Why are carbs so bad?
Replies
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RS, I fail to see why you're quoting these. Are you suggesting I get my head checked? Where have said that LM advocates a Keto diet over another? Perhaps you're the one who needs help in reading comprehension?
We'll agree that a X amount of calories on a Keto diet vs. X amount of calories on "insert diet here" will yield the same amount of weight loss (excluding water weight).
Just because I state that there are other advantages to keto, you want to attack me? Pretty immature coming from someone in their mid-forties. Not cool.
For anyone mature who'd like to discuss, here's some studies on the effects on appetite from ketosis.
Yudkin J. The low-carbohydrate diet in the treatment of obesity. Postgrad Med (1972) 151-154
Yudkin J. and Carey M. The treatment of obesity by a ‘high-fat’ diet - the inevitably of calories. Lancet (1960) 939
Rosen JC et. al. Comparison of carbohydrate-containing and carbohydrate-restricted hypocaloric diets in the treatment of obesity: effects on appetite and mood. Am J Clin Nutr 82 (1982) 36: 463-4690 -
Why would one be on a low carb diet if they don't have to?0
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We'll agree that a X amount of calories on a Keto diet vs. X amount of calories on "insert diet here" will yield the same amount of weight loss (excluding water weight).
Except it won't if you are insulin resistant.
I am eating slightly MORE calories a day on a keto diet than I was previously, yet am loosing more weight (18 pounds so far). There is more than simply calories in at play.0 -
They aren't. They are easy for your body to convert into glucose which can then be converted in to ATP to fuel your cells.
They are good for fast energy, but if you don't use them up, your body converts them into lipids (fat) to store energy for later.0 -
Why would one be on a low carb diet if they don't have to?
I feel fuller, I am never hungry or feel deprived. I have tried simply cutting calories (and lost 60 pounds) but I had to cut a LOT just to make the scale move or inches disapear. I was miserable and could not live like that. They came back.
Low carb for me isn't hard. I loved breads! But I don't crave them now.
Why is also health issues. Some interesting primary lit shows that you have a much decreased chance of cancer if you go low carb. Less free radicals in the body. There are also some amazing studies (going back to the 50s but ignored for political lobbiest reasons) that cholesterol levels and heart disease could be related to high carb diets.
I would say why eat empty calories if you don't have to?
To me carbs aren't 'bad'. But there are carbs from 'good' sources and carbs from 'bad' sources. I obviously had an insulin issue with carbs. So I avoid many carbs in general and why I eventually gravitated to keto (there are MANY forms of low carb diet) You do need some sugars, but your body can make sugar (gluconeogensis) from protien. You don't NEED to eat carbs to get all your energy or nutrients. You do NEED fats and protiens though. Eating some carbs if you aren't sensitive to them, from good sources (not typical bread, rice or pasta) is likely a good thing.
Hope that anwers your question.0 -
To echo Dundreggen, a lot of people feel a lot better when eating a lower amount of carbohydrates and it is easier for them to maintain a caloric deficit. I don't know why it ends up being such a heated debate.Why would one be on a low carb diet if they don't have to?0 -
Yudkin J. The low-carbohydrate diet in the treatment of obesity. Postgrad Med (1972) 151-154
Link? No abstract available on PubMedYudkin J. and Carey M. The treatment of obesity by a ‘high-fat’ diet - the inevitably of calories. Lancet (1960) 939
Link to full-text? Pubmed only lists title w/ no abstract.Rosen JC et. al. Comparison of carbohydrate-containing and carbohydrate-restricted hypocaloric diets in the treatment of obesity: effects on appetite and mood. Am J Clin Nutr 82 (1982) 36: 463-469
OOPS!
"There was no support for the idea that a carbohydrate-free protein-supplemented fast decreases appetite and elevates mood in comparison with an isocaloric carbohydrate-containing diet. Thus, suppression of appetite alone does not appear to be sufficient reason in itself for using diets of this type."0 -
To echo Dundreggen, a lot of people feel a lot better when eating a lower amount of carbohydrates and it is easier for them to maintain a caloric deficit. I don't know why it ends up being such a heated debate.Why would one be on a low carb diet if they don't have to?
Because many claim that this is a universal response, or that calories don't matter. Low-carb diets, for those that respond well to them, are fine.
Demonizing carbs is idiotic.0 -
Higher protein diets are known to be more satiating, at least that's been my assessment reading nutritional studies for the last decade..........it's not something in doubt imo.0
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I've lowered my carbs to more of the complex type. But I'm not there to tell people that ultra low / low carb diets are better than another. I don't think most here would argue that.
But the pissing contest is another thing.0 -
"There was no support for the idea that a carbohydrate-free protein-supplemented fast decreases appetite and elevates mood in comparison with an isocaloric carbohydrate-containing diet. Thus, suppression of appetite alone does not appear to be sufficient reason in itself for using diets of this type."
My bad, not a very good study for any theory. The diet consisted of 827 kcal/day.
Link to study.
http://www.ajcn.org/content/36/3/463.full.pdf
"During the initial 1 1-day base-line period, the subjects were fed a weight-maintaining diet containing 45% carbohydrate, 40% fat, and 5% protein. They were then randomly assigned to one of two isocaloric (827 kcal) diets for the next 6 wk: 1 ) carbohydrate containing diet (CHO; n = 4) 35% protein, 36% fat, 29% carbohydrate and 2) carbohydrate restricted diet (NO CHO; n = 4) 35% protein, 64% fat, 1% carbohydrate. The diets consisted of lean meat, fish, or fowl, with margarine to provide extra fat and grape juice for extra carbohydrate. Boullion was given two to three times per day to provide additional sodium, and potassium intake was supplemented with 25 mEq/day ofthe chloride. Calcium intake was supplemented with 200 mg/day of the carbonate. Multivitamins (Squibb Theragram-M) with iron and minerals were given daily. Noncaloric beverages were allowed ad libitum."
For your reading pleasure.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17228046
The effects of a low-carbohydrate ketogenic diet and a low-fat diet on mood, hunger, and other self-reported symptoms.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18175736
Effects of a high-protein ketogenic diet on hunger, appetite, and weight loss in obese men feeding ad libitum.
Now it just looks like I'm cherry picking. Feel free to post any relevent studies to that may contradict these. I'd be interested in reading them.0 -
Ketogenic low-carbohydrate diets have no metabolic advantage over nonketogenic low-carbohydrate diets.
Johnston CS, Tjonn SL, Swan PD, White A, Hutchins H, Sears B.
Source
Department of Nutrition, Arizona State University, Mesa, AZ 85212, USA. carol.johnston@asu.edu
Abstract
BACKGROUND:
Low-carbohydrate diets may promote greater weight loss than does the conventional low-fat, high-carbohydrate diet.
OBJECTIVE:
We compared weight loss and biomarker change in adults adhering to a ketogenic low-carbohydrate (KLC) diet or a nonketogenic low-carbohydrate (NLC) diet.
DESIGN:
Twenty adults [body mass index (in kg/m(2)): 34.4 +/- 1.0] were randomly assigned to the KLC (60% of energy as fat, beginning with approximately 5% of energy as carbohydrate) or NLC (30% of energy as fat; approximately 40% of energy as carbohydrate) diet. During the 6-wk trial, participants were sedentary, and 24-h intakes were strictly controlled.
RESULTS:
Mean (+/-SE) weight losses (6.3 +/- 0.6 and 7.2 +/- 0.8 kg in KLC and NLC dieters, respectively; P = 0.324) and fat losses (3.4 and 5.5 kg in KLC and NLC dieters, respectively; P = 0.111) did not differ significantly by group after 6 wk. Blood beta-hydroxybutyrate in the KLC dieters was 3.6 times that in the NLC dieters at week 2 (P = 0.018), and LDL cholesterol was directly correlated with blood beta-hydroxybutyrate (r = 0.297, P = 0.025). Overall, insulin sensitivity and resting energy expenditure increased and serum gamma-glutamyltransferase concentrations decreased in both diet groups during the 6-wk trial (P < 0.05). However, inflammatory risk (arachidonic acid:eicosapentaenoic acid ratios in plasma phospholipids) and perceptions of vigor were more adversely affected by the KLC than by the NLC diet.
CONCLUSIONS:
KLC and NLC diets were equally effective in reducing body weight and insulin resistance, but the KLC diet was associated with several adverse metabolic and emotional effects. The use of ketogenic diets for weight loss is not warranted.
Like I said, the response to keto diets is highly individial. What part of this are you failing to understand?0 -
Like I said, the response to keto diets is highly individial. What part of this are you failing to understand?
Where did I say otherwise?0 -
Like I said, the response to keto diets is highly individial. What part of this are you failing to understand?
Where did I say otherwise?
ppl that in favor of keto or low carb diet should just stop posting in this tread, you guys are beating a dead horse.
let the simple minded follow their " balanced" diet
will we get lean Thick Solid, vascular.0 -
Color me content to be simple-minded, then.0
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So. to summarize the takeaway messages here....
Weight loss and muscle preservation/building success can be had with and without carbs
If you limit carbs too severely you may turn into a raging *kitten*
Paleoman ate a diet rich in cheese and pepperoni
Paleoman fanboys get very angry when other people eat carbs
My oatmeal and banana tastes delicious this morning
nice physic bro! tell me more0 -
Color me content to be simple-minded, then.
the ususal,
eat "good" fats, stay away from saturated fat,
have "good"carbs,
eat only Lean Proteins.
and eat about 40% cabs, 50% Protein, 10% fats,
you will be fine,
KETO=BAD!!! dont listen to anyone here infavor of such diets!!0 -
Can't help but think of this:will we get lean Thick Solid, vascular.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkvL-bO8LEY 0 -
Like I said, the response to keto diets is highly individial. What part of this are you failing to understand?
Where did I say otherwise?
ppl that in favor of keto or low carb diet should just stop posting in this tread, you guys are beating a dead horse.
let the simple minded follow their " balanced" diet
will we get lean Thick Solid, vascular.
I don't think this guy follows a low carb diet religon like you. Given the choice based on apparent results, I'd have to go with this
vs 
. since you seem to be judging by reuslts. 0 -
Like I said, the response to keto diets is highly individial. What part of this are you failing to understand?
Where did I say otherwise?
ppl that in favor of keto or low carb diet should just stop posting in this tread, you guys are beating a dead horse.
let the simple minded follow their " balanced" diet
will we get lean Thick Solid, vascular.
Again what advantages do keto diets provide over "balanced diets" in terms of leaning out?0 -
but lockef what is the point of posting studies saying that KETO lowers appetite and helps one to maintain on a weight loss plan when just spending 3 minutes looking at your food dairy for the entire month of November there was only ONE day (nov 30th) that you succeeded in not being grossly in the red (like by 500, 1200, 1700 calories)? candy bars and pie every day? if that's the KETO diet hell sign us all up! :laugh:
does someone, anyone, have a food dairy that is doing this method of dieting that can even loosely fall under the category of healthy? seriously, i just would like to look at one.... cause 85 slices of pepperoni for breakfast and candy bars every day just are clashing too hard with my idea of what a healthy, able to stay on for life, food plan should look like.0 -
Like I said, the response to keto diets is highly individial. What part of this are you failing to understand?
Where did I say otherwise?
ppl that in favor of keto or low carb diet should just stop posting in this tread, you guys are beating a dead horse.
let the simple minded follow their " balanced" diet
will we get lean Thick Solid, vascular.
I don't think this guy follows a low carb diet religon like you. Given the choice based on apparent results, I'd have to go with this vs . since you seem to be judging by reuslts.
yeah, i started the KETO 3 weeks ago, but that pic is from early 2011. months ago, but nice try.
also, i am a powerlifter, there for, actually i had a "balanced" diet with carbs in the pic (standard bulk up diet). come at me when you can deadlift 500lb or squat 400lbs.
follow whatever diet you want lol0 -
but lockef what is the point of posting studies saying that KETO lowers appetite and helps one to maintain on a weight loss plan when just spending 3 minutes looking at your food dairy for the entire month of November there was only ONE day (nov 30th) that you succeeded in not being grossly in the red (like by 500, 1200, 1700 calories)? candy bars and pie every day? if that's the KETO diet hell sign us all up! :laugh:
I'm bulking. Pretty hard to do on keto.
Look at my diary before halloween, and you can see a good 4 months (edit: 3 1/2 months) worth of when I was on keto (with a few cheat days thrown in on weekends).
Edit: Also, I just recently lowered my calories to start maintaining. When you change your calorie goal, it changes your past calorie goals as well. If you go back to when I was doing keto, you'll notice I'm way under on 85% of the days because of this.0 -
Like I said, the response to keto diets is highly individial. What part of this are you failing to understand?
Where did I say otherwise?
ppl that in favor of keto or low carb diet should just stop posting in this tread, you guys are beating a dead horse.
let the simple minded follow their " balanced" diet
will we get lean Thick Solid, vascular.
I don't think this guy follows a low carb diet religon like you. Given the choice based on apparent results, I'd have to go with this vs . since you seem to be judging by reuslts.
yeah, i started the KETO 3 weeks ago, but that pic is from early 2011. months ago, but nice try.
also, i am a powerlifter, there for, actually i had a "balanced" diet with carbs in the pic (standard bulk up diet). come at me when you can deadlift 500lb or squat 400lbs.
follow whatever diet you want lol
My best competition squat was 450lbs (I failed at 500lbs). Best competition dead was 450lbs. This was competing at 165lbs.
I don't qualify anyone's "numbers" unless they are power lifiting rules legal.
I still do powerlifing lifts but no longer desire to be bigger. No point at this stage.
I hope you weigh like 156lbs or something. Even then, those numbers wouldn't win a local powerlifting meet around here.
Futhermore, that avatar (not avi) was taken a year+ ago. But not sure how you can really judge as I'm wearing a sweatshirt. Also I said "the advice I'd follow". Not "I'm better looking than you therefore, my advice has more merit".0 -
NEBER LISSN TO ANYONE WHO ISN"T TEH JAKD!!
Oh wait, someone should've told this guy:
that he shouldn't listen to this guy:
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That's it. I'm going to have to dead lift you all. Get in line in an orderly fashion please.0
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That's it. I'm going to have to dead lift you all. Get in line in an orderly fashion please.
1st!0 -
Well, I'll be doggone! I reckon perhaps I may've been wrong. It just wouldn't have been as fun if I went to Wikipedia before I answered the young ladies question... Doggonit' from now on, I reckon, I'll just go to Wikipedia for all my info. Great suggestion. So we need carbs for energy, not survival... hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Very good to know.no we dont
"Carbohydrates are not necessary building blocks of other molecules, and the body can obtain all its energy from protein and fats.[11][12] The brain fats contain 37.8 kilojoules (9 kilocalories) per gram. In the case of protein, this is somewhat misleading as only some amino acids are usable for fuel."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbohydrate#NutritionProtein is better but need carbs for cardio performance
We need them to carry protein to our cells. Not arguing... just adding.0 -
Honestly...?!:bigsmile:0
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The body breaks down all carbohydrates (except fibers) to a simple form of sugar called "Glucose" and goes into the blood, therefore called "blood sugar". When you eat any carbohydrates, they break down to sugars and finally to Glucose. The Glucose rushes into your blood quickly; in other words, your blood sugar level will rise sharply. Your body makes an instant decision of how much of that pure energy goes for immediate needs and how much will it store. The tool of this decision is Insulin, which regulates the processing of blood sugar.
Insulin does three things to blood sugar:
1. Transports one part of blood sugar to the cells to take care of immediate energy demand. This is a bypass of your own energy production system.
2. Stores another part of blood sugar in carbo-storages in muscles and liver.
3. Converts the leftover blood sugar to fat and stores it as BODY FAT.
Insulin is also a fat storage and locking hormone. In other words, it makes you fat and it keeps you fat.
Carbohydrates trigger Insulin (fat storage).
Proteins trigger Glucagon (fat burning).
How's that for a technical answer? :-)0
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