MFP has changed

It's being pointed out before but bears repeating.

Everything single person complaining about rudeness or un supportiveness has been here a number of years and have very few posts. I have never seen a single one of them giving advice, information, support. Never helped out a newbie. Just pop up occasionally to moan about meanies.

Now the ones who are getting accused have thousands of posts. I see them every day giving fitness tips, advice on getting started, moral support, encouraging comments. Again and again, same people. For free. Because they want to help people.

If MFP has changed well then good

It's being pointed out before but bears repeating.

Everything single person complaining about rudeness or un supportiveness has been here a number of years and have very few posts. I have never seen a single one of them giving advice, information, support. Never helped out a newbie. Just pop up occasionally to moan about meanies.

Now the ones who are getting accused have thousands of posts. I see them every day giving fitness tips, advice on getting started, moral support, encouraging comments. Again and again, same people. For free. Because they want to help people.

If MFP has changed well then good

Umm, no.

To disprove that, you can look at the number of posts I currently have, and while doing so you can look at the posts I've replied to. You are making a very broad assumption.

And as said by other members in this thread, many lurk the forums and do not wish to participate after witnessing people being torn to shreds by "asking stupid questions," or not bending to the tune of others. There are no stupid questions.

Facts are facts. If you burn more than you consume you will lose weight. But HOW you lose that weight is up to debate. There are so many variables. What works for some may not work for others. Some say yes to the 1200 cals a day diet, some say no. I've seen people have success both ways.

There are elder mfp members who get annoyed at answering the same questions time and time again. I am a teacher by profession. That's what teachers do, new students come in, and you re-iterate the same knowledge year after year. Now even though I'm grown, there will be the 5 year old that will SWEAR to me 1+1=11. Can I make rude remarks to him because of that? No. When he does a test and fails to show the proper answer, can I stick a cat gif sticker on his paper? Patience, encouragement and time is needed to help guide him/her to the correct answer. With a stern hand, yes, but never in a way to make the student feel dumb, small etc etc.

If you are not willing to have the time and patience to explain something to someone, why bother trying at all?
And lastly, people will think what they will at the end of the day. If that student wants to think 1+1=11 for the rest of his life, so be it. I did my part, I tried, and sadly failed. That being said, he probably won't go very far. He'll figure that out for himself.

It's being pointed out before but bears repeating.

Everything single person complaining about rudeness or un supportiveness has been here a number of years and have very few posts. I have never seen a single one of them giving advice, information, support. Never helped out a newbie. Just pop up occasionally to moan about meanies.

Now the ones who are getting accused have thousands of posts. I see them every day giving fitness tips, advice on getting started, moral support, encouraging comments. Again and again, same people. For free. Because they want to help people.

If MFP has changed well then good

Umm, no.

To disprove that, you can look at the number of posts I currently have, and while doing so you can look at the posts I've replied to. You are making a very broad assumption.

And as said by other members in this thread, many lurk the forums and do not wish to participate after witnessing people being torn to shreds by "asking stupid questions," or not bending to the tune of others. There are no stupid questions.

Facts are facts. If you burn more than you consume you will lose weight. But HOW you lose that weight is up to debate. There are so many variables. What works for some may not work for others. Some say yes to the 1200 cals a day diet, some say no. I've seen people have success both ways.

There are elder mfp members who get annoyed at answering the same questions time and time again. I am a teacher by profession. That's what teachers do, new students come in, and you re-iterate the same knowledge year after year. Now even though I'm grown, there will be the 5 year old that will SWEAR to me 1+1=11. Can I make rude remarks to him because of that? No. When he does a test and fails to show the proper answer, can I stick a cat gif sticker on his paper? Patience, encouragement and time is needed to help guide him/her to the correct answer. With a stern hand, yes, but never in a way to make the student feel dumb, small etc etc.

If you are not willing to have the time and patience to explain something to someone, why bother trying at all?
And lastly, people will think what they will at the end of the day. If that student wants to think 1+1=11 for the rest of his life, so be it. I did my part, I tried, and sadly failed. That being said, he probably won't go very far. He'll figure that out for himself.

I have become more of a lurker on the main MFP forums in the last year or so because of the climate here. I have found the greatest motivation and support on this site to come from friends or groups. I have never understood the hostility and meanness, especially on something that is as difficult as weight loss. If it was so easy, none of us would even be on MFP. If life never got in the way, ex. law school, then weight loss and fitness would not be the billion dollar industry it is. It is hard to lose weight. It is hard to stay committed. It is hard to workout everyday when you have other obligations. It is hard to change unhealthy habits you have had your entire life. This is why support and motivation is important, because your post could be the difference between someone making a change in their life for the better or continuing on a bad path.

Of course it would be great if everyone had a thick skin and if tough love worked like a a magic pill, but that is not the reality. These topics are common and they tend to bring out many of the posters who have made a habit of making others uncomfortable with their tough love.. But i say to those members, have you ever thought that maybe that person isn't ready for your help or missed the message based on your delivery. Attacking them, insulting them or making fun of them doesn't help anyone. So if help is what you truly want to offer then recognize that some posters will be sensitive, insecure, uniformed or just not interested and tough love or brutal honesty may not be the best course of action for everyone.

WHO?!? No, seriously, who in this thread is behaving in the forums in a way in which you disapprove? Cite an example. If it's me, use my post history if it helps. It's (admittedly stupidly) open for all the world to see. Years of posts...thousands upon thousands of them. If it is others to whom you're referring with the bolded comment, then please, give us an example.

Or is it as it so often seems to be the case an idea that you're raging against, and that "mean people" are a convenient scapegoat?

It's like the elusive toxins that are eliminated in a "cleanse" that otherwise wouldn't be eliminated while eating food. So many people are convinced there are, but when challenged, no one can provide the name of even one of them.

Are there people who misbehave on MFP? Absolutely. It would be naive to believe otherwise...but these claims such as "These topics are common and they tend to bring out many of the posters..." seem to me to be nothing more than baseless accusations against a nameless group with which I suspect those raging against them have some kind of personal vendetta as their primary motivation.

I have read this entire thread and you have posted numerous times. You have requested examples of your behavior in other threads. I am not familiar with you so I don't know what you do. No one can dispute that topics such as these are relatively common on MFP and have been around at least a weekly basis since I joined years ago. Clearly it is a problem. Chances are, if you can't acknowledge the problem exists, you are part of the problem. I post about the trials and tribulations of weight loss and none of that strikes a chord with you, just the part about posters making others uncomfortable. Perhaps you should remind yourself what made you decide to get on this fitness journey and all the setbacks you had along the way and pull from that the next time you want to offer advice to others. If am sure it will be better received and much more appreciated.

I've requested examples of *anyone's* behavior, not just my own. I'm offering my own posting history to try to make it easier for those hurling insults at the undefined "mean people" group to provide some bases for their claims.

You're not familiar with me in the forums, and yet you know what is wrong with how I post in the forums? And you have advice on ways I can improve on it? How do you know what impact I've had on others here? I mean, I know based on the numerous PMs I receive, but how do *you* know anything about it???

And you're completely unfamiliar with me yet you have assumptions about my "fitness journey"? Do you assume that everyone here is like you, thinks like you, has had similar experiences as you? How very presumptuous of you.

I am not being presumptuous. I know nothing about how you conduct yourself other than on this particular topic. You have spent pages debating that this behavior does not exist. It does. . Examples actually have been given over the last 8 pages, like the Law School post mentioned by the OP. You may not perceived the posts as rude or mean, but others have. Now you can respect the feelings of other posters or continue to disregard it. You may have been very successful at helping others and could receive countless PMs thanking you everyday, but if your words turned just one person off or made someone retreat who really needed to make a change, wouldn't you want to reevaluate your approach?

I have seen many say that they are being blunt and honest because they want to help. Well if you want to help, then that means you also need to be able to listen and understand where the people you help are coming from. They shouldn't repeatedly have to say that they feel attacked or insulted or uncomfortable for you to realize that a one size fits all approach is not going to work for everyone. Tact, manners, compassion doesn't cost a thing and could make a huge difference when trying to reach those who need help. Again, I don't know your journey, but a day probably came when you made a decision to make a change. I am sure it wasn't completely smooth sailing along the way. You may have had some trial and error. You likely had days when your commitment was tested. That understanding is what posters need. So if a newbie says law school made me fat, berating them for their bad choices is not helpful at all. I'm speaking in general terms now, since I don't know your post history. Telling that newbie, law school is stressful and time is limited, it is easy to make bad choices when you are dealing with limited time and stress. But if you want to make your health a priority, then you have to make a change by doing A, B,C,D......You can inspire or dictate, which one do you thing is more effective.

I love it when people with no experience think they can tell you how to do something better. When I have seen you in the forums responding to people EVERY. SINGLE. DAY. *then* you have room to lecture. This is like the person who has never stepped foot in a classroom waxing on about the problem with the modern day education system. Yea there are problems, you want to fix it, start by actively participating.

Actually I have 3 years experience in the MFP world as opposed to your one. I don't have to post thousands of times to understand the climate here. There was a time when I did post daily. There was a time when I did call out posts that I thought were negative and mean. I posted several kumbaya topics that were overtaken by the negative posters. I became annoyed and disenchanted with this site. I wonder how many others left the main forums for this reason. I have found support and positivity through my MFP friends and the group forums. The mean and snarky comments don't have to be directed at me, They aren't inspiring and do nothing to help me on my journey. All they do is feed the ego of a small few who would rather demean than offer support.

It's being pointed out before but bears repeating.

Everything single person complaining about rudeness or un supportiveness has been here a number of years and have very few posts. I have never seen a single one of them giving advice, information, support. Never helped out a newbie. Just pop up occasionally to moan about meanies.

Now the ones who are getting accused have thousands of posts. I see them every day giving fitness tips, advice on getting started, moral support, encouraging comments. Again and again, same people. For free. Because they want to help people.

If MFP has changed well then good

Umm, no.

To disprove that, you can look at the number of posts I currently have, and while doing so you can look at the posts I've replied to. You are making a very broad assumption.

And as said by other members in this thread, many lurk the forums and do not wish to participate after witnessing people being torn to shreds by "asking stupid questions," or not bending to the tune of others. There are no stupid questions.

Facts are facts. If you burn more than you consume you will lose weight. But HOW you lose that weight is up to debate. There are so many variables. What works for some may not work for others. Some say yes to the 1200 cals a day diet, some say no. I've seen people have success both ways.

There are elder mfp members who get annoyed at answering the same questions time and time again. I am a teacher by profession. That's what teachers do, new students come in, and you re-iterate the same knowledge year after year. Now even though I'm grown, there will be the 5 year old that will SWEAR to me 1+1=11. Can I make rude remarks to him because of that? No. When he does a test and fails to show the proper answer, can I stick a cat gif sticker on his paper? Patience, encouragement and time is needed to help guide him/her to the correct answer. With a stern hand, yes, but never in a way to make the student feel dumb, small etc etc.

If you are not willing to have the time and patience to explain something to someone, why bother trying at all?
And lastly, people will think what they will at the end of the day. If that student wants to think 1+1=11 for the rest of his life, so be it. I did my part, I tried, and sadly failed. That being said, he probably won't go very far. He'll figure that out for himself.

So, as a teacher, do you like listening to people who have never set foot in a classroom telling you about how awful and lazy teachers are, how they don't care about their students, how those who can do and those who can't teach? Ever think that the people who are on here every day and have been helping for years *might* feel the same way about getting lectured for how they do things?

People stereotype, so no, it does not bother me. I explain to them what I do in the classroom, and if they don't like what I have to say then I let my work be the example.

And the people that are on here and give great advice in good spirit shouldn't care about this thread, because they would know it does not apply to them. I think the ones that are guilty are the ones making all the fuss.

I posted a topic the other day about gaining weight and I got so many replies from elder mfpers. I thanked them, and I would like to take the time to thank all the elders that have been supportive and encouraging and have built mfp into what it is today. These comments about "mean" people do not apply to you.

However, I will not accept or support those who feel entitled because they've been on MFP for 3 yrs, and have lost 100 pounds, so they think they can be rude when giving advice. Or get mad when newbies post the same question over and over again. We were all newbies once.

Her point was that people like you complain about the advice givers while not actually giving advice yourselves. You have 63 posts in 18 months. I don't see how any of the words you just typed negates her point

It's being pointed out before but bears repeating.

Everything single person complaining about rudeness or un supportiveness has been here a number of years and have very few posts. I have never seen a single one of them giving advice, information, support. Never helped out a newbie. Just pop up occasionally to moan about meanies.

Now the ones who are getting accused have thousands of posts. I see them every day giving fitness tips, advice on getting started, moral support, encouraging comments. Again and again, same people. For free. Because they want to help people.

If MFP has changed well then good

Umm, no.

To disprove that, you can look at the number of posts I currently have, and while doing so you can look at the posts I've replied to. You are making a very broad assumption.

And as said by other members in this thread, many lurk the forums and do not wish to participate after witnessing people being torn to shreds by "asking stupid questions," or not bending to the tune of others. There are no stupid questions.

Facts are facts. If you burn more than you consume you will lose weight. But HOW you lose that weight is up to debate. There are so many variables. What works for some may not work for others. Some say yes to the 1200 cals a day diet, some say no. I've seen people have success both ways.

There are elder mfp members who get annoyed at answering the same questions time and time again. I am a teacher by profession. That's what teachers do, new students come in, and you re-iterate the same knowledge year after year. Now even though I'm grown, there will be the 5 year old that will SWEAR to me 1+1=11. Can I make rude remarks to him because of that? No. When he does a test and fails to show the proper answer, can I stick a cat gif sticker on his paper? Patience, encouragement and time is needed to help guide him/her to the correct answer. With a stern hand, yes, but never in a way to make the student feel dumb, small etc etc.

If you are not willing to have the time and patience to explain something to someone, why bother trying at all?
And lastly, people will think what they will at the end of the day. If that student wants to think 1+1=11 for the rest of his life, so be it. I did my part, I tried, and sadly failed. That being said, he probably won't go very far. He'll figure that out for himself.

So, as a teacher, do you like listening to people who have never set foot in a classroom telling you about how awful and lazy teachers are, how they don't care about their students, how those who can do and those who can't teach? Ever think that the people who are on here every day and have been helping for years *might* feel the same way about getting lectured for how they do things?

People stereotype, so no, it does not bother me. I explain to them what I do in the classroom, and if they don't like what I have to say then I let my work be the example.

And the people that are on here and give great advice in good spirit shouldn't care about this thread, because they would know it does not apply to them. I think the ones that are guilty are the ones making all the fuss.

I posted a topic the other day about gaining weight and I got so many replies from elder mfpers. I thanked them, and I would like to take the time to thank all the elders that have been supportive and encouraging and have built mfp into what it is today. These comments about "mean" people do not apply to you.

However, I will not accept or support those who feel entitled because they've been on MFP for 3 yrs, and have lost 100 pounds, so they think they can be rude when giving advice. Or get mad when newbies post the same question over and over again. We were all newbies once.

I have become more of a lurker on the main MFP forums in the last year or so because of the climate here. I have found the greatest motivation and support on this site to come from friends or groups. I have never understood the hostility and meanness, especially on something that is as difficult as weight loss. If it was so easy, none of us would even be on MFP. If life never got in the way, ex. law school, then weight loss and fitness would not be the billion dollar industry it is. It is hard to lose weight. It is hard to stay committed. It is hard to workout everyday when you have other obligations. It is hard to change unhealthy habits you have had your entire life. This is why support and motivation is important, because your post could be the difference between someone making a change in their life for the better or continuing on a bad path.

Of course it would be great if everyone had a thick skin and if tough love worked like a a magic pill, but that is not the reality. These topics are common and they tend to bring out many of the posters who have made a habit of making others uncomfortable with their tough love.. But i say to those members, have you ever thought that maybe that person isn't ready for your help or missed the message based on your delivery. Attacking them, insulting them or making fun of them doesn't help anyone. So if help is what you truly want to offer then recognize that some posters will be sensitive, insecure, uniformed or just not interested and tough love or brutal honesty may not be the best course of action for everyone.

WHO?!? No, seriously, who in this thread is behaving in the forums in a way in which you disapprove? Cite an example. If it's me, use my post history if it helps. It's (admittedly stupidly) open for all the world to see. Years of posts...thousands upon thousands of them. If it is others to whom you're referring with the bolded comment, then please, give us an example.

Or is it as it so often seems to be the case an idea that you're raging against, and that "mean people" are a convenient scapegoat?

It's like the elusive toxins that are eliminated in a "cleanse" that otherwise wouldn't be eliminated while eating food. So many people are convinced there are, but when challenged, no one can provide the name of even one of them.

Are there people who misbehave on MFP? Absolutely. It would be naive to believe otherwise...but these claims such as "These topics are common and they tend to bring out many of the posters..." seem to me to be nothing more than baseless accusations against a nameless group with which I suspect those raging against them have some kind of personal vendetta as their primary motivation.

I have read this entire thread and you have posted numerous times. You have requested examples of your behavior in other threads. I am not familiar with you so I don't know what you do. No one can dispute that topics such as these are relatively common on MFP and have been around at least a weekly basis since I joined years ago. Clearly it is a problem. Chances are, if you can't acknowledge the problem exists, you are part of the problem. I post about the trials and tribulations of weight loss and none of that strikes a chord with you, just the part about posters making others uncomfortable. Perhaps you should remind yourself what made you decide to get on this fitness journey and all the setbacks you had along the way and pull from that the next time you want to offer advice to others. If am sure it will be better received and much more appreciated.

I've requested examples of *anyone's* behavior, not just my own. I'm offering my own posting history to try to make it easier for those hurling insults at the undefined "mean people" group to provide some bases for their claims.

You're not familiar with me in the forums, and yet you know what is wrong with how I post in the forums? And you have advice on ways I can improve on it? How do you know what impact I've had on others here? I mean, I know based on the numerous PMs I receive, but how do *you* know anything about it???

And you're completely unfamiliar with me yet you have assumptions about my "fitness journey"? Do you assume that everyone here is like you, thinks like you, has had similar experiences as you? How very presumptuous of you.

I am not being presumptuous. I know nothing about how you conduct yourself other than on this particular topic. You have spent pages debating that this behavior does not exist. It does. . Examples actually have been given over the last 8 pages, like the Law School post mentioned by the OP. You may not perceived the posts as rude or mean, but others have. Now you can respect the feelings of other posters or continue to disregard it. You may have been very successful at helping others and could receive countless PMs thanking you everyday, but if your words turned just one person off or made someone retreat who really needed to make a change, wouldn't you want to reevaluate your approach?

I have seen many say that they are being blunt and honest because they want to help. Well if you want to help, then that means you also need to be able to listen and understand where the people you help are coming from. They shouldn't repeatedly have to say that they feel attacked or insulted or uncomfortable for you to realize that a one size fits all approach is not going to work for everyone. Tact, manners, compassion doesn't cost a thing and could make a huge difference when trying to reach those who need help. Again, I don't know your journey, but a day probably came when you made a decision to make a change. I am sure it wasn't completely smooth sailing along the way. You may have had some trial and error. You likely had days when your commitment was tested. That understanding is what posters need. So if a newbie says law school made me fat, berating them for their bad choices is not helpful at all. I'm speaking in general terms now, since I don't know your post history. Telling that newbie, law school is stressful and time is limited, it is easy to make bad choices when you are dealing with limited time and stress. But if you want to make your health a priority, then you have to make a change by doing A, B,C,D......You can inspire or dictate, which one do you thing is more effective.

I love it when people with no experience think they can tell you how to do something better. When I have seen you in the forums responding to people EVERY. SINGLE. DAY. *then* you have room to lecture. This is like the person who has never stepped foot in a classroom waxing on about the problem with the modern day education system. Yea there are problems, you want to fix it, start by actively participating.

Actually I have 3 years experience in the MFP world as opposed to your one. I don't have to post thousands of times to understand the climate here. There was a time when I did post daily. There was a time when I did call out posts that I thought were negative and mean. I posted several kumbaya topics that were overtaken by the negative posters. I became annoyed and disenchanted with this site. I wonder how many others left the main forums for this reason. I have found support and positivity through my MFP friends and the group forums. The mean and snarky comments don't have to be directed at me, They aren't inspiring and do nothing to help me on my journey. All they do is feed the ego of a small few who would rather demean than offer support.

We're discussing participation in the forums, not time using the app. You want hand holding and kumbaya because that's what works for you and assume it's what every one else should want too. Guess what, nothing would make me drop this site faster, I find that sort of stuff saccharine and entirely nauseating. Luckily, I don't have to cater to your likes and wishes and you don't have to cater to mine. You don't like snark and don't want other people to be able to come in to your thread, don't use the public forums, make your own group. Public forums are open to everyone. Some of us on the public forums enjoy gifs and snark. Being lectured by holier than thou types gets pretty old really fast, but no matter how many times we complain we can't make you guys go away either. Freedom of speech sucks don't it? You can wag your finger all you want at this point all I'm hearing is someone blowing raspberries.

See it is pointless. The reason why so many complain about the main forums is because there are people who have no interest in truly being someone's fitness pal. Motivation and support gets a back seat to snark and gifs. They are mean because they are telling it like it is, But in reality, they are mean because they want to be mean. Yes we are free to express ourselves anyway we choose, but we could be better people. Many joined MFP because they wanted to be better. They are trying to get healthy and fit, but others have no respect for their fellow members or the fitness journey.

Soooo..... I'm a bit dense, so could someone explain to me how the burden of proof works around here? Some of you are saying that the mere existence of mean people threads proves that the site is broken because of the mean people. Then why doesn't the presence of Success Stories threads prove that the site works as it is? Why don't the thank you PMs and overflowing FRs sent to the "mean people" prove that they (we) have a role to play on MFP as well?

Soooo..... I'm a bit dense, so could someone explain to me how the burden of proof works around here? Some of you are saying that the mere existence of mean people threads proves that the site is broken because of the mean people. Then why doesn't the presence of Success Stories threads prove that the site works as it is? Why don't the thank you PMs and overflowing FRs sent to the "mean people" prove that they (we) have a role to play on MFP as well?

What, you mean like this:
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1088600-dear-mean-people-of-mfp

Soooo..... I'm a bit dense, so could someone explain to me how the burden of proof works around here? Some of you are saying that the mere existence of mean people threads proves that the site is broken because of the mean people. Then why doesn't the presence of Success Stories threads prove that the site works as it is? Why don't the thank you PMs and overflowing FRs sent to the "mean people" prove that they (we) have a role to play on MFP as well?

Again, success is variable to different people. A success story is personal, it won't apply to all. Some people have success when others are "mean" to them. Some don't. This site works differently for everybody.

I think as a rule of thumb though, it pays to be nice. If you are friends with the person on mfp, know their character, and know that responding negatively or rudely will motivate them, keep on keeping on! But on the forums when a lot of the times you don't even know the person, and what they're dealing with, who they are, what issues they may have, the snarkiness should not be present.