Coronavirus prep
Replies
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MikePfirrman wrote: »baconslave wrote: »baconslave wrote: »I couldn't find any information on this question but I'm curious, maybe someone here knows. Concerning receiving the Moderna vaccine, are recipients under age 55 known to have a tougher time with side effects than other age categories?
From what I have read it is more common of recipients under 55 to have a more robust response to vaccines. Vaccines have a substance called an "adjuvant" that is designed to alert the body that there is an invader to provoke a response. As older people have less energetic immune systems, their response is less pronounced. It just doesn't pounce as hard. The Covid vax acts the same. So I imagine that if that is the case for Modern, they used a more provocatory adjuvant. My Dad is 76, and he got severe aches and chills the night after the vaccine. And soreness at the injection site and that was all. He'll get his second tomorrow. So we shall see how he weathers that.
So the 2nd dose tends to overall provoke more severe reactions than the first across both, but according to this source, Moderna's overall side effects are worse than Pfizer's. https://www.healthline.com/health-news/heres-why-your-second-dose-of-covid-19-vaccine-will-likely-have-stronger-side-effects#Millions-of-doses,-few-problems
EDIT: Being the shameless nerd that I am, I couldn't let this go. According one study, neither use a separate adjuvant, but "BioNTech/Pfizer and Moderna do not explicitly state the use of an adjuvant within their vaccines, but RNA already contains immunostimulatory properties and signals through pathogen recognition receptors.72 It remains to be seen whether the immunostimulation from RNA is strong enough to confer full protection against SARS-CoV-2. There is also a possibility that the LNP carriers they utilize confer adjuvant properties themselves." Super neat. So if this is true, than the lipsomes and mRNA formulations in the Moderna are more naturally rowdy than the ones Pfizer uses.
(This source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7553041/)
This exactly they talked about on TWIV. They supposed that older immune systems slowly react over time while younger immune systems just bang it right out. They also joked that older people might simply be more used to being tired and achy and don't notice it
My Dad has said that.
I need to add that podcast to my queue.
It can be dense, prob two thirds of it goes over my head lol but it's so reassuring. When they get really technical, I kind of zone out and drift back when it starts to sound like it's back on my level
That sounds like my life as a technical recruiter for 25 years!
My brother has continued to improve, so that's been a huge relief. Getting ready soon for a road trip to TX, to move my daughter from Austin to here with us. She still has her car there and we have to sell most of her furniture. She's going to stay with us for a longer term and save money again -- most of her savings are gone after a year with Covid-19. Bittersweet to have her here. She was doing really well pre-Covid. A once, very happy and productive young professional woman is now very depressed and unsure of herself. It's been devistating, as a parent, to watch. I'm sure we're not unique in this whole pandemic.
We are just keeping our fingers crossed that her last month of utility bills won't be an incredibly horrible surprise. Not much choice on this trip. We will likely have to spend one day in a hotel (not thrilled about that) each way. I'll likely wear a mask nearly the entire time in the hotel.
Good deal with your brother. If your daughter was doing well with career pre-covid she will be fine when things come back. Enjoy your time with her.
Just an FYI. If her move involves renting a trailer check the rate one way from ATX to AZ vs renting and returning to the same location. When my son moved to ATX from IL it was more than 3X the cost to rent in IL and leave the trailer in ATX vs bringing it back to the same location (this was a well know national company).
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MikePfirrman wrote: »baconslave wrote: »baconslave wrote: »I couldn't find any information on this question but I'm curious, maybe someone here knows. Concerning receiving the Moderna vaccine, are recipients under age 55 known to have a tougher time with side effects than other age categories?
From what I have read it is more common of recipients under 55 to have a more robust response to vaccines. Vaccines have a substance called an "adjuvant" that is designed to alert the body that there is an invader to provoke a response. As older people have less energetic immune systems, their response is less pronounced. It just doesn't pounce as hard. The Covid vax acts the same. So I imagine that if that is the case for Modern, they used a more provocatory adjuvant. My Dad is 76, and he got severe aches and chills the night after the vaccine. And soreness at the injection site and that was all. He'll get his second tomorrow. So we shall see how he weathers that.
So the 2nd dose tends to overall provoke more severe reactions than the first across both, but according to this source, Moderna's overall side effects are worse than Pfizer's. https://www.healthline.com/health-news/heres-why-your-second-dose-of-covid-19-vaccine-will-likely-have-stronger-side-effects#Millions-of-doses,-few-problems
EDIT: Being the shameless nerd that I am, I couldn't let this go. According one study, neither use a separate adjuvant, but "BioNTech/Pfizer and Moderna do not explicitly state the use of an adjuvant within their vaccines, but RNA already contains immunostimulatory properties and signals through pathogen recognition receptors.72 It remains to be seen whether the immunostimulation from RNA is strong enough to confer full protection against SARS-CoV-2. There is also a possibility that the LNP carriers they utilize confer adjuvant properties themselves." Super neat. So if this is true, than the lipsomes and mRNA formulations in the Moderna are more naturally rowdy than the ones Pfizer uses.
(This source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7553041/)
This exactly they talked about on TWIV. They supposed that older immune systems slowly react over time while younger immune systems just bang it right out. They also joked that older people might simply be more used to being tired and achy and don't notice it
My Dad has said that.
I need to add that podcast to my queue.
It can be dense, prob two thirds of it goes over my head lol but it's so reassuring. When they get really technical, I kind of zone out and drift back when it starts to sound like it's back on my level
That sounds like my life as a technical recruiter for 25 years!
My brother has continued to improve, so that's been a huge relief. Getting ready soon for a road trip to TX, to move my daughter from Austin to here with us. She still has her car there and we have to sell most of her furniture. She's going to stay with us for a longer term and save money again -- most of her savings are gone after a year with Covid-19. Bittersweet to have her here. She was doing really well pre-Covid. A once, very happy and productive young professional woman is now very depressed and unsure of herself. It's been devistating, as a parent, to watch. I'm sure we're not unique in this whole pandemic.
We are just keeping our fingers crossed that her last month of utility bills won't be an incredibly horrible surprise. Not much choice on this trip. We will likely have to spend one day in a hotel (not thrilled about that) each way. I'll likely wear a mask nearly the entire time in the hotel.
We are in the same boat, our 26 y.o. daughter was 2 years into her career in the airline industry, when that came crashing down fast. We are just about done finishing up a self contained apartment in our home for her, could be years before she is back to work where she was. And then of course she has lost all that career growth and seniority. Luckily she now has a contract job that she can work from home and pays exceptionally well, so she can save a lot while living here with us, so that helps. Hope your daughter does well when she is back home with you.
It's been hard physically on our generation - but the financial and emotional toll on the younger generation will be a long time healing.17 -
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/scott-gottlieb-coronavirus-downward-trend-face-the-nation/
Sounds like we're finally over the final peak. We were told early on there will be no herd immunity with Covid-19.1 -
Four people in Oregon who are at least two weeks past their second vaccination are positive for COVID.rheddmobile wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »rheddmobile wrote: »spiriteagle99 wrote: »I think that because smoking damages the lungs and Covid attacks the lungs and heart, smokers are at higher risk of serious illness and fatality. It's frustrating that my 81 year old diabetic husband has to wait in line with the 25 year old smoker, but it is easier for us to hole up than it might be for someone younger who needs to work. We can wait.
That’s terrible. Where are you that 81 year olds aren’t already vaccinated? In TN we are down to 70+ now.
I was looking at the latest info and at present diabetes is 1c in TN, along with 55+. I’m 52. So if I were just three years older, I would be eligible from my age at the same time as my diabetes, which seems nuts to me.
Also, what stops people from claiming to smoke? Or even starting to smoke, just to get the vaccine?
Here in Massachusetts our vax rollout has been horrendous. Wednesday, Gov. Charlie Baker announced that people accompanying those over 75 to mass vaccination sites could also sign up for a shot, which prompted posts on Craigslist soliciting seniors, outrage by teachers (who are not in a priority group) and others waiting patiently for shots, and this bit on The Daily Show:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ua-xnNdB68w&t=122s
https://www.boston.com/news/coronavirus/2021/02/11/massachusetts-vaccine-eligibility-companions-craigslist
I guess if the alternative is that an elderly person can't get there on their own so doesn't get a shot - it makes sense? At this point in our supposed "rollout" I really don't care who they give the odd extra shot to as long as someone is getting it.
I agree. I feel like there's not enough public recognition of the fact that each person vaccinated is one less (or 0.7 less or whatever the effective rate of that dose) potential transmission vector and one less (0.7 less) opportunity for a mutation to create a virus variant that could be more lethal, more transmissible, or more resistant to the vaccines.
Anybody getting vaccinated helps me, even though I haven't gotten vaccinated yet. Especially if I haven't gotten vaccinated yet.
I don’t have any evidence to substantiate this, but I feel like the vaccine probably is cutting transmission by a lot. Locally our rates have dropped sharply since January, starting at a time when they would have been expected to still be climbing from the holiday surge. I believe the change is because healthcare professionals were vaccinated. Since local tracing found that the largest single traceable source of infections was healthcare (with 65% being no known origin) it makes sense that stopping doctors, nurses, and healthcare workers from spreading it would show results quickly.
COVID will be endemic. We’ll likely need annual/semi-annual boosters. It’ll be like the flu vaccine, I think. Fewer people will get sick, and those who do will be less likely to be hospitalized or die.
At our campus town hall last week, one of the doctors from the medical center said once you’re vaccinated you can only spread COVID if you’re infected yourself, but another doctor on the local news said fully vaccinated people could still spread it regardless. 🤷🏻♀️ Only time will tell.
Did they explain how it could be spread by someone who isn't infected?
They didn’t. I think it’s too early to tell. My guess is the variants will continue to cause issues. Just like the different flu viruses. The vaccine covers the three strains which are thought to be the most prevalent that season. But there are still many others out there. That’s why swine flu was so bad. It emerged unexpectedly and wasn’t in the vaccine that year. And we’ve been fighting the flu for years and this virus for barely a year.
The jury will be out for a while on how effective the current vaccines are against the new variants and additional ones.2 -
I couldn't find any information on this question but I'm curious, maybe someone here knows. Concerning receiving the Moderna vaccine, are recipients under age 55 known to have a tougher time with side effects than other age categories?
My co-workers and I had our second dose on Friday. My arm was more sore than the first time, but other than that, I was fine. A few of my colleagues reported feeling cold-symptoms the day after. Took some Tylenol and felt much better later. I have a handful of people I know who’ve run fevers and felt bad for the first 24-36 hours.
All of us are under 55 except for one 61 year old.
No matter what the side effects from the immune response were, still better than getting COVID in my book!9 -
I couldn't find any information on this question but I'm curious, maybe someone here knows. Concerning receiving the Moderna vaccine, are recipients under age 55 known to have a tougher time with side effects than other age categories?
I have no idea in general, but I literally just got off the phone with my 29 year old daughter. She got her second moderna shot yesterday. She is wiped out. She has had a fever of 102 all night. Body hurts too much to sleep and even laying down at all is painful. She says that her whole body feels arthritic. She threw up at 2 am. Her one other comment though is that she wonders if this is how she feels from the vaccine, then how might she have felt contracting the actual COVID virus. She is trying to power through and avoid pain and fever reduces as many have claimed that you want the immune response to help build your immune response.
Well, one of my staff members was out for a month and has been back at 50% for the last two weeks. She STILL has a fever! I’m afraid she’s going to be a long-hauler.10 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »https://www.mediaite.com/news/johns-hopkins-doctor-predicts-covid-will-be-mostly-gone-by-april/
Sounds like high rates of Covid-19 may be finally winding down the pandemic.
That doesn’t mean we don’t still have a problem. It means 2000 people a day are dying instead of 10,000. Still an unacceptable rate for loss of life.17 -
My head is in a loop re: vaccines. I’ve always been a vaccine believer and taken everything officials recommend. I recently found out I’m pregnant, and covid vaccines are not approved for pregnant women. This means I can’t get a covid vaccine in the next 8 months, and even after that I don’t know how postpartum and breastfeeding are handled.
This is the first time ever I have had to rely on others getting vaccinated and forming herd immunity around me, and I don’t like this feeling. This is also the first time I’ve been worried about myself getting sick, so far all the worry has been related to me getting it, spreading it and causing harm to others.23 -
My head is in a loop re: vaccines. I’ve always been a vaccine believer and taken everything officials recommend. I recently found out I’m pregnant, and covid vaccines are not approved for pregnant women. This means I can’t get a covid vaccine in the next 8 months, and even after that I don’t know how postpartum and breastfeeding are handled.
This is the first time ever I have had to rely on others getting vaccinated and forming herd immunity around me, and I don’t like this feeling. This is also the first time I’ve been worried about myself getting sick, so far all the worry has been related to me getting it, spreading it and causing harm to others.
Congratulations! Wishing you all the best. Just stay calm and keep doing what you're doing. Time will fly--you'll see.6 -
Hispari, this is wonderful news, Congratulations a little one to share.
Up to now the vaccines have not been tested on pregnant women which is why its not being given. I've heard there is an intention to start testing soon if some testing has not started already, so its possible before too long there will be some information relating to pregnancy vaccination relatively soon. One of my granddaughters works in health care, she was still feeding when she returned to work, she had the vaccination and other than the slight ache and stiffness she had no ill effects.
As we are minding the little one, I can say he had more reaction to his booster for something 12 month stage, than to his mother passing immunity to covid to him. His temperament, sleep, wees and poo's did not change. I'm sure the population round you will be having their vaccinations which has the benefit of reducing the number of people who are likely to catch covid which will protect ultimately you.
For now, try not to worry. I'm sure you are doing all you can to keep yourself free of covid. Wearing masks when out, Not mixing in large numbers, washing hands, trying not to touch your face, even washing your face after going out. Dare I say, as a GGP, try to enjoy this time, little ones are yours for only a short time, enjoy it all while you can. My two are both 50+ now, life flies fast.5 -
My head is in a loop re: vaccines. I’ve always been a vaccine believer and taken everything officials recommend. I recently found out I’m pregnant, and covid vaccines are not approved for pregnant women. This means I can’t get a covid vaccine in the next 8 months, and even after that I don’t know how postpartum and breastfeeding are handled.
This is the first time ever I have had to rely on others getting vaccinated and forming herd immunity around me, and I don’t like this feeling. This is also the first time I’ve been worried about myself getting sick, so far all the worry has been related to me getting it, spreading it and causing harm to others.
Congratulations to you and your family! While I can imagine your fears and worries, you're pregnant in a much better time now than a year ago. JMO Let's face it, babies are still being born and staying healthy along with the mothers. I feel this virus is slowing down and treatments will be better, along with people getting vaccinated; it'll all start looking up. As someone else said, just continue being cautious and taking good care of yourself. Good luck!!3 -
My head is in a loop re: vaccines. I’ve always been a vaccine believer and taken everything officials recommend. I recently found out I’m pregnant, and covid vaccines are not approved for pregnant women. This means I can’t get a covid vaccine in the next 8 months, and even after that I don’t know how postpartum and breastfeeding are handled.
This is the first time ever I have had to rely on others getting vaccinated and forming herd immunity around me, and I don’t like this feeling. This is also the first time I’ve been worried about myself getting sick, so far all the worry has been related to me getting it, spreading it and causing harm to others.
I think it is criminal that pregnant health care workers in Canada are not being offered the vaccine. Are you not allowed to get it, or you have chosen not to?
It infuriates me that women are being exposed to a known risk, on order to shield a fetus from a potential risk. I expect that many (maybe most) low risk women would choose not to vaccinate, but I really think is their choice alone, because, bodily autonomy and all that.0 -
My head is in a loop re: vaccines. I’ve always been a vaccine believer and taken everything officials recommend. I recently found out I’m pregnant, and covid vaccines are not approved for pregnant women. This means I can’t get a covid vaccine in the next 8 months, and even after that I don’t know how postpartum and breastfeeding are handled.
This is the first time ever I have had to rely on others getting vaccinated and forming herd immunity around me, and I don’t like this feeling. This is also the first time I’ve been worried about myself getting sick, so far all the worry has been related to me getting it, spreading it and causing harm to others.
I think it is criminal that pregnant health care workers in Canada are not being offered the vaccine. Are you not allowed to get it, or you have chosen not to?
It infuriates me that women are being exposed to a known risk, on order to shield a fetus from a potential risk. I expect that many (maybe most) low risk women would choose not to vaccinate, but I really think is their choice alone, because, bodily autonomy and all that.
If the effects on a pregnant woman and her baby are not yet known--that would be a high liability for the makers of the vaccine, and let's not even think about consequences to the mother and child. Pregnant women cannot use most drugs because of effects. So, how is this "criminal"? Or do you have some studies showing safety?15 -
@hipari - congrats! That is so wonderful! You have to just worry about you and the baby and take care of yourself, like it sounds like you have been doing already. I'd be happy knowing your timing this year is actually probably better than last year.
Even if they are saying you can't get a shot yet, Pfizer is already in trials with pregnant women. 4000 I believe. If that goes well, and I think it will, shots will soon be available for you. From what I understand, there have already been many pregnant women that have had the shots, inadvertently, from the first shot trials -- ones that didn't know they were pregnant.6 -
My head is in a loop re: vaccines. I’ve always been a vaccine believer and taken everything officials recommend. I recently found out I’m pregnant, and covid vaccines are not approved for pregnant women. This means I can’t get a covid vaccine in the next 8 months, and even after that I don’t know how postpartum and breastfeeding are handled.
This is the first time ever I have had to rely on others getting vaccinated and forming herd immunity around me, and I don’t like this feeling. This is also the first time I’ve been worried about myself getting sick, so far all the worry has been related to me getting it, spreading it and causing harm to others.
I think it is criminal that pregnant health care workers in Canada are not being offered the vaccine. Are you not allowed to get it, or you have chosen not to?
It infuriates me that women are being exposed to a known risk, on order to shield a fetus from a potential risk. I expect that many (maybe most) low risk women would choose not to vaccinate, but I really think is their choice alone, because, bodily autonomy and all that.
I'm far from an antivaxer, but a woman would have to be crazy to volunteer to have the vaccine when it has never been tested on pregnant women/the effects on babies.
would you jump up and volunteer to be the first test case and then wait and see what happens when the baby comes out???11 -
snowflake954 wrote: »My head is in a loop re: vaccines. I’ve always been a vaccine believer and taken everything officials recommend. I recently found out I’m pregnant, and covid vaccines are not approved for pregnant women. This means I can’t get a covid vaccine in the next 8 months, and even after that I don’t know how postpartum and breastfeeding are handled.
This is the first time ever I have had to rely on others getting vaccinated and forming herd immunity around me, and I don’t like this feeling. This is also the first time I’ve been worried about myself getting sick, so far all the worry has been related to me getting it, spreading it and causing harm to others.
I think it is criminal that pregnant health care workers in Canada are not being offered the vaccine. Are you not allowed to get it, or you have chosen not to?
It infuriates me that women are being exposed to a known risk, on order to shield a fetus from a potential risk. I expect that many (maybe most) low risk women would choose not to vaccinate, but I really think is their choice alone, because, bodily autonomy and all that.
If the effects on a pregnant woman and her baby are not yet known--that would be a high liability for the makers of the vaccine, and let's not even think about consequences to the mother and child. Pregnant women cannot use most drugs because of effects. So, how is this "criminal"? Or do you have some studies showing safety?
Because I believe that a fully autonomous woman's right to life, health and wellbeing always takes precedence over that of any fetus she is carrying, and I oppose any policy or regulation that infringes on that in any way, shape or form.
I don't believe that any woman should be required to take an action that would risk her life or health in order to protect a fetus she is carrying, and I don't believe that any woman should be required to refuse a treatment that would protect her life or health in order to protect the life or health of a fetus she is carrying.
The Society of Obstetricians and Gynecologist of Canada holds this same view. I am not aware of any studies that show safety, however there are obviously not any studies that show long term safety to anyone with this vaccine, given the emergency nature of the approvals.
(It is possible that Canada has updated it's procedure on this by now - I haven't looked into it lately.)
"Consensus Statement: Women who are pregnant or breastfeeding should be offered vaccination at anytime if
they are eligible and no contraindications exist.
This decision is based on the women’s personal values and an understanding that the risk of infection and/or
morbidity from COVID-19 outweighs the theorized and undescribed risk of being vaccinated during pregnancy or
while breastfeeding. Women should not be precluded from vaccination based on pregnancy status or
breastfeeding."
https://sogc.org/common/Uploaded files/Latest News/SOGC_Statement_COVID-19_Vaccination_in_Pregnancy.pdf4 -
Muscleflex79 wrote: »My head is in a loop re: vaccines. I’ve always been a vaccine believer and taken everything officials recommend. I recently found out I’m pregnant, and covid vaccines are not approved for pregnant women. This means I can’t get a covid vaccine in the next 8 months, and even after that I don’t know how postpartum and breastfeeding are handled.
This is the first time ever I have had to rely on others getting vaccinated and forming herd immunity around me, and I don’t like this feeling. This is also the first time I’ve been worried about myself getting sick, so far all the worry has been related to me getting it, spreading it and causing harm to others.
I think it is criminal that pregnant health care workers in Canada are not being offered the vaccine. Are you not allowed to get it, or you have chosen not to?
It infuriates me that women are being exposed to a known risk, on order to shield a fetus from a potential risk. I expect that many (maybe most) low risk women would choose not to vaccinate, but I really think is their choice alone, because, bodily autonomy and all that.
I'm far from an antivaxer, but a woman would have to be crazy to volunteer to have the vaccine when it has never been tested on pregnant women/the effects on babies.
would you jump up and volunteer to be the first test case and then wait and see what happens when the baby comes out???
No personally I would not.0 -
snowflake954 wrote: »My head is in a loop re: vaccines. I’ve always been a vaccine believer and taken everything officials recommend. I recently found out I’m pregnant, and covid vaccines are not approved for pregnant women. This means I can’t get a covid vaccine in the next 8 months, and even after that I don’t know how postpartum and breastfeeding are handled.
This is the first time ever I have had to rely on others getting vaccinated and forming herd immunity around me, and I don’t like this feeling. This is also the first time I’ve been worried about myself getting sick, so far all the worry has been related to me getting it, spreading it and causing harm to others.
I think it is criminal that pregnant health care workers in Canada are not being offered the vaccine. Are you not allowed to get it, or you have chosen not to?
It infuriates me that women are being exposed to a known risk, on order to shield a fetus from a potential risk. I expect that many (maybe most) low risk women would choose not to vaccinate, but I really think is their choice alone, because, bodily autonomy and all that.
If the effects on a pregnant woman and her baby are not yet known--that would be a high liability for the makers of the vaccine, and let's not even think about consequences to the mother and child. Pregnant women cannot use most drugs because of effects. So, how is this "criminal"? Or do you have some studies showing safety?
Because I believe that a fully autonomous woman's right to life, health and wellbeing always takes precedence over that of any fetus she is carrying, and I oppose any policy or regulation that infringes on that in any way, shape or form.
I don't believe that any woman should be required to take an action that would risk her life or health in order to protect a fetus she is carrying, and I don't believe that any woman should be required to refuse a treatment that would protect her life or health in order to protect the life or health of a fetus she is carrying.
The Society of Obstetricians and Gynecologist of Canada holds this same view. I am not aware of any studies that show safety, however there are obviously not any studies that show long term safety to anyone with this vaccine, given the emergency nature of the approvals.
(It is possible that Canada has updated it's procedure on this by now - I haven't looked into it lately.)
"Consensus Statement: Women who are pregnant or breastfeeding should be offered vaccination at anytime if
they are eligible and no contraindications exist.
This decision is based on the women’s personal values and an understanding that the risk of infection and/or
morbidity from COVID-19 outweighs the theorized and undescribed risk of being vaccinated during pregnancy or
while breastfeeding. Women should not be precluded from vaccination based on pregnancy status or
breastfeeding."
https://sogc.org/common/Uploaded files/Latest News/SOGC_Statement_COVID-19_Vaccination_in_Pregnancy.pdf
I don't really care about beliefs here. I'm saying that there is liability until proven safe.6 -
snowflake954 wrote: »snowflake954 wrote: »My head is in a loop re: vaccines. I’ve always been a vaccine believer and taken everything officials recommend. I recently found out I’m pregnant, and covid vaccines are not approved for pregnant women. This means I can’t get a covid vaccine in the next 8 months, and even after that I don’t know how postpartum and breastfeeding are handled.
This is the first time ever I have had to rely on others getting vaccinated and forming herd immunity around me, and I don’t like this feeling. This is also the first time I’ve been worried about myself getting sick, so far all the worry has been related to me getting it, spreading it and causing harm to others.
I think it is criminal that pregnant health care workers in Canada are not being offered the vaccine. Are you not allowed to get it, or you have chosen not to?
It infuriates me that women are being exposed to a known risk, on order to shield a fetus from a potential risk. I expect that many (maybe most) low risk women would choose not to vaccinate, but I really think is their choice alone, because, bodily autonomy and all that.
If the effects on a pregnant woman and her baby are not yet known--that would be a high liability for the makers of the vaccine, and let's not even think about consequences to the mother and child. Pregnant women cannot use most drugs because of effects. So, how is this "criminal"? Or do you have some studies showing safety?
Because I believe that a fully autonomous woman's right to life, health and wellbeing always takes precedence over that of any fetus she is carrying, and I oppose any policy or regulation that infringes on that in any way, shape or form.
I don't believe that any woman should be required to take an action that would risk her life or health in order to protect a fetus she is carrying, and I don't believe that any woman should be required to refuse a treatment that would protect her life or health in order to protect the life or health of a fetus she is carrying.
The Society of Obstetricians and Gynecologist of Canada holds this same view. I am not aware of any studies that show safety, however there are obviously not any studies that show long term safety to anyone with this vaccine, given the emergency nature of the approvals.
(It is possible that Canada has updated it's procedure on this by now - I haven't looked into it lately.)
"Consensus Statement: Women who are pregnant or breastfeeding should be offered vaccination at anytime if
they are eligible and no contraindications exist.
This decision is based on the women’s personal values and an understanding that the risk of infection and/or
morbidity from COVID-19 outweighs the theorized and undescribed risk of being vaccinated during pregnancy or
while breastfeeding. Women should not be precluded from vaccination based on pregnancy status or
breastfeeding."
https://sogc.org/common/Uploaded files/Latest News/SOGC_Statement_COVID-19_Vaccination_in_Pregnancy.pdf
I don't really care about beliefs here. I'm saying that there is liability until proven safe.
OK - I'm not really overly concerned with the vaccine companies liability issues at this point. I am more concerned that women might die unnecessarily by being refused a vaccine that should be made available to them.1
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