Why are carbs so bad?

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Replies

  • javamonster
    javamonster Posts: 272 Member


    lol@ posting your credentials on an internet forum just to make it seem you know something more then everyone else


    Sorry, she wins. I'll take her real-life scientific creds over your imaginary internet ones any day. :laugh:
  • furekurss
    furekurss Posts: 74
    "
    Long term study of meat only diet for a year - better health than when the subjects started
    http://www.jbc.org/content/87/3/651.full.pdf

    me in med field too and got degree in 08 - info change a lot since you went school even though the study above is from 1931! "


    ^this
  • killagb
    killagb Posts: 3,280 Member
    There's far too much horse crap in this thread to even begin to touch it all. Carry on torturing yourselves people. :drinker:
  • furekurss
    furekurss Posts: 74
    There's far too much horse crap in this thread to even begin to touch it all. Carry on torturing yourselves people. :drinker:

    Great contribution to the thread MAN A++

























































    Not serious, please go
  • Acg67
    Acg67 Posts: 12,142 Member

    lol@ posting your credentials on an internet forum just to make it seem you know something more then everyone else

    brb im an astronaut/ Nigerian Prince here, i know how eating works too!
    FIBER= Carbs, who said they are not? lool. they have no Kcals in it, that is why i eat them bc i can subtrack from my Daily intake.
    but to say Fiber is not a carb is like saying a car is not car bc it does not have tires

    Read this then come at me with whatever you got,

    15 years of higher education=/= know it all
    ps. where is your proofs with actual references?


    http://www.ispub.com/journal/the-internet-journal-of-nutrition-and-wellness/volume-4-number-2/arguments-in-favor-of-ketogenic-diets.html#h1-0

    ^READ IT

    it is hard for me to take that study seriously when the author offers the hypothesis that cho is the sole cause of obesity and says there is a metabolic advantage to low carb diets, when controlled metabolic ward studies show that not to be the case, see;

    http://www.ajcn.org/content/20/10/1104.full.pdf

    http://www.ajcn.org/content/21/11/1291.full.pdf

    http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/92/11/4480.full

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8968851

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8561057

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2319073
  • killagb
    killagb Posts: 3,280 Member
    There's far too much horse crap in this thread to even begin to touch it all. Carry on torturing yourselves people. :drinker:

    Great contribution to the thread MAN A++


    Not serious, please go
    Oh...I see what you did there. Eat some carbs, you might cheer up. :drinker:
  • LabRat529
    LabRat529 Posts: 1,323 Member
    http://www.ispub.com/journal/the-internet-journal-of-nutrition-and-wellness/volume-4-number-2/arguments-in-favor-of-ketogenic-diets.html#h1-0

    I never ONCE argued that there weren't advantages to the ketogenic diet. In fact, I've said multiple times in multiple threads that the ketogenic diet has its advantages. They are helpful for people with type II diabetes, for example. There's some evidence that ketogenic diets are beneficial in Alzheimer's disease too for some people (though that's still being debated in the scientific circles).

    What I'm arguing against is the claim that I keep seeing over and over and over again that dietary carbs aren't essential to life. You've been saying it. Others have been saying it. But I've never seen any evidence that anyone can live long-term on 0 carbs every single day.

    The simple truth is: we don't know if dietary carbs are essential to human life. Until someone does a study with a ZERO carb diet (instead of a LOW carb diet)... we just don't know.

    So I really wish people would stop shouting that as truth when we don't know if it is or not. And we do know fiber is needed, so if you're like me and you define fiber as a carb, then you know that "we don't need carbs" is a false statement because we do need fiber.

    There aren't any ESSENTIAL carbs. "Essential" in this context means your body has to get them from diet, it can't make them. Essential amino acids, for example, means your body can't make those amino acids and if they're not in your food, your body is screwed. There are essential fats too. No essential carbs. So as long as your body has some carbs and some fats and some proteins, it can make all the carbohydrate and sugar molecules it needs- including those used to make DNA and RNA.

    As for references... pick up any basic biochemistry text book. Or organic chemistry book. Or human physiology book. Or nutrition... any of those should do it.

    By the way... I don't really count the "ihe-internet-journal-of-nutrition-and-wellness" as a good scientific journal. Sorry.

    However, there ARE plenty of good journal articles available on PubMed that will support your assertion that a LOW carb diet is beneficial.
  • gashinshotan
    gashinshotan Posts: 749 Member
    I actually learned that carbohydrates aren't essential in my biochemistry course....
    http://www.ispub.com/journal/the-internet-journal-of-nutrition-and-wellness/volume-4-number-2/arguments-in-favor-of-ketogenic-diets.html#h1-0

    I never ONCE argued that there weren't advantages to the ketogenic diet. In fact, I've said multiple times in multiple threads that the ketogenic diet has its advantages. They are helpful for people with type II diabetes, for example. There's some evidence that ketogenic diets are beneficial in Alzheimer's disease too for some people (though that's still being debated in the scientific circles).

    What I'm arguing against is the claim that I keep seeing over and over and over again that dietary carbs aren't essential to life. You've been saying it. Others have been saying it. But I've never seen any evidence that anyone can live long-term on 0 carbs every single day.

    The simple truth is: we don't know if dietary carbs are essential to human life. Until someone does a study with a ZERO carb diet (instead of a LOW carb diet)... we just don't know.

    So I really wish people would stop shouting that as truth when we don't know if it is or not. And we do know fiber is needed, so if you're like me and you define fiber as a carb, then you know that "we don't need carbs" is a false statement because we do need fiber.

    There aren't any ESSENTIAL carbs. "Essential" in this context means your body has to get them from diet, it can't make them. Essential amino acids, for example, means your body can't make those amino acids and if they're not in your food, your body is screwed. There are essential fats too. No essential carbs. So as long as your body has some carbs and some fats and some proteins, it can make all the carbohydrate and sugar molecules it needs- including those used to make DNA and RNA.

    As for references... pick up any basic biochemistry text book. Or organic chemistry book. Or human physiology book. Or nutrition... any of those should do it.

    By the way... I don't really count the "ihe-internet-journal-of-nutrition-and-wellness" as a good scientific journal. Sorry.

    However, there ARE plenty of good journal articles available on PubMed that will support your assertion that a LOW carb diet is beneficial.
  • gashinshotan
    gashinshotan Posts: 749 Member
    If she got her degree 15 years ago that most likely means she didn't learn the most current info - textbooks/professors change YEARLY while new discoveries/studies are produced practically every day...


    lol@ posting your credentials on an internet forum just to make it seem you know something more then everyone else


    Sorry, she wins. I'll take her real-life scientific creds over your imaginary internet ones any day. :laugh:
  • LabRat529
    LabRat529 Posts: 1,323 Member
    "
    Long term study of meat only diet for a year - better health than when the subjects started
    http://www.jbc.org/content/87/3/651.full.pdf

    me in med field too and got degree in 08 - info change a lot since you went school even though the study above is from 1931! "


    ^this

    Okay. One study. Published in 1930. In a decent journal.

    Sample size: 2 men.

    Diet: Nothing but meat and fat for one year.

    I'll make a good faith effort to see if anyone has reproduced the work in a larger sample size.
  • gashinshotan
    gashinshotan Posts: 749 Member
    So far I've provided a published scientific article to prove that people don't need carbohydrates to live. You have provided 0.
    "
    Long term study of meat only diet for a year - better health than when the subjects started
    http://www.jbc.org/content/87/3/651.full.pdf

    me in med field too and got degree in 08 - info change a lot since you went school even though the study above is from 1931! "


    ^this

    Okay. One study. Published in 1930. In a decent journal.

    Sample size: 2 men.

    Diet: Nothing but meat and fat for one year.

    I'll make a good faith effort to see if anyone has reproduced the work in a larger sample size.
  • Jeff92se
    Jeff92se Posts: 3,369 Member
    Why would you WANT to live on meat alone? So you survive. Big deal.

    You survive by drinking your own urine too.
  • harold_IV
    harold_IV Posts: 46 Member
    and i'm a little lost, can someone explain to me what makes a bad carb bad and good carb good?

    good question


    Good carbs are slow digesting or complex....like whole grains, wheat bread. Bad carbs are simple. carbs...candy...white bread etc.
  • Acg67
    Acg67 Posts: 12,142 Member
    and i'm a little lost, can someone explain to me what makes a bad carb bad and good carb good?

    good question


    Good carbs are slow digesting or complex....like whole grains, wheat bread. Bad carbs are simple. carbs...candy...white bread etc.

    and why does it make a carb good just because they are slow digesting?
  • Jeff92se
    Jeff92se Posts: 3,369 Member
    and i'm a little lost, can someone explain to me what makes a bad carb bad and good carb good?

    good question


    Good carbs are slow digesting or complex....like whole grains, wheat bread. Bad carbs are simple. carbs...candy...white bread etc.

    and why does it make a carb good just because they are slow digesting?

    Probably because they make you feel fuller a bit longer?
  • harold_IV
    harold_IV Posts: 46 Member
    It makes you feel fuller longer so you won't eat as much. Plus it doesn't hit the bloodstream as fast, so theres no insulin response. Your body will more likely stay in fat burning mode then fat storing mode.
  • LabRat529
    LabRat529 Posts: 1,323 Member
    "
    Long term study of meat only diet for a year - better health than when the subjects started
    http://www.jbc.org/content/87/3/651.full.pdf

    me in med field too and got degree in 08 - info change a lot since you went school even though the study above is from 1931! "


    ^this

    This is actually a pretty cool study. Fun to read.

    But guess what? Not zero carbs. Very very low carbs. But not zero. If you read the whole thing, in the description of the diet, it says the men were getting 7-12 grams of carbs per day. Which is not much at all... but still not zero.
  • dandur
    dandur Posts: 267 Member
    bumping for amusement factor
  • baisleac
    baisleac Posts: 2,019 Member
    They're not. Plain and simple.
  • gashinshotan
    gashinshotan Posts: 749 Member
    I heard that's good for balancing nitrogen in the blood stream.
    Why would you WANT to live on meat alone? So you survive. Big deal.

    You survive by drinking your own urine too.
  • Acg67
    Acg67 Posts: 12,142 Member
    It makes you feel fuller longer so you won't eat as much. Plus it doesn't hit the bloodstream as fast, so theres no insulin response. Your body will more likely stay in fat burning mode then fat storing mode.

    that's interesting, hasn't research born out that low GI diets are not more satiating then higher GI diets?

    and why should one worry about insulin response? protein is highly isulingenic as well
  • harold_IV
    harold_IV Posts: 46 Member
    It makes you feel fuller longer so you won't eat as much. Plus it doesn't hit the bloodstream as fast, so theres no insulin response. Your body will more likely stay in fat burning mode then fat storing mode.

    that's interesting, hasn't research born out that low GI diets are not more satiating then higher GI diets?

    and why should one worry about insulin response? protein is highly isulingenic as well

    hmm well I don't know if its true or not, but I've heard fitness experts say that Insulin and HGH can't coexist? So for example if you eat all these simple carbs before you go to bed and you get an insulin response, than you would be stunting growth of gains you made in the gym earlier that day. Or not getting the most maximum gain at least
  • Jeff92se
    Jeff92se Posts: 3,369 Member
    I've had refined carbs as breakfast and I'm really hungry really fast. Complex carbs seem to help keep me fuller, longer.

    Protein does an even better job.
  • Acg67
    Acg67 Posts: 12,142 Member
    It makes you feel fuller longer so you won't eat as much. Plus it doesn't hit the bloodstream as fast, so theres no insulin response. Your body will more likely stay in fat burning mode then fat storing mode.

    that's interesting, hasn't research born out that low GI diets are not more satiating then higher GI diets?

    and why should one worry about insulin response? protein is highly isulingenic as well

    hmm well I don't know if its true or not, but I've heard fitness experts say that Insulin and HGH can't coexist? So for example if you eat all these simple carbs before you go to bed and you get an insulin response, than you would be stunting growth of gains you made in the gym earlier that day. Or not getting the most maximum gain at least

    and yet you will hear people advise you ingest a slower acting protein like casein pre bed for a steady supply of aminos, but casein will also lead to insulin secretion, albeit a smaller spike then lets say whey
  • Rae6503
    Rae6503 Posts: 6,294 Member
    Nevermind.
  • RonSwanson66
    RonSwanson66 Posts: 1,150 Member
    and i'm a little lost, can someone explain to me what makes a bad carb bad and good carb good?

    good question


    Good carbs are slow digesting or complex....like whole grains, wheat bread. Bad carbs are simple. carbs...candy...white bread etc.

    Context matters.

    Try doing a UD2.0 refeed on your "good" carbs, you won't think they're so good any more.

    Labeling food "good" or "bad" in isolation is nothing but simplistic thinking.
  • RonSwanson66
    RonSwanson66 Posts: 1,150 Member
    It makes you feel fuller longer so you won't eat as much. Plus it doesn't hit the bloodstream as fast, so theres no insulin response. Your body will more likely stay in fat burning mode then fat storing mode.

    LULZ.

    Of course there's an insulin response. Unless you eat a diet of pure fat (or fructose) you will have an insulin response.

    If insulin is evil, why aren't the carbophobes afraid of protein too?
  • hottottie11
    hottottie11 Posts: 907 Member
    Well I'm about to have me a bowl of ice cream and a glass of wine...I hope those evil carbs don't kill me in my sleep
  • Sublog
    Sublog Posts: 1,296 Member
    I hear people saying that they have to avoid carbs a lot, but I don't understand why. I eat bread or pasta or potatoes all the time and I'm still losing weight. Also I thought they were good for you because they keep you full?
    Can anyone explain? (:

    They are not bad. In fact, they are really good. Most people who think carbs are bad for weight loss simply don't understand the difference between water weight and fat weight. Carbs will make you retain more water. People freak out when they eat carbs because the next day their scale weight goes up. They immediately think carbs evil.
  • furekurss
    furekurss Posts: 74
    "
    Long term study of meat only diet for a year - better health than when the subjects started
    http://www.jbc.org/content/87/3/651.full.pdf

    me in med field too and got degree in 08 - info change a lot since you went school even though the study above is from 1931! "


    ^this

    This is actually a pretty cool study. Fun to read.

    But guess what? Not zero carbs. Very very low carbs. But not zero. If you read the whole thing, in the description of the diet, it says the men were getting 7-12 grams of carbs per day. Which is not much at all... but still not zero.

    u cant be serious... just wow... please tell me you are joking right now. i said IT WAS POSSIBLE TO LIVE WITH
    0 CARBS. Not that doing KETO, you have to Eat Zero CARBS.

    btw, where is bio engineering degree? still awaiting :)

    please respond

    also lol@ ppl for carbs here and bashing KETO, i hope you understand that kids and adults with Epilypsy go on this diet for years, some are cured after 2-3 years, and some have to stay on it for life so they dont have seizures. but you probably dont read, but hey, but with that bio engineering degree, who needs further school right? i should know, im a Nigerian Prince !!!

    bodybuilders use this diet to lose water and fat, and retain alot muscles then the standard "deficit Calories"

    and if you still think carbs are cool, i dont care you do what ever the Hell you wanna do. if a bio enegener says "eat 200g of carbs a day but only eat 1500kcals a day and you will lose weight" go ahead, id rather read actual books that were published in the 2000s with actual research in it.
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