So sad with what I saw today I wanted to cry
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I am going to hop on the judging train on this one. 700 calories is just not good for you. I can only speak from personal experience and I knew someone I say "KNEW" because she is dead now but I knew someone who starved herself. She started around 250 went to a 500-800 calorie diet was on it for about 9 months lost 115 lbs.
She attempted to eat around 1500 calories after she had lost the weight and she got VERY ill, really bad thyroid issues she ended up dying at 42 of a heart attack that the doctors contributed to a combination of several factors relating to her thyroid, her constant up and down dieting. She got cold sweats constantly leading up to it, blood pressure through the roof. Her doctors even diagnosed her with a eating disorder and tried to force her to counseling... She was on a handful of medication and on her last day on earth she suffered from a heart attack and stroke...0 -
Oh and another thing I didn't mention. A month or two after hitting my goal of 'skinny' I started having seizures. I lost weight so quickly that my body/pancreas couldn't adjust to my needed insulin levels and while waiting for the bus I had a seizure and ended up laying out on the sidewalk and being ignored because apparently people just thought I was some 'drunk passed out chick'
I have medical records to back these ramblings up. I basically got reamed by the ER doctor and then by my own (who hadn't seen me during my crash dieting) doctor.
You need to satisfy your nutritional needs (and actual needs not your perceived needs) and adjust slowly. Why does the weight have to be off THIS MOMENT? Trying to drop it all crash dieting is a temporary solution, not the needed lifestyle adjustment you need to make.
/end anecdata part 2.0 -
You don't have to prove anything to anyone else. Just strive to make the best decisions for your health and think in the long term...and don't let your lifestyle choices be motivated by other people - for example, when you said you might continue eating 700 calories just to spite the naysayers.
I checked out your diary - since it's public - and I'm glad you are taking a multivitamin. You would be hard pressed to get the basic nutrients you need with the types and amounts of food you are consuming. Multivitamins are inferior when compared to the nutrients in foods, but they're definately better than nothing. I'm a little worried that you could be losing lean muscle on your current program and that's hard on your heart (your most important muscle), especially as you get older. But if your doctor says you're good to go, then just do your thing. I would try monitoring some of your other macronutrients, such as fiber and calcium, etc., just to see how balanced your diet is. Good luck! :flowerforyou:0 -
So I would like to add I just "netted" 891 calories but I didn't get a warning saying I'm eating too few calories.
Perhaps MFP realizes that you don't have to net 1200 or above but at least consume that much.0 -
Oh and another thing I didn't mention. A month or two after hitting my goal of 'skinny' I started having seizures. I lost weight so quickly that my body/pancreas couldn't adjust to my needed insulin levels and while waiting for the bus I had a seizure and ended up laying out on the sidewalk and being ignored because apparently people just thought I was some 'drunk passed out chick'
I have medical records to back these ramblings up. I basically got reamed by the ER doctor and then by my own (who hadn't seen me during my crash dieting) doctor.
You need to satisfy your nutritional needs (and actual needs not your perceived needs) and adjust slowly. Why does the weight have to be off THIS MOMENT? Trying to drop it all crash dieting is a temporary solution, not the needed lifestyle adjustment you need to make.
/end anecdata part 2.
You are not me...I am not you. We are different. Just because it happened to you does not by any means mean it's going to happen to me. Trust me I know what I'm doing and I'm fine. Come on doctors put people on less than this and they are freaking fine. If it was so bad for you they wouldn't do it to them. Again you had something going on with your body before you did the crash diet and I am not crash dieting.0 -
So I would like to add I just "netted" 891 calories but I didn't get a warning saying I'm eating too few calories.
Perhaps MFP realizes that you don't have to net 1200 or above but at least consume that much.
Yep I agree, consume it not net it. That's note worthy0 -
I know exactly what you mean. My heart goes out to people I see struggling to move about or to get out of a seat. The highest my weight has been is 207 pounds. At that weight I struggled and was easily out of breath, so when I look at people carrying even more I just can't imagine the discomfort. Additionally, the negative effects on one's physical and mental health, causing a decrease in the quality of life. I pray I continue my journey to good heath and that more and more people do the same.0
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I had something going on with my body before crash dieting? Since when? Because nothing showed up on blood work or physicals until AFTER the crash diet. Once again I have a paperwork trail to back this all up. Where's your science?
Yeah, you don't know me at all. Don't make assumptions and do NOT tell me what was going on with my body. I sure as hell did not say I was sick before crash dieting. I didn't say that ANYWHERE. You are flat out pulling things out of your *kitten*.
I didn't say you were me. I shared my experience.
You refuse to listen to science, reasoning, rationale. You gave me attitude from the first thing I was posting. Go live in your fantasy world and see what happens in the end.0 -
The OP admits that she has opened her diary in order to instigate arguments because she wants to defend her VLCD. She doesn't need you defending her.
Thanks for putting words in my mouth because that is NOT what I said. Love how people are making up stories now. What I said is I keep my diary open because I don't care who sees it and can defend my decisons on how I eat should someone feel the need to comment on it. Never said a thing about instigating anything you said that. So now this thread has taken another WRONG turn by people making up lies, Sheeesh
Just in case you missed me asking (and I apologize if I had missed an answer), why do you eat such low calories? Is it for quick weight loss? Medical reasons? If you can't lose weight on 1200 calories then you should see a doctor since there could be a medical problem. What is the reasoning behind such a low calorie diet?
I stalled and decided to kick it up a notch to start losing again. I've already started upping my intake very slowly so I don't disturb the balance I've created and don't want to gain even one pound back. I've only been eating like this for two months and starting on the third. But these people think I don't know enough about me to read the signs my body is telling me. My family doc once told me I didn't have to eat anything if I didn't want to as long as I took vitamins, of course that's outragious.0 -
I had something going on with my body before crash dieting? Since when? Because nothing showed up on blood work or physicals until AFTER the crash diet. Once again I have a paperwork trail to back this all up. Where's your science?
Yeah, you don't know me at all. Don't make assumptions and do NOT tell me what was going on with my body. I sure as hell did not say I was sick before crash dieting. I didn't say that ANYWHERE. You are flat out pulling things out of your *kitten*.
I didn't say you were me. I shared my experience.
You refuse to listen to science, reasoning, rationale. You gave me attitude from the first thing I was posting. Go live in your fantasy world and see what happens in the end.
I can't tell you how many people I know eat about 500 calories a day and have non of these problems. One of which had a heart attack two months before starting the diet and she's been going strong for damn near a year now. I know another lady that went on a liquid diet having 500 calories a day for 9 months and she's had non of these problems. Your right I don't know you but you don't know me and yet you felt the need to jump on the band wagon and explain what happened to you and warn me it was going to happen to me too. We are two different people. I don't have high blood pressure, I don't have diabetes, I don't have high cholesterol and my goal is to NOT have all these things. This is not a fantasy this is my real life, and I'm good.0 -
And there we have it. The OP's beliefs are founded on old wive's methods rather than any actual science.I had something going on with my body before crash dieting? Since when? Because nothing showed up on blood work or physicals until AFTER the crash diet. Once again I have a paperwork trail to back this all up. Where's your science?
Yeah, you don't know me at all. Don't make assumptions and do NOT tell me what was going on with my body. I sure as hell did not say I was sick before crash dieting. I didn't say that ANYWHERE. You are flat out pulling things out of your *kitten*.
I didn't say you were me. I shared my experience.
You refuse to listen to science, reasoning, rationale. You gave me attitude from the first thing I was posting. Go live in your fantasy world and see what happens in the end.
I can't tell you how many people I know eat about 500 calories a day and have non of these problems. One of which had a heart attack two months before starting the diet and she's been going strong for damn near a year now. I know another lady that went on a liquid diet having 500 calories a day for 9 months and she's had non of these problems. Your right I don't know you but you don't know me and yet you felt the need to jump on the band wagon and explain what happened to you and warn me it was going to happen to me too. We are two different people. I don't have high blood pressure, I don't have diabetes, I don't have high cholesterol and my goal is to NOT have all these things. This is not a fantasy this is my real life, and I'm good.0 -
after reading everything written in these comments my only question has become how people are getting angry at the people trying to share information on how a LOW LOW calorie diet is harmful while making comments about how changing your life and becoming healthier is such a beautiful thing. Eating like that isn't going to make anyone healthier. You are trading in a fat unhealthy for a less fat unhealthy. If you are here to get healthier than expect people to talk to you about ACTUALLY getting healthier. That is all.
Edit: Sorry that was't all. I forgot the bacon!
Doctors (like bariatric surgery ones) prescribe 800 calorie diets. Its okay for morbidly obese people, certain considerations taken, until they reach a more reasonable weight. And you better not forget the bacon!
Just one thing...someone may have already mentioned this, but I'm too lazy to read all the way through several pages of posts, but I HATE this argument with a passion! My diet is currently supervised by a bariatric surgeon, and there is no way he would prescribe an 800 calorie diet pre-op. Nor would any of his colleagues. Why? Because that's not enough calories to sustain a person who hasn't had body-altering surgery long term. Post-surgery, yes, you can and most likely will consume 800 calories or less during the weight loss phase, but they bring you back up gradually into maintenance once you reach your goal. The only time during the pre-op phase that a reputable bariatric surgeon would sanction a diet that low in caloric value would be in the two weeks immediately preceding the surgery, and even that is a specifically controlled situation, designed to reduce the mass of the patient's liver to lessen the chance of complications while on the operating table.
That said, and sorry to explode on you...I'm not normally so volatile with complete strangers...I fall into the camp with those who say that a very low calorie diet, IN CONJUNCTION WITH MEDICAL SUPERVISION, is vastly preferable to the damage done by continuing morbid obesity and the more than likely nutritionally void diet that goes with it. The important part here is that no one should ever prescribe this for themselves, and shouldn't undertake it long term, or without consistent monitoring. It's pretty much a Solomon's choice...there are very serious risks on both sides of that line, and it's up to us to be informed about the decisions we make about our bodies.
Again, my apologies for the verbal sonic boom...you just happened to dance right on my trigger!0 -
I can tell you dozens - close to 50 people I know PERSONALLY who have had these problems. And you are only a few months in - you have said so yourself. It took me 8 or 9 months and then my body started shutting down.
No where did I say 'hey THIS WILL HAPPEN TO YOU'. If you had any ability to comprehend my very easy to understand post - I said hey, this happened to me. this can happen. i hope it does not. That is all I said. Then you jumped on my *kitten*. I never judged you and I repeatedly wished you luck and you just kept on my case.
You are lying in your posts at a few points - where the hell do you get off criticizing me for my life 'before' the crash diet? I was healthy too - no diabetes, perfect cholesterol, no blood pressure issues, no thyroid issues, nothing. I was 'healthy' during the crash diet too. No problems at all.
So you pulling this 'oh you had problems before' thing is ridiculous. Nowhere did I state that. Reading comprehension - seriously try it. You are old enough that you should be able to comprehend such a simple thing, Terri.0 -
Thanks for the informative post, moxiecowgirl. I thought that's what my friend had told me her doctor had said, but I had no experience with it to back it up.0
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She doesn't want to listen. I hope eventually she does.0
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Starvation mode isn't a myth, it's a misnomer. It just encompasses a whole host of negative symptoms from eating too little over an extended period of time; metabolic slowdown, organ damage, hair loss etc etc. The term itself is misleading but the effects of it are very, very real.
Thank you for sharing this. That took courage. I hope people can learn from your experience.Totally anecdata.
I lost around 115lbs on 700-800 a day and lots of excercise.
I now have serious intestinal issues, stomach issues, thyroid issues, along with other serious problems etc. I was healthier 'fatter' before I lost all the weight starvation mode then I was when I made it to 'skinny'
Then I gained it all back. Now I am losing it all the right way - moderation. I may not be anywhere near the 'perfect' diet - but losing it slowly while getting enough calories and adjusting to fill my nutritional needs as best as I can is how I am doing it now and it is going damn well.
I don't believe 1200 is a magic number, but I just don't wish to see someone fall apart the way I did after losing weight that way.
Her experiance and hers alone, not everyone experiances this. And I seriously doubt Starvation mode played a part in any of her issue because it's a myth. I see people every day eating less than me and have no issues like this. Everyone is different and reacts differently to things. Lost any confindence in the post as soon as Starvation mode was mentioned.
Myth..you believe what you want I'll believe what I want.
You don't believe people starve?0 -
You don't believe people starve?
Starvation mode and starvation are not one in the same.0 -
Starvation mode isn't a myth, it's a misnomer. It just encompasses a whole host of negative symptoms from eating too little over an extended period of time; metabolic slowdown, organ damage, hair loss etc etc. The term itself is misleading but the effects of it are very, very real.
Thank you for sharing this. That took courage. I hope people can learn from your experience.Totally anecdata.
I lost around 115lbs on 700-800 a day and lots of excercise.
I now have serious intestinal issues, stomach issues, thyroid issues, along with other serious problems etc. I was healthier 'fatter' before I lost all the weight starvation mode then I was when I made it to 'skinny'
Then I gained it all back. Now I am losing it all the right way - moderation. I may not be anywhere near the 'perfect' diet - but losing it slowly while getting enough calories and adjusting to fill my nutritional needs as best as I can is how I am doing it now and it is going damn well.
I don't believe 1200 is a magic number, but I just don't wish to see someone fall apart the way I did after losing weight that way.
Her experiance and hers alone, not everyone experiances this. And I seriously doubt Starvation mode played a part in any of her issue because it's a myth. I see people every day eating less than me and have no issues like this. Everyone is different and reacts differently to things. Lost any confindence in the post as soon as Starvation mode was mentioned.
Myth..you believe what you want I'll believe what I want.
You don't believe people starve?
I don't believe I'm starving and I don't believe that starvation mode exists at least for us in this country. Yes I know people go hungry but they aren't in this starvation mode.
The only thing missing in my diet is Iron and I know I need that but my body doesn't deal well with the pill form of Iron. I will have to look into things that have more Iron in it.0 -
You don't believe people starve?
Starvation mode and starvation are not one in the same.
yeah what she said :laugh:0 -
And there we have it. The OP's beliefs are founded on old wive's methods rather than any actual science.I had something going on with my body before crash dieting? Since when? Because nothing showed up on blood work or physicals until AFTER the crash diet. Once again I have a paperwork trail to back this all up. Where's your science?
Yeah, you don't know me at all. Don't make assumptions and do NOT tell me what was going on with my body. I sure as hell did not say I was sick before crash dieting. I didn't say that ANYWHERE. You are flat out pulling things out of your *kitten*.
I didn't say you were me. I shared my experience.
You refuse to listen to science, reasoning, rationale. You gave me attitude from the first thing I was posting. Go live in your fantasy world and see what happens in the end.
I can't tell you how many people I know eat about 500 calories a day and have non of these problems. One of which had a heart attack two months before starting the diet and she's been going strong for damn near a year now. I know another lady that went on a liquid diet having 500 calories a day for 9 months and she's had non of these problems. Your right I don't know you but you don't know me and yet you felt the need to jump on the band wagon and explain what happened to you and warn me it was going to happen to me too. We are two different people. I don't have high blood pressure, I don't have diabetes, I don't have high cholesterol and my goal is to NOT have all these things. This is not a fantasy this is my real life, and I'm good.
Old wives method? Try my workout partner, the one I walk with daily and not to mention my boss. And her boss, and her sister and my sister in law's sister, and a dozen other people close to me. Yeah old wive's with new bodies.0 -
I don't believe I'm starving and I don't believe that starvation mode exists at least for us in this country. Yes I know people go hungry but they aren't in this starvation mode.
The only thing missing in my diet is Iron and I know I need that but my body doesn't deal well with the pill form of Iron. I will have to look into things that have more Iron in it.
Starvation mode does not exist in this country? WTF are you on?
I see you choose not to respond to my post - the tale of someone who has actually been through this. I believe this will be my last post because you are in fantasy land and you do not understand long term consequences. You are being willfully ignorant.0 -
That rips my heart out as well....how can people do that to themselves?
So be it....:ohwell:
And anybody here not eating at least 1200 calories per day in addition to exercise calories will end up just like that.
We can lose weight on the front end just to gain it all back.
COUNT ME OUT!
*Get's on my knees and thanks God for his miracle*
With friends like this who needs enemies
God made your body a temple and would like you to treat it properly. It's rather hypocritical to thank God for his miracle, yet abuse the body that he gave you. In my opinion.
You are so right, which is why I'm working for a better me, a better body. It's a beautiful thing0 -
You don't believe people starve?
Starvation mode and starvation are not one in the same.
They are the same thing. Starvation mode is just the early signs/process of starvation.0 -
Bump0
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:grumble: I seriously don't understand if you are on MFP, using MFP, and then get on MFP Forums to argue against basically MFP. It makes me scratch my head. You are using a system that sets you at a deficiet and then tells you to eat back your exercise calories but then you get on forums to argue about the very system you are using. :huh:
Clearly it's not being used properly.
My fear with calorie totals like that, is an eating disorder. And I think the people who are displaying concern have no ulterior motive, it's just concern for one who is starving their body.
Furthermore in my opinon those who try and justify such a drastically low diet, are probably doing the same damage to their body.
To each their own. But there are many including myself comfortable with saying "that's not really healthy or ok"
Ditto!!
And I for one, would rather someone tell me when I'm stuffing up, than pamper to my whims. Honesty all the way for me. If someone can show me a better way, I'm all for hearing it.0 -
Thanks to everyone who posted about the dangers of very low calorie diets. A few years ago, I unintentionally went on a LCD - I eliminated ALL refined carbs (well, except alcohol in social situations), ate very, very little whole grains, and basically existed on vegetables, fruits, chicken, beef, and protein shakes. I meant to be healthy, but started having serious stomach pains and roseacea (related to an underactive thyroid). Sad to say I gained back all the weight I had worked so hard to loose (50-60lbs in 6 months) but I am working now to loose the weight again slowly. I thank you b/c this process is frustrating and I was tinkering with the idea of instituting my former diet plan - But now I can see now that the symptoms I was starting to develop may have only gotten worse if I continued. So, it will remain excrutiatingly slow pound by pound loss for me.
And to the OP, I think it's fine if you want to loose weight your way. But, with so many people reporting serious consequences to LCDs, I think it would be wise if you went to your primary care physician every three to six months for a check up. And then just revise your eating habits if you begin to feel any of the physical effects described in the above posts. If you feel fine, and your bloodwork is fine, then you are probably fine. Best of luck to you.0 -
I don't believe I'm starving and I don't believe that starvation mode exists at least for us in this country. Yes I know people go hungry but they aren't in this starvation mode.
The only thing missing in my diet is Iron and I know I need that but my body doesn't deal well with the pill form of Iron. I will have to look into things that have more Iron in it.
Starvation mode does not exist in this country? WTF are you on?
I see you choose not to respond to my post - the tale of someone who has actually been through this. I believe this will be my last post because you are in fantasy land and you do not understand long term consequences. You are being willfully ignorant.
You've been thru what a doctor who believes in starvation mode told you. I happen to not believe it. I am NOT being willfully ignorant, I've done my research and I've talked to my doctors and we are good with where I am right now. I'm sorry you had such a horrible experiance with eating low cals, maybe you did it longer than you should have I don't know but I'm telling you I don't believe in Starvation Mode. I'm around to many people who have been eating low for long periods of time and I'm telling you non of them have ever experiance what your saying you experianced. NON of them. I'm not trying to argue with you I'm just trying to make YOU understand that I've got this. What happened to you had to be from something else, or maybe not, I don't know, but I don't believe you were in Starvation Mode. And everything I've read says Starvation Mode does not exist in this country or any where at all except third world countries.
Good night
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“It ain’t what you don’t know that gets you into trouble. It’s what you know for sure that just ain’t so.”
-Mark Twain0 -
You are an idiot. That's that. I've been to multiple doctors and nutritionists who understand how the human body works.
You do not. At all.
You will see. That's that.0 -
Just wanted to make that clear in case there were any misunderstandings.
If this sign was on the paths where I run I'd be F'D!
I envy your ability to just whip it out and go as you please without having to squat and wipe.
wiping's overrated
Not when you have a vagina.
best laugh of the day :laugh:
Absolutely hilarious!0
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