Coronavirus prep

ReenieHJ · July 2020

I'd be curious about the statistics of people that wore masks versus didn't wear masks, of the ones who've contracted Covid. I'd imagine it's almost impossible to know.

gradchica27 · July 2020

@baconslave , our usual co op is going ahead w in person classes (tbd about masks), but we had already decided to sit out this year before pandemic bc we’re having a hard time fitting our own work in w co op and music. Pandemic decided us for sure on not going—older kids would move to Zoom, and they really didn’t like that this spring. Plus I send them for hands on stuff and social experience...which they’re not getting from Zoom.

Local Classical Conversation am is going ahead as well, from what I hear. Our HS band and choir program is looking for a place to meet in the fall bc their current church home will not let them meet until we reach phase 3. Which may never happen at the rate we’re going. But they are requiring students to be in class or off campus—no study hall or family room to wait. That’s not feasible for 3 kids in 3 classes one after the other, w little guy just hanging around. I can’t sit in the car w them for 3 hrs, and possible locations are all too far to drive there and back for a 1 hr class. So we’re looking into private instrument lessons and piano instruction.

janejellyroll · July 2020

ReenieHJ wrote: »

I'd be curious about the statistics of people that wore masks versus didn't wear masks, of the ones who've contracted Covid. I'd imagine it's almost impossible to know.

Yeah, I imagine the problem you'd run into would be the people who remember (either genuinely or self-servingly) all the times they wore them and forget all the times they didn't. There are probably a number of people who consistently wear them in certain situations but are less careful in others.

baconslave · July 2020

gradchica27 wrote: »

@baconslave , our usual co op is going ahead w in person classes (tbd about masks), but we had already decided to sit out this year before pandemic bc we’re having a hard time fitting our own work in w co op and music. Pandemic decided us for sure on not going—older kids would move to Zoom, and they really didn’t like that this spring. Plus I send them for hands on stuff and social experience...which they’re not getting from Zoom.

Local Classical Conversation am is going ahead as well, from what I hear. Our HS band and choir program is looking for a place to meet in the fall bc their current church home will not let them meet until we reach phase 3. Which may never happen at the rate we’re going. But they are requiring students to be in class or off campus—no study hall or family room to wait. That’s not feasible for 3 kids in 3 classes one after the other, w little guy just hanging around. I can’t sit in the car w them for 3 hrs, and possible locations are all too far to drive there and back for a 1 hr class. So we’re looking into private instrument lessons and piano instruction.

Super interesting. Thanks for replying.
I second you on the co-op being high maintenance. My 16-year-old's classes were so intensive they were basically taught at the college level, which means instruction was good, but there was so much work that he had to put off finishing Biology and Spanish until this summer. He's getting them done now but...it was super stressful at the time and messed up my schedule of courses. I'm still catching up my younger kids from what I had to push off b/c of co-op deadlines last year. And that science fair project...x3 kids all due the same day. My 9-year-old won 2nd place. But getting there...and them all constantly having big papers, projects, or presentations due and a lot of reading b/c the schedule was compressed to smaller than the public school-year to begin with.

Plus, the day the co-op meets is basically an entire day of loss of instruction for our non-co-op courses.

Last year I taught the high school Health class. I never want to do that again. So much work and stress! If I had to teach it again it would be easier since I have all the materials, presentations, projects, videos, quizzes and tests made now. But putting all that together was insane on top of dealing with homeschooling 4 kids, one of them graduating soon and all of that extra mess. This year I have to prep my junior for the ACT. And like I said he's already behind my plans since we start the school year in July.

I, too, don't NEED co-op. I'm perfectly capable of doing a good chem lab. And teaching all the courses. I sent them for the classroom experience which they'll need in college, the accountability to an authority they can't try to manipulate, and the social interaction.

I hope you have success finding good private music teachers!

lynn_glenmont · July 2020

MikePfirrman wrote: »

gradchica27 wrote: »

jenilla1 wrote: »

Covid 19 is bigger than just some flu that a small number die from and everybody else just "recovers." This crap lingers. I'm young and fit and I worry about the long term effects for those who don't die, even healthy young people...

Back in the early days of this thing I had about a week where I was getting hot flashes (without actual fever), randomly waking up in the middle of the night gasping for air, had a constant low grade headache (when I literally never get them) and everything tasted like dirt (wrecked my appetite). At the time, they wouldn't test without a fever, so I was not eligible to test.

It really wasn't that bad of a sickness for me personally. I'd say it was a very, very mild case. It was just stressful because of the whole pandemic and wondering if I had it or not, and whether it was gonna take one of those scary turns for the worse. But it didn't.

Not much suffering at the time, but the lingering after effects have worsened over time. I was good for awhile, but then a few weeks out, lung symptoms started ramping up. It's 4+ months later and I've just been prescribed 2 inhalers because now I have a chronic cough, and pain from chest cartilage inflammation. Gotta get my lungs calmed down - inhalers will hopefully only be temporary. My doctor thinks I probably had covid, but it's been so long that an antibody test likely wouldn't show it anymore.

I'm a healthy, fit life-long runner and mountain biker and I've still been able to exercise throughout all of this, but my pace has been slowed way down, my endurance is lower, and I take more rest days now. Sometimes it feels like part of my lungs are missing. And the random shortness of breath is so bizarre and new to me. But happily, the inhalers seem to be helping! Just grateful I can still get my fitness on. If I couldn't, it would be the end of me. Physical activity is my therapy. It's the joy in my life.

I feel terrible for all those re-habbing from covid. Many have it way worse than me. Ugh. Stay safe everybody. ❤

I hope your after effects are manageable and eventually disappear. That sounds awful and exactly like what I said to my husband—I’m scared of the after effect. Statistically the odds are on my side for survival (Although that’s clearly not a given), but I am hearing more about lingering after effects. My boys and I live for recreational physical activity and the thought of losing significant lung function for any of us is scary and depressing.

I do think if you're in seriously good cardio shape that the effects will be temporary, but there's certainly no guarantees with Covid-19. One of my online rowing buddies is also an epidemiologist (though infectious diseases aren't his specialty). He's also an amazing biker.

He posted up a study last week (I'll see if I can find it) where they believe that strong aerobic functions would be a very protective mechanism against Covid-19, in particular from the lung damage -- the famous cytokine storm.

Since it seems the mechanism of protection is through Superoxide Dismutase, which you can also buy as a supplement, I asked him if the supplement would help (I'm an endurance athlete but many of my siblings can't or won't exercise). He felt that there was no real replacement through supplementation to replace being well trained.

Here's the study he was referring to.

https://neurosciencenews.com/coronavirus-exercise-16169/

I'm like you, I do cardio six or seven hours a week and love it. It would seriously depress me to have impaired lung function that I've worked so hard to improve for many, many years.

This is just speculation so far as COVID-19 is concerned. The author surveyed existing research to find that exercise results in an increase in an antioxidant that research suggests is helpful in combatting various non COVID diseases. There's nothing here showing efficacy in treating COVID-19. Not even correlation data between exercise history or underlying cardio fitness with COVID outcomes.

I'm not saying exercise is a bad idea. I'm certainly trying to get exercise in a safe manner during the pandemic. But the connection between exercise and COVID-19 in this paper is purely speculative.

AnnPT77 · July 2020

MikePfirrman wrote: »

gradchica27 wrote: »

jenilla1 wrote: »

Covid 19 is bigger than just some flu that a small number die from and everybody else just "recovers." This crap lingers. I'm young and fit and I worry about the long term effects for those who don't die, even healthy young people...

Back in the early days of this thing I had about a week where I was getting hot flashes (without actual fever), randomly waking up in the middle of the night gasping for air, had a constant low grade headache (when I literally never get them) and everything tasted like dirt (wrecked my appetite). At the time, they wouldn't test without a fever, so I was not eligible to test.

It really wasn't that bad of a sickness for me personally. I'd say it was a very, very mild case. It was just stressful because of the whole pandemic and wondering if I had it or not, and whether it was gonna take one of those scary turns for the worse. But it didn't.

Not much suffering at the time, but the lingering after effects have worsened over time. I was good for awhile, but then a few weeks out, lung symptoms started ramping up. It's 4+ months later and I've just been prescribed 2 inhalers because now I have a chronic cough, and pain from chest cartilage inflammation. Gotta get my lungs calmed down - inhalers will hopefully only be temporary. My doctor thinks I probably had covid, but it's been so long that an antibody test likely wouldn't show it anymore.

I'm a healthy, fit life-long runner and mountain biker and I've still been able to exercise throughout all of this, but my pace has been slowed way down, my endurance is lower, and I take more rest days now. Sometimes it feels like part of my lungs are missing. And the random shortness of breath is so bizarre and new to me. But happily, the inhalers seem to be helping! Just grateful I can still get my fitness on. If I couldn't, it would be the end of me. Physical activity is my therapy. It's the joy in my life.

I feel terrible for all those re-habbing from covid. Many have it way worse than me. Ugh. Stay safe everybody. ❤

I hope your after effects are manageable and eventually disappear. That sounds awful and exactly like what I said to my husband—I’m scared of the after effect. Statistically the odds are on my side for survival (Although that’s clearly not a given), but I am hearing more about lingering after effects. My boys and I live for recreational physical activity and the thought of losing significant lung function for any of us is scary and depressing.

I do think if you're in seriously good cardio shape that the effects will be temporary, but there's certainly no guarantees with Covid-19. One of my online rowing buddies is also an epidemiologist (though infectious diseases aren't his specialty). He's also an amazing biker.

He posted up a study last week (I'll see if I can find it) where they believe that strong aerobic functions would be a very protective mechanism against Covid-19, in particular from the lung damage -- the famous cytokine storm.

Since it seems the mechanism of protection is through Superoxide Dismutase, which you can also buy as a supplement, I asked him if the supplement would help (I'm an endurance athlete but many of my siblings can't or won't exercise). He felt that there was no real replacement through supplementation to replace being well trained.

Here's the study he was referring to.

https://neurosciencenews.com/coronavirus-exercise-16169/

I'm like you, I do cardio six or seven hours a week and love it. It would seriously depress me to have impaired lung function that I've worked so hard to improve for many, many years.

Since a good-sized subset of the USRowing women's national team got Covid, we may have a decent but small case study right there, it would seem. We already know the acute phase wasn't necessarily a walk in the park for those very fit women; we'll see if there are longer-term deficits. It doesn't seem like USRowing has been very forthcoming about it, but there's been coverage of individual women who were affected, estimated to be about a dozen of them (not all were able to be tested at the time, but had consistent symptoms).

The one I know was not back at full pre-infection performance after 3 months, and some of her teammates had a longer intial struggle (she seems to feel the most acute phase for her was around a month, but reports it being twice that for some other team members).

https://buffalonews.com/sports/even-for-olympic-gold-medalist-emily-regan-covid-19-was-a-nightmare/article_57fa2f1c-c7c2-11ea-8d3e-13d9f7f6e00d.html

Gisel2015 · July 2020

He spent 128 days fighting coronavirus in a New York hospital: "This disease is no joke"

From CNN's Jason Kurtz

"Miracle Larry" Kelly is home.

After 128 days in the hospital — including 61 on a ventilator — the 64-year-old New Yorker is a coronavirus survivor.

"I was one of the early cases. And in many ways I was a Guinea pig because they knew nothing about it. So, they threw everything at me," Kelly told CNN's Brianna Keilar during a live interview.

Kelly's early prognosis was so grim that doctors suggested he be taken off of live support, and family members had begun to pay their last respects. But Kelly had other ideas.

"The last text message I sent to my wife right before I was vented. I said I promise I'll never stop fighting. I kept that promise," he said.

As Kelly battled for four months, fighting a virus that to date has claimed the lives of more than 140,000 Americans, one mid-April Sunday offered a sliver of hope.

"I open my eyes on Easter Sunday, which is why I believe the moniker 'Miracle Larry' came from. But on Easter Sunday in New York, 527 people died," said Kelly. "So people were dying all around me and I didn't die. And is that a miracle? I don't know."

Further hampering Kelly's fight were complications including a coma, pneumonia in both lungs, and massive bleeding in the brain.

There were "tubes everywhere, EEG (electroencephalogram) on his brain. He looked awful. My sister didn't even want to see him like that," Kelly's daughter Jackie recalled.

Family members took turns recording messages on a mobile phone, playing them in Kelly's ear one by one inside his Mt. Sinai hospital room. Months later, the recordings have taken on a different tone.

"Jackie actually played the phone conversations with the doctors that she had with her crying and them telling them all the gloom and doom," Kelly said. "Jackie and Dawn were getting very upset and they looked over at me and I wasn't. And they were staring at me and I said to them 'well, I know how it ends.'"

Even with a contagious sense of humor, Kelly admits to grim days during his Covid-19 fight.

"I was in a very dark place. And you know, I didn't see any white light but I saw a lot of black and dark and a pit. And I thought I was heading the other direction, which is why I probably survived. I kept thinking let me explain myself."

With family by his side, Kelly credits not only those closest to him — but also those he'd never met — for his remarkable story of survival.

"There's so many commercials on that say we're all in this together. And that's the only message I can give people. I was a stranger to those people at Mt. Sinai and they worked tirelessly to keep me alive," Kelly said, before adding a word of caution to those still doubting the severity of Covid-19.

"This disease is no joke. And if there's anybody out there thinking it's a big hoax, I'm so glad my family and a lot of my friends who know me, are following protocol because I don't want to lose any of them."

ythannah · July 2020

gradchica27 wrote: »

Which leads me to another problem I’m seeing with reopening, esp for schools. What is “sick”? At what point do you trigger an automatic Covid test/quarantine? I’ve had my son sent home from preschool bc he had green snot. The kid has snot from Aug through January. And again from March onward. So do I. Sometimes there’s a brief break bt spring allergies and summer grass pollen. Sometimes not. We’re allergic to SW TN. I had to bring him to the dr and actually say the reason I’m there is “he has green boogers” after having a faucet of snot for months. No other symptoms. Surprise, dr diagnosed allergies.

If it's any consolation, I work in a large human service organization and for the past few weeks have been listening to the two women who sit beside me as they draft policy and procedure for day care centers around exactly those issues. At first it was automatic 14 day isolation for anyone, child or staff, who had a symptom. But that would have meant that probably no center would ever be open so that got scaled back. There are no easy answers. And we're lucky here that we can get same-day test results, although that could change if demand got higher than the lab's capacity.

On the other hand, I do a screening questionnaire every morning at work where I have to assess my own symptoms, and the last question refers vaguely to "feeling unwell". If I answer yes to any question, I'm supposed to self-isolate and get tested. Well, gee, I'm 56 years old and sleep like crap, I generally feel like a bag of *kitten* every morning... so I lie.

Diatonic12 · July 2020

First Co-19 confirmed positive case in my extended family. I was long gone before they showed up on my doorstep as they'd been traveling the U.S. visiting relatives all over the place. All of them, young and old have now been exposed. It gives me a really big pinch. Think Ron White here.

paperpudding · July 2020

The difficulty seems to be difficulty in meeting criteria for testing??

Wher I live, anyone can get tested if they have the insiest symptom - so one could have a runny nose
Iike every other allergy reaction in the past and get tested anyway and get a result by next day.

Diatonic12 · July 2020

There's no free testing here. We don't have facilities to take care of all of the pesky tourists. They'll send you to the next largest city in the neighboring state if you show up in the emergency room with symptoms.

paperpudding · July 2020

Ok, so disincentives to testing, like cost or difficulty getting there or not meeting 'sick enough' criteria is going to lead to under reporting and obviously to more spread.

Diatonic12 · July 2020

Absolutely. You've hit the nail right on the head.

lemurcat2 · July 2020

paperpudding wrote: »

Ok, so disincentives to testing, like cost or difficulty getting there or not meeting 'sick enough' criteria is going to lead to under reporting and obviously to more spread.

Just to be clear, this varies a lot by state. Here anyone who wants can get tested, and it's free and there are tons of locations. We are currently testing around 40K per day.

lokihen · July 2020

lemurcat2 wrote: »

paperpudding wrote: »

Ok, so disincentives to testing, like cost or difficulty getting there or not meeting 'sick enough' criteria is going to lead to under reporting and obviously to more spread.

Just to be clear, this varies a lot by state. Here anyone who wants can get tested, and it's free and there are tons of locations. We are currently testing around 40K per day.

Do you know how long results are taking? Here it's two to over seven days depending on if the tests are sent out of state.

SummerSkier · July 2020

my workplace is being super careful and if you are ill, you self quarantine. period. Regardless of test or not and they do the contact tracing immediately regardless of test or not. We lost our first co worker to this disease last week.

So far we have not had any community spread internally but Tx is such a hot spot it's difficult for us to not know anyone at this point. The return to work criteria changes almost weekly and it's a complex flowchart of things but mostly it is 7 days starting the 3rd day after any symptoms are gone. So 10 days post symptom. And no longer is a Dr release required because I don't think Drs want to take the risk and they are pretty busy these days.

Again things continue to change rapidly but mostly as we learn more and deal with more I think.

Diatonic12 · July 2020

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/07/200710212247.htm

Study links abnormally high blood sugar with higher risk of death in COVID-19 patients not previously diagnosed with diabetes
Date:
July 10, 2020

https://www.sciencetimes.com/articles/26227/20200626/high-blood-sugar-levels-detected-coronavirus-patients-suggesting-covid-19.htm

High Blood Sugar Levels Detected in Coronavirus Patients, Suggesting COVID-19 Triggers Diabetes

ElioraFR · July 2020

Diatonic12 wrote: »

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/07/200710212247.htm

Study links abnormally high blood sugar with higher risk of death in COVID-19 patients not previously diagnosed with diabetes
Date:
July 10, 2020

https://www.sciencetimes.com/articles/26227/20200626/high-blood-sugar-levels-detected-coronavirus-patients-suggesting-covid-19.htm

High Blood Sugar Levels Detected in Coronavirus Patients, Suggesting COVID-19 Triggers Diabetes

So many weird symptoms and effects. Very scary disease this thing. Hope all it’s little legs crack off and it dries up in the dust.

cwolfman13 · July 2020

lokihen wrote: »

lemurcat2 wrote: »

paperpudding wrote: »

Ok, so disincentives to testing, like cost or difficulty getting there or not meeting 'sick enough' criteria is going to lead to under reporting and obviously to more spread.

Just to be clear, this varies a lot by state. Here anyone who wants can get tested, and it's free and there are tons of locations. We are currently testing around 40K per day.

Do you know how long results are taking? Here it's two to over seven days depending on if the tests are sent out of state.

In New Mexico anyone who wants to get tested can get tested, symptoms or not, known exposure or not. This was a huge priority for our governor. We have a number of drive up testing sites that are operated by the DOH and by Presbyterian Hospital. Results are typically 1-3 days. Unfortunately, people are having to wait in line for about 4-6 hours to get the test and many people go at night and camp in their cars to get in line. They only have so many tests on hand, so a lot of people at the back of the line end up getting turned away later in the day. They're working to resolve this, but the only way I see that happening is if they only test those who are symptomatic or have had known contact that can be verified...IDK...we'll see.

You can also get tested at private facilities like our urgent care facilities and our CVS Pharmacy clinics...From what I understand though is that you have to have symptoms to be tested at these facilities. There are no long lines, but testing results are long...they were averaging 6-10 days about a month ago and now it's 15-30. DOH and PH have their own lab capabilities...the private entities have to send their samples out to the labs they contract with and I guess they're pretty overwhelmed as these labs are taking in samples from all over the country, or at least the southwestern region of the US.

Diatonic12 · July 2020

Transmission

The onset and duration of viral shedding and the period of infectiousness for COVID-19 are not yet known with certainty. Based on current evidence, scientists believe that persons with mild to moderate COVID-19 may shed replication-competent SARS-CoV-2 for up to 10 days following symptom onset, while a small fraction of persons with severe COVID-19, including immunocompromised persons, may shed replication-competent virus for up to 20 days. It is possible that SARS-CoV-2 RNA may be detectable in the upper or lower respiratory tract for weeks after illness onset, similar to infections with MERS-CoV and SARS-CoV. However, detection of viral RNA does not necessarily mean that infectious virus is present. Based on existing literature, the incubation period (the time from exposure to development of symptoms) of SARS-CoV-2 and other coronaviruses (e.g., MERS-CoV, SARS-CoV) ranges from 2–14 days.

CDC

Coronavirus prep

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