If calories in-calories out is immutable...
Replies
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_Terrapin_ wrote: »...why such variation in resulting weight loss?
I am a very routine person and a logical thinker. I have needed to lose about 50lbs for about 4 years. I'm 37 & female, btw.
When I choose a diet plan, I seem to be able to shed 6-8 lbs...then nothing. I understand the things I may do to sabotage my diet...like not tracking accurately or "cheating". But what about when I do the same things, week after week, and one week I lose 2 lbs, then the next none.
It's so disheartening and it's usually the reason I fall off most diets after about 3 months.
I find it so hard to lose over 6-8 lbs, that I wonder if maybe something else is going on--insulin resistance or pcos?
I'd love some input and advice.
About three weeks ago I started alternate day fasting. I lost 6lbs in two weeks....now nothing. But this has happened with every diet I've tried.
Hmmm--->lose 6 to 8 pounds then nothing--->frustrated---->wait a month--->start a new diet and be prepapred for change--->lose 6 to 8 pounds then nothing--->frustrated---->wait a month---->start a new diet and be prepared for change...OP...noticing a trend? If this trend describes you as you mentioned in the last 4 pages...when are you gaining the same 6 to 8 pounds back? 4+ years and over 50+ pounds to lose and you still want to try another diet? Have you considered: (1) a food scale (2) change your terminology with respect to foods (3) get real about your 'all or nothing' mentality (4) Assess what factors consistently hinder your ability to lose weight (5) Change what you can, drop the excuses, drop the weight. Good luck.
This doesn't represent how i have approached weight loss at all. I'm not sure how you came up with that pattern based on my posts?0 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »It seems most of us think highly of 'our way' but in fact there are many ways that work well for at least a few.
Spot on!0 -
Cool
Keep going
Check back in in another 3 weeks ..that should give you a decent 6 week tranch to evaluate whether you are actually in defecit0 -
blankiefinder wrote: »WalkingAlong wrote: »tincanonastring wrote: »vivmom2014 wrote: »The Krista Varady plan:
But in the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll find only one rule: eat no more than 500 calories on Diet Day, eat anything you want and as much as you want on Feast Day, and alternate those two days. That’s it! No counting calories, carbs, fat or protein. No avoiding any particular food; all foods are allowed. There are no complex meal preparations and plans.
In the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll unlock the secret to rapid and sustained weight loss and never endure every dieter’s nightmare: daily deprivation. Alternating between “Feast” days in which you eat whatever you want, and “Diet” day in which you eat 500 calories, you’ll lose: pounds, belly fat—and improve your health. Without giving up the foods you love.
I don't understand how this diet would work. (?)
It doesn't.
Many books have been written on it, and many more scholarly articles. But what people don't understand they fear and deride. Diets, especially.
Plus there's something in the human mind that convinces people that their diet is the one and only good diet. I think whoever named the tv show "My Diet is Better Than Your Diet" knew that.
I was intrigued by this diet after reading the studies. I think it's interesting that she didn't set out to discover a marketable diet plan, she just noticed a particular behavior and then replicated it in human trials.
I would have to eat a little over 3300 cal on my off day to eat back my deficit. I COULD eat that much, but I don't. I've been logging on my feast days and I'm not close to that.
It seems like the mantra on these boards is "CI/CO over time and how you get there is personal preference". But when you explain how you're getting to your deficit...watch out, man! It's going to be the wrong way!
You started a thread about how so far your dieting approaches fail. You were given several tips by several posters on what to do. You are defending your non-working approach with a passion. What ws the purpose of this thread? To tell you that you are cursed and will never see results? To tell you that you are some aline lifeform and the basic principles of CICO do nto apply to you? To get recommendation for a magical pill/drink/herb that will help? Honestly, why start a thread complaining you cannot reach your goal and then refuse to listen to people who have managed to do what you cannot?
I think that's pretty much where we're at, yup.
Instead of hearing 'sustainable deficit, sustainable diet, accurate calorie control', OP hears: Y'all hate IF'ers.
If you go back and read my OP, you'll see what I actually asked is why, when I am consistent in my diet and maintaining a calorie deficit, is there so much fluctuation in the results.
Some of the helpful responses were: watch your sodium intake, be aware of menstrual cycles, be patient and trust the process over a longer amount of time.
I really didn't ask for advice on HOW to get to a calorie deficit. I'm in one, unless I'm wildly wrong in logging and I don't think I am--which is what motivated me to post to begin with.
The fact that you stop losing means you are not, in fact, achieving a calorie deficit. That's what people are trying to tell you. I missed whether you are weighing your food. If you're not, then yes, you are wildly wrong in logging. Know how I know this? Because you're not losing.0 -
CICO does work great, but for my body, I could eat way less calories than I burn but if my carbs are high the scale doesn't move.0
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tesha_chandler wrote: »CICO does work great, but for my body, I could eat way less calories than I burn but if my carbs are high the scale doesn't move.
That's not true. Regardless of your carb level, if you are eating fewer calories than you burn, you will lose weight.0 -
It'll be playing with glycogen and water in the short term probably0
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I read the entire thread and based on your lack of willingness to adhere to a deficit, eat and regain weight on other diets and how IF is part of larger strategy used by many who weigh their food(you don't), understand fluctuations due to many factors(you don't) and your time on MFP of 4+ years. Did I miss something?_Terrapin_ wrote: »...why such variation in resulting weight loss?
I am a very routine person and a logical thinker. I have needed to lose about 50lbs for about 4 years. I'm 37 & female, btw.
When I choose a diet plan, I seem to be able to shed 6-8 lbs...then nothing. I understand the things I may do to sabotage my diet...like not tracking accurately or "cheating". But what about when I do the same things, week after week, and one week I lose 2 lbs, then the next none.
It's so disheartening and it's usually the reason I fall off most diets after about 3 months.
I find it so hard to lose over 6-8 lbs, that I wonder if maybe something else is going on--insulin resistance or pcos?
I'd love some input and advice.
About three weeks ago I started alternate day fasting. I lost 6lbs in two weeks....now nothing. But this has happened with every diet I've tried.
Hmmm--->lose 6 to 8 pounds then nothing--->frustrated---->wait a month--->start a new diet and be prepapred for change--->lose 6 to 8 pounds then nothing--->frustrated---->wait a month---->start a new diet and be prepared for change...OP...noticing a trend? If this trend describes you as you mentioned in the last 4 pages...when are you gaining the same 6 to 8 pounds back? 4+ years and over 50+ pounds to lose and you still want to try another diet? Have you considered: (1) a food scale (2) change your terminology with respect to foods (3) get real about your 'all or nothing' mentality (4) Assess what factors consistently hinder your ability to lose weight (5) Change what you can, drop the excuses, drop the weight. Good luck.
This doesn't represent how i have approached weight loss at all. I'm not sure how you came up with that pattern based on my posts?
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If you go back and read my OP, you'll see what I actually asked is why, when I am consistent in my diet and maintaining a calorie deficit, is there so much fluctuation in the results.
Some of the helpful responses were: watch your sodium intake, be aware of menstrual cycles, be patient and trust the process over a longer amount of time.
I really didn't ask for advice on HOW to get to a calorie deficit. I'm in one, unless I'm wildly wrong in logging and I don't think I am--which is what motivated me to post to begin with.
acaloriecounter.com/blog/why-am-i-not-losing-weight/
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TheBeachgod wrote: »If you go back and read my OP, you'll see what I actually asked is why, when I am consistent in my diet and maintaining a calorie deficit, is there so much fluctuation in the results.
Some of the helpful responses were: watch your sodium intake, be aware of menstrual cycles, be patient and trust the process over a longer amount of time.
I really didn't ask for advice on HOW to get to a calorie deficit. I'm in one, unless I'm wildly wrong in logging and I don't think I am--which is what motivated me to post to begin with.
acaloriecounter.com/blog/why-am-i-not-losing-weight/
These are accurate 11 reasons...the end of the list gives the absolute answer. This could be some earth shattering stuff for some.
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mandy- I think someone mentioned this but if you have nice losses in the initial weeks, it often levels off (even to nothing) for a little while after. Then you lose more eventually, if you stick to it. And if you're adding new exercise at the same time, that just exacerbates it.
And if you're prone to adaptive thermogenesis, your body is better at adapting to the lower calorie level quickly. So the plan you're on is probably a good plan for you because it varies your intake levels, if you can get past the slow/no loss weeks. It's frustrating.
I also recommend using Trendweight. I found I was losing fine but couldn't tell because I was letting the little day-to-day fluctuations mislead me and discourage me. It's hard to see the big picture if you're focused on just a few details.
Good luck!0 -
How do you know how much your consuming if you don't track and/or measure it and just estimate the calories you're taking in?0
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WalkingAlong wrote: »mandy- I think someone mentioned this but if you have nice losses in the initial weeks, it often levels off (even to nothing) for a little while after. Then you lose more eventually, if you stick to it. And if you're adding new exercise at the same time, that just exacerbates it.
And if you're prone to adaptive thermogenesis, your body is better at adapting to the lower calorie level quickly. So the plan you're on is probably a good plan for you because it varies your intake levels, if you can get past the slow/no loss weeks. It's frustrating.
I also recommend using Trendweight. I found I was losing fine but couldn't tell because I was letting the little day-to-day fluctuations mislead me and discourage me. It's hard to see the big picture if you're focused on just a few details.
Good luck!
I'll start using this for sure Thanks!
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vivmom2014 wrote: »The Krista Varady plan:
But in the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll find only one rule: eat no more than 500 calories on Diet Day, eat anything you want and as much as you want on Feast Day, and alternate those two days. That’s it! No counting calories, carbs, fat or protein. No avoiding any particular food; all foods are allowed. There are no complex meal preparations and plans.
In the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll unlock the secret to rapid and sustained weight loss and never endure every dieter’s nightmare: daily deprivation. Alternating between “Feast” days in which you eat whatever you want, and “Diet” day in which you eat 500 calories, you’ll lose: pounds, belly fat—and improve your health. Without giving up the foods you love.
I don't understand how this diet would work. (?)
I don't understand how, if you don't count calories, you know that you're only taking in 500 on your fast days, and how you know you aren't wiping out your deficit on the non fast days?
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WinoGelato wrote: »vivmom2014 wrote: »The Krista Varady plan:
But in the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll find only one rule: eat no more than 500 calories on Diet Day, eat anything you want and as much as you want on Feast Day, and alternate those two days. That’s it! No counting calories, carbs, fat or protein. No avoiding any particular food; all foods are allowed. There are no complex meal preparations and plans.
In the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll unlock the secret to rapid and sustained weight loss and never endure every dieter’s nightmare: daily deprivation. Alternating between “Feast” days in which you eat whatever you want, and “Diet” day in which you eat 500 calories, you’ll lose: pounds, belly fat—and improve your health. Without giving up the foods you love.
I don't understand how this diet would work. (?)
I don't understand how, if you don't count calories, you know that you're only taking in 500 on your fast days, and how you know you aren't wiping out your deficit on the non fast days?
Plus, and I know this is beside the point, what would a 500 calorie day look like? How could it include any exercise? It sounds like punishment.
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vivmom2014 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »vivmom2014 wrote: »The Krista Varady plan:
But in the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll find only one rule: eat no more than 500 calories on Diet Day, eat anything you want and as much as you want on Feast Day, and alternate those two days. That’s it! No counting calories, carbs, fat or protein. No avoiding any particular food; all foods are allowed. There are no complex meal preparations and plans.
In the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll unlock the secret to rapid and sustained weight loss and never endure every dieter’s nightmare: daily deprivation. Alternating between “Feast” days in which you eat whatever you want, and “Diet” day in which you eat 500 calories, you’ll lose: pounds, belly fat—and improve your health. Without giving up the foods you love.
I don't understand how this diet would work. (?)
I don't understand how, if you don't count calories, you know that you're only taking in 500 on your fast days, and how you know you aren't wiping out your deficit on the non fast days?
Plus, and I know this is beside the point, what would a 500 calorie day look like? How could it include any exercise? It sounds like punishment.
I agree completely.0 -
She does count calories. Or do you mean how do people in general lose on that diet? They count on their 500 calorie days (which is pretty simple, given the food quantity), and eat to satisfaction on the other days.WinoGelato wrote: »vivmom2014 wrote: »The Krista Varady plan:
But in the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll find only one rule: eat no more than 500 calories on Diet Day, eat anything you want and as much as you want on Feast Day, and alternate those two days. That’s it! No counting calories, carbs, fat or protein. No avoiding any particular food; all foods are allowed. There are no complex meal preparations and plans.
In the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll unlock the secret to rapid and sustained weight loss and never endure every dieter’s nightmare: daily deprivation. Alternating between “Feast” days in which you eat whatever you want, and “Diet” day in which you eat 500 calories, you’ll lose: pounds, belly fat—and improve your health. Without giving up the foods you love.
I don't understand how this diet would work. (?)
I don't understand how, if you don't count calories, you know that you're only taking in 500 on your fast days, and how you know you aren't wiping out your deficit on the non fast days?
If you have genuine curiosity, there are books and web sites with information. But if you're here to ridicule and balk and pre-judge, this is the place! ; )0 -
WalkingAlong wrote: »
She does count calories. Or do you mean how do people in general lose on that diet? They count on their 500 calorie days (which is pretty simple, given the food quantity), and eat to satisfaction on the other days.WinoGelato wrote: »vivmom2014 wrote: »The Krista Varady plan:
But in the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll find only one rule: eat no more than 500 calories on Diet Day, eat anything you want and as much as you want on Feast Day and alternate those two days. That’s it! No counting calories, carbs, fat or protein. No avoiding any particular food; all foods are allowed. There are no complex meal preparations and plans.
In the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll unlock the secret to rapid and sustained weight loss and never endure every dieter’s nightmare: daily deprivation. Alternating between “Feast” days in which you eat whatever you want, and “Diet” day in which you eat 500 calories, you’ll lose: pounds, belly fat—and improve your health. Without giving up the foods you love.
I don't understand how this diet would work. (?)
I don't understand how, if you don't count calories, you know that you're only taking in 500 on your fast days, and how you know you aren't wiping out your deficit on the non fast days?
If you have genuine curiosity, there are books and web sites with information. But if you're here to ridicule and balk and pre-judge, this is the place! ; )
The description of the diet says "no counting calories". I'm trying to understand how you can ensure that you're doing it properly, without counting calories.
I'm not ridiculing, I'm trying to understand how this works because the explanation seems to go against what the primary appeal of this is for people.
I have nothing against IF, it works for a lot of people. The OP originally came in complaining that her method wasn't working, so people gave her alternatives, now suddenly she's defending this vehemently. I'm just trying to point out that maybe the implementation of the approach is not successful if you aren't counting, weighing, logging accurately, etc. perhaps if OP tightened that up, even still following the ADF approach, and stuck with it for longer, then she would have longer term success.
But thanks for the insults!
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nvm...started a response but honestly Walking Along is going to back the OP and we can just argue. Not worth the time or effort.
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WalkingAlong is the only one giving mandy318 the answers she wants to read so it is pretty futile for anyone else to post helpful information like facts and science.0
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Facts and science from here on ought to be ignored. If someone actually wanted to find successful IFers most if not all people IF every day. It is called sleep. Crazy crazy crazy0
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I'm not even against IF, just woo and special snowflakeism about doing everything right and not losing weight.0
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TheBeachgod wrote: »I'm not even against IF, just woo and special snowflakeism about doing everything right and not losing weight.
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WinoGelato wrote: »WalkingAlong wrote: »
She does count calories. Or do you mean how do people in general lose on that diet? They count on their 500 calorie days (which is pretty simple, given the food quantity), and eat to satisfaction on the other days.WinoGelato wrote: »vivmom2014 wrote: »The Krista Varady plan:
But in the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll find only one rule: eat no more than 500 calories on Diet Day, eat anything you want and as much as you want on Feast Day and alternate those two days. That’s it! No counting calories, carbs, fat or protein. No avoiding any particular food; all foods are allowed. There are no complex meal preparations and plans.
In the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll unlock the secret to rapid and sustained weight loss and never endure every dieter’s nightmare: daily deprivation. Alternating between “Feast” days in which you eat whatever you want, and “Diet” day in which you eat 500 calories, you’ll lose: pounds, belly fat—and improve your health. Without giving up the foods you love.
I don't understand how this diet would work. (?)
I don't understand how, if you don't count calories, you know that you're only taking in 500 on your fast days, and how you know you aren't wiping out your deficit on the non fast days?
If you have genuine curiosity, there are books and web sites with information. But if you're here to ridicule and balk and pre-judge, this is the place! ; )
The description of the diet says "no counting calories". I'm trying to understand how you can ensure that you're doing it properly, without counting calories.
I'm not ridiculing, I'm trying to understand how this works because the explanation seems to go against what the primary appeal of this is for people.
I think it's like how some low carb instead of calorie counting and find it works because they just end up eating less (at first, anyway). Whereas others use low carb as a way to make a deficit easier but also calorie count. The appeal for some people is that they don't want to calorie count and find it too burdensome or annoying, whereas others don't mind calorie counting or find they need to for the method to work, but still see benefit to the method to make the deficit easier.
The idea with alternate day seems to be that lots of people won't overeat enough on the feast day to remove the deficit. Instead, that lots of people find that eating normally = something like 110% of the calories they need for maintenance (why people gain slowly over time) and that adding in the fast (500 cal) days lets them do this and still have a deficit (or something like that -- I haven't done the math).
I don't think it would work for me, because I suspect that I'm someone who can easily go beyond 110% of maintenance calories without really trying that hard, especially if I'm fasting the day before. But it's possible I'm wrong even for me -- I know I racked up a huge deficit over Easter weekend the last couple of years because even eating whatever I wanted on Easter didn't end up making up for Good Friday's fast. I didn't feel like I had to eat more to make up for the low day. Not sure if that would work for me regularly, but that it does for some doesn't surprise me. On the other hand, I think it would be bad for anyone with bingeing issues or who tends to such restriction that she wouldn't eat enough on the feast days (I've seen posters who tried to keep a deficit on those days and added in fast days too, which is not how it is supposed to work).
The biggest issue for me with trying such a plan if I felt like I needed something new is the exercise question that someone raised above.0 -
JustMissTracy wrote: »vivmom2014 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »vivmom2014 wrote: »The Krista Varady plan:
But in the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll find only one rule: eat no more than 500 calories on Diet Day, eat anything you want and as much as you want on Feast Day, and alternate those two days. That’s it! No counting calories, carbs, fat or protein. No avoiding any particular food; all foods are allowed. There are no complex meal preparations and plans.
In the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll unlock the secret to rapid and sustained weight loss and never endure every dieter’s nightmare: daily deprivation. Alternating between “Feast” days in which you eat whatever you want, and “Diet” day in which you eat 500 calories, you’ll lose: pounds, belly fat—and improve your health. Without giving up the foods you love.
I don't understand how this diet would work. (?)
I don't understand how, if you don't count calories, you know that you're only taking in 500 on your fast days, and how you know you aren't wiping out your deficit on the non fast days?
Plus, and I know this is beside the point, what would a 500 calorie day look like? How could it include any exercise? It sounds like punishment.
I agree completely.
For my 500 calorie days I'm consuming water, black coffee or hot tea until around noon. I have a 100 or 150 calorie protein shake or smoothie for lunch. When I get home from work (6pm) I have a spinach salad with tuna, 2 tbs of hummus and a drizzle of balsamic vinegar (350-400 calories depending on the amount of tuna and hummus). Hot tea in between when I feel hungry.
I haven't incorporated exercise. Yet. Unfortunately I probably won't until Feb, due to a job change to another city and my existing gym membership is geographically challenging now.0 -
TheBeachgod wrote: »WalkingAlong is the only one giving mandy318 the answers she wants to read so it is pretty futile for anyone else to post helpful information like facts and science.
Actually many posters have offered great fact-based insight into my original question, which was why, when I'm in a calorie deficit, do I see such varying results.
Walking Along has experienced the plan I'm on work for her and yes, I'm very interested in what she has to say that could help me make it work for me.0 -
I think the point is you estimate 500 on the fast days, which is much simpler than counting all your calories all the time. Once you know some very low cal meals, you tend to repeat them and it's not really a counting game like MFP is. The author actually uses a lot of frozen meals for her fast days, which is not my thing, but I see how that isn't really 'counting calories'. You have a 200-300 calorie frozen meal for lunch and another for dinner, and no counting on the other days. You don't need an app for that, or even paper.WinoGelato wrote: »WalkingAlong wrote: »
She does count calories. Or do you mean how do people in general lose on that diet? They count on their 500 calorie days (which is pretty simple, given the food quantity), and eat to satisfaction on the other days.WinoGelato wrote: »vivmom2014 wrote: »The Krista Varady plan:
But in the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll find only one rule: eat no more than 500 calories on Diet Day, eat anything you want and as much as you want on Feast Day and alternate those two days. That’s it! No counting calories, carbs, fat or protein. No avoiding any particular food; all foods are allowed. There are no complex meal preparations and plans.
In the Every-Other-Day Diet, you’ll unlock the secret to rapid and sustained weight loss and never endure every dieter’s nightmare: daily deprivation. Alternating between “Feast” days in which you eat whatever you want, and “Diet” day in which you eat 500 calories, you’ll lose: pounds, belly fat—and improve your health. Without giving up the foods you love.
I don't understand how this diet would work. (?)
I don't understand how, if you don't count calories, you know that you're only taking in 500 on your fast days, and how you know you aren't wiping out your deficit on the non fast days?
If you have genuine curiosity, there are books and web sites with information. But if you're here to ridicule and balk and pre-judge, this is the place! ; )
The description of the diet says "no counting calories". I'm trying to understand how you can ensure that you're doing it properly, without counting calories.
I'm not ridiculing, I'm trying to understand how this works because the explanation seems to go against what the primary appeal of this is for people.
I have nothing against IF, it works for a lot of people. The OP originally came in complaining that her method wasn't working, so people gave her alternatives, now suddenly she's defending this vehemently. I'm just trying to point out that maybe the implementation of the approach is not successful if you aren't counting, weighing, logging accurately, etc. perhaps if OP tightened that up, even still following the ADF approach, and stuck with it for longer, then she would have longer term success.
But thanks for the insults!
I'm sorry to insult you, I just get tired of this argument- "You're not losing weight every week so you're not in a deficit so your entire approach is wrong. And by the way it sounds stupid and miserable. I don't understand it and have never tried it, but I'm sure it's stupid and miserable." And yes, I'm blending in others' responses there, and speaking with some hyperbole and broad generalization, so don't take it personally.
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TheBeachgod wrote: »I'm not even against IF, just woo and special snowflakeism about doing everything right and not losing weight.
Now how is it that I am supposed to lose weight if not through special attention, hand-holding, customized plans suited to MY unique biological needs, and lots and lots of gushing encouragement???
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TheBeachgod wrote: »I'm not even against IF, just woo and special snowflakeism about doing everything right and not losing weight.
I know at least one person on the threads does IF during training with cycling. Some weeks it is one day, some weeks it is two days. Difficult, but doable. I think any method which someone finds a way to go toward goal is something worth trying. I'm not a fan of people claiming they are doing it right and really aren't even weighing their food. No food scale =/= I am doing it right and know my calories are accurate.
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_Terrapin_ wrote: »TheBeachgod wrote: »I'm not even against IF, just woo and special snowflakeism about doing everything right and not losing weight.
I know at least one person on the threads does IF during training with cycling. Some weeks it is one day, some weeks it is two days. Difficult, but doable. I think any method which someone finds a way to go toward goal is something worth trying. I'm not a fan of people claiming they are doing it right and really aren't even weighing their food. No food scale =/= I am doing it right and know my calories are accurate.
You don't think it's possible to diet successfully without weighing food?
I'd like to explore ways to improve and troubleshoot things I may be overlooking, but does that mean jumping to the most.intensive way to control calories in that I can think of, outside of surgery maybe?
Fasting intermittently seems much more doable to me than weighing all of my food, all of the time.0
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