surreptitious means to get onto a farm, make it crime to whistleblow about bad conditions for both the workers and the animals, and good luck getting an invite.

Go ahead and call up a large farm and say "I'd like to visit your farm to see what conditions the animals/workers are experiencing" and see how quickly you get hung up on.

Some smaller farms might let you on, and if you continue to eat dairy, those would be the farms to patronize. Like Joel Salatin's farm.

tigersword

Oh yeah, sad to see all those documentary makers from those anti farm documentaries you watched all in jail for breaking those laws you're talking about isn't it? Oh wait, they aren't in jail, because those laws don't exist.

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ahamm002

When I was pregnant and went into my doctors office she handed me pamphlets to read about staying healthy during pregnancy and so on and so forth, and of course it talks about dairy and meats because obviously the majority of people eat that, whatever, I can ignore that, I'm pretty well versed in vegan nutrition, but you turn the page over and it was made and distributed by the Dairy Farms of America (or some such organization).

And this is why so many are confused. The big food companies, (Not just dairy) have too much mis-info masquerading as legitimate nutritional advice.

Well I'll have to actually agree with rocbola on that point. The food industry really does masquerade their propaganda as legitimate nutritional advice. However, big agriculture is just as bad if not worse than big dairy. Don't you love all those high sugar cereals that have little signs saying how heart healthy they are b/c they're low in saturated fat? Then they have pamphlets inside of them that pretend to be legitimate nutritional advice, that recommend people avoid fat and cholesterol. Meanwhile they don't mention anything about High Fructose Corn Syrup and highly refined food laden with sugar.

J72FIT

if you continue to eat dairy, those would be the farms to patronize. Like Joel Salatin's farm.

Not perfect by any stretch, but I do my best to buy my animal products organic, grass-fed, pastured and local whenever possible.

Rocbola

Well I'll have to actually agree with rocbola on that point. The food industry really does masquerade their propaganda as legitimate nutritional advice. However, big agriculture is just as bad if not worse than big dairy. Don't you love all those high sugar cereals that have little signs saying how heart healthy they are b/c they're low in saturated fat? Then they have pamphlets inside of them that pretend to be legitimate nutritional advice, that recommend people avoid fat and cholesterol. Meanwhile they don't mention anything about High Fructose Corn Syrup and highly refined food laden with sugar.

Hey, to be perfect;y honest, i think the mass produced grain food, and the HFCS and all of that crap is probably worse for you than the animals. I'm not a fan of either. I eat fruits, vegetables, seeds, nuts, legumes and sometimes whole grains.

Rocbola

This will probably get lost in this long *kitten* post so here goes.

With every cent you spend on dairy, you are supporting a cruel industry that abuses animals. (This goes for eggs and meat too.) Health benefits aside, this is all the reason I need to stay away from the stuff.

Taking a crazy guess here.... You've never been on a dairy farm, have you?

Yeah, you do know that every farm operates like the one they feature on an agenda pushing documentary right? Visiting a real farm to get actual facts is out of the question, I mean how the hell would that support a failing argument?

=D

Visiting a real dairy farm IS out of the question. Big business is in bed with the g-ment, and has created many laws disallowing you from knowing what is going on behind closed doors. In many states, ag-gag laws make it a crime to use surreptitious means to get onto a farm, make it crime to whistleblow about bad conditions for both the workers and the animals, and good luck getting an invite.

Go ahead and call up a large farm and say "I'd like to visit your farm to see what conditions the animals/workers are experiencing" and see how quickly you get hung up on.

Some smaller farms might let you on, and if you continue to eat dairy, those would be the farms to patronize. Like Joel Salatin's farm.

Links to where we can read those laws?

Just google ag-gag laws. I know that my home state, Iowa, has laws like that. I know that Colorado has some ag-gag laws, and so does Idaho. Most of them are relatively new. Even without the law, the businesses wont let you in to see their operations.

jim180155

Links to where we can read those laws?

"Just google ag-gag laws. I know that my home state, Iowa, has laws like that. I know that Colorado has some ag-gag laws, and so does Idaho. Most of them are relatively new. Even without the law, the businesses wont let you in to see their operations."
[/quote]




Interesting.

I mean, in spite of the crickets-chirping-dead-silence-from-the-fact-hungry, it's interesting.


EDIT: Having trouble trying to get the quoted parts to come out right.

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rml_16

Visiting a real dairy farm IS out of the question.

I guess the 100 or so dairy farms in the town where I grew up were fake then.

Unknown

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WendyTerry420

This will probably get lost in this long *kitten* post so here goes.

With every cent you spend on dairy, you are supporting a cruel industry that abuses animals. (This goes for eggs and meat too.) Health benefits aside, this is all the reason I need to stay away from the stuff.

Taking a crazy guess here.... You've never been on a dairy farm, have you?

I lived on a dairy farm in Germany for 6 years actually where the cows were treated as humanely as you possibly can treat an animal that you are forcibly impregnating and then stealing it's milk and separating the mother and baby from each other.

No wonder you hate dairy farms.

That is not how they ran things on my uncle's dairy farm. Mothers and their calves were not separated like that. The cows that went into the dairy barn were not moms. The moms stayed in their own barn until the calf was ready for weaning. Also, cows were not forcibly impregnated. My uncle always let nature take its course. Nature finds a way, every time, without the need for force or cruelty.

WendyTerry420

man i really want a glass of milk right now. bad.

Chocolate milk...

_John_

man i really want a glass of milk right now. bad.

Chocolate milk...

I had a glass last night after polishing off my sirloin.

jim180155

I read what it's about and it mentions you can't go there and video tape/take pictures. No where did I see that people aren't allowed in.

I didn't realize it was contagious, but it looks like you caught my quoting problem.

I didn't see anything against going in either. I read just one of the articles, an article from Forbes, thinking they'd be the most Ag-friendly, but they weren't in this case.

Whether or not you can legally visit one of the sites may be beside the point, since I'm pretty sure you'd still need explicit permission from the owner or face jail time for trespassing. But laws prohibiting photography is alarming, IMO. Even a pro-Ag person should be wondering what they're trying to hide.

WendyTerry420

Links to where we can read those laws?

"Just google ag-gag laws. I know that my home state, Iowa, has laws like that. I know that Colorado has some ag-gag laws, and so does Idaho. Most of them are relatively new. Even without the law, the businesses wont let you in to see their operations."

Interesting.

I mean, in spite of the crickets-chirping-dead-silence-from-the-fact-hungry, it's interesting.

Ag-gag is a term used for a variety of anti-whistleblower laws in the United States of America

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ag-gag



Yes, these laws exist, but here in Missouri, you can definitely visit dairy farms to see how they operate. Before my uncle passed, we visited his often. Honestly, though, my favorite part was the hay barn (for playing hide and seek) and his big "Murphy's Law" poster by his desk in the dairy barn.



Here is the law in my state:

Missouri's bill:

A person commits the crime of agricultural production facility fraud if he or she willfully obtains access to an agricultural production facility by false pretenses or knowingly makes a false statement or misrepresentation as part of an application for employment at an agricultural production facility with the intent to commit an act not authorized by the owner.[62]

Basically, it reasserts that fraud is a crime.



And compare that to Iowa:

Iowa's bill:

1. A person is guilty of agricultural production facility fraud if the person willfully does any of the following:
a. Obtains access to an agricultural production facility by false pretenses.
b. Makes a false statement or representation as part of an application or agreement to be employed at an agricultural production facility, if the person knows the statement to be false, and makes the statement with an intent to commit an act not authorized by the owner of the agricultural production facility, knowing that the act is not authorized.[63]

MO based its bill off of IA's bill.

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Eoghann

Well if you don't like dairy you can eliminate it from your diet with no worries. On the other hand if you like it... you can consume it without any worries as well.

Same rule as everything else. Make it part of a balanced diet. If your food intake for the day consists of cheese, milk and ice-cream... then you may have a problem.

Oh and the... it's for baby cows thing... I'll let you in on a secret. There isn't a food on this planet that was specifically created for humans to eat.

Pay no attention to the food fads.

_John_

posted before reading prior posts

jim180155

Links to where we can read those laws?

"Just google ag-gag laws. I know that my home state, Iowa, has laws like that. I know that Colorado has some ag-gag laws, and so does Idaho. Most of them are relatively new. Even without the law, the businesses wont let you in to see their operations."

Interesting.

I mean, in spite of the crickets-chirping-dead-silence-from-the-fact-hungry, it's interesting.

Ag-gag is a term used for a variety of anti-whistleblower laws in the United States of America

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ag-gag



Yes, these laws exist, but here in Missouri, you can definitely visit dairy farms to see how they operate. Before my uncle passed, we visited his often. Honestly, though, my favorite part was the hay barn (for playing hide and seek) and his big "Murphy's Law" poster by his desk in the dairy barn.



Here is the law in my state:

Missouri's bill:

A person commits the crime of agricultural production facility fraud if he or she willfully obtains access to an agricultural production facility by false pretenses or knowingly makes a false statement or misrepresentation as part of an application for employment at an agricultural production facility with the intent to commit an act not authorized by the owner.[62]

Basically, it reasserts that fraud is a crime.

I'm guessing your uncle would grant access to anyone curious about the inner workings of his operation. But other operations that are separating mother from calf and/or artificially inseminating cows and/or using antibiotics and/or .... The other guys would just deny access.

And the Missouri law you quoted I still find troubling. Why does that law exist? Are there similar laws for office parks, industrial complexes, pizza houses, retail stores, etc.? Why does Ag need protection?

Again, it makes me think that there is a deliberate effort to hide the actual operations from the general public.

eric_sg61