You guys really like to over complicate things.
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I see threads all the time on here with some crazy nonsense like "eat 6 small meals a day" or here's a funny one "gaining weight after I quit smoking" the list goes on though.
Smoking - You will not gain weight if you quit smoking unless you binge eat after quitting, that's all there is to it.
Losing weight is very easy - Just eat under your maintenance and do cardio, hell you don't even need to do cardio to burn fat, you can do it all through diet. I recommend you do some type of cardio though for your heart.
Gaining muscle - Eat over your maintenance by anywhere from 200-500 calories, while lifting 3-4x a week and you will gain muscle, unless you have super low testosterone levels.
Losing fat and gaining muscle - Lift while you lose weight. If you feel like you don't have enough muscle when you lose the fat, then eat at a low surplus like 200-300 calories over maintenance for a few months. Then cut fat again, it's really that simple.(just posted this last part in another thread)
You honestly don't even need to eat super clean foods like rice and chicken every meal to lose weight, Although it will probably make you feel better. I don't want people to be turned off from fitness and being healthy because of this stuff.
inb4 people with PHD's in broscience post
Of course this is true in general, but you don't take into account all the other factors. Cost, time, willpower, health, the mind etc. If it really were that easy don't you think we'd all be thin. And all the other threads you talk of are there for help, support and advice.
Well actually he sort of does take those into account, and his language is quite specific. Simple is not the same as easy.
Lots of people disagreeing are just wrong on the terms. "Eating at a deficit" is not the same as "thinking you are eating at a deficit".
I call your estimate of deficit according to calculations the "nominal deficit", and it has to be understood that it is always more or less than your ACTUAL deficit, because you never burn the same cals day to day.
But if you measure your body mass, and compare the numbers over time, it's simple and possible to figure out the difference between you nominal and actual deficits. It's simple accounting.
I can't agree that the OP's tone is helpful. But then again, I understand how frustrating it is to read threads like the one about weight gain from smoking cessation, where the person dismisses perfectly good advice with an excuse, and continues to look for special explanations or tricks that won't involve eating less food. And since the pattern is so common, it's really, really unlikely that this one time, the person is right. It's possible, but it's also "possible" for a ball to stay suspended instead of obeying the laws of gravity. Al that has to change is the laws of nature.0 -
^^^
Smoking - You will not gain weight if you quit smoking unless you binge eat after quitting, that's all there is to it.
Actually heavy smokers have a higher BMR to deal with all the toxins they inhale. Additionally, smoking acts as a appetite suppressant, without it people eat more than they normally would because they lost that habitual suppressant. And their taste buds are actually improved because they are no longer dulled by the smoke, food tastes better.
I am not pro smoking, it's harmful and ruins lives, just saying that there are additional battles for those with addictions (Food, tobacco, whatever). Be aware before you make sweeping declarations.
I am all for not over complicating things, but lets use some science too. It's better than misinformation.
Misinformation
Smokes may have a higher BMR and yes smoking is an appetite suppressent but if they quit then still eating under their TDEE (which will change after they stop if the BMR is true) they will not gain weight....again simple maths.
As for the rest with other "issues' doesn't change the science facts eat in a calorie deficet = weight loss0 -
I just thought it was a little funny that chicken and rice were listed as the really healthy foods. I thought for sure maybe something like wheatgrass and quinoa would be listed.0
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I see threads all the time on here with some crazy nonsense like "eat 6 small meals a day" or here's a funny one "gaining weight after I quit smoking" the list goes on though.
Smoking - You will not gain weight if you quit smoking unless you binge eat after quitting, that's all there is to it.
Losing weight is very easy - Just eat under your maintenance and do cardio, hell you don't even need to do cardio to burn fat, you can do it all through diet. I recommend you do some type of cardio though for your heart.
Gaining muscle - Eat over your maintenance by anywhere from 200-500 calories, while lifting 3-4x a week and you will gain muscle, unless you have super low testosterone levels.
Losing fat and gaining muscle - Lift while you lose weight. If you feel like you don't have enough muscle when you lose the fat, then eat at a low surplus like 200-300 calories over maintenance for a few months. Then cut fat again, it's really that simple.(just posted this last part in another thread)
You honestly don't even need to eat super clean foods like rice and chicken every meal to lose weight, Although it will probably make you feel better. I don't want people to be turned off from fitness and being healthy because of this stuff.
inb4 people with PHD's in broscience post
Of course this is true in general, but you don't take into account all the other factors. Cost, time, willpower, health, the mind etc. If it really were that easy don't you think we'd all be thin. And all the other threads you talk of are there for help, support and advice.
Well said. This is exactly what I take issue with.
This diet & fitness evangelism can be tough to tolerate when, as you said, there are additional factors to consider, not just simple math. Don't know why it hasn't occurred to OP & others who agree with him but it's not as if those who oppose them aren't speaking from their experience.
If you're lucky enough to be healthy, & simple diet & exercise works for you, FANTASTIC. However, to those of us who disagree because that has NOT been our experience, it's a load of hooey. It's off-putting to say the least.
To say that folks are overcomplicating things is to dismiss the idea that people who struggle aren't doing what they need to, in order to meet their goals.:huh: Comes across judgey, arrogant.0 -
Isn't science a wonderful thing, if science says you can do something you can, regardless.
If only science could stop me wanting certain foods, could stop me feeling ravenous during "that time of the month", could do my exercise for me if I'm injured or can't get out, or go to the shops for me etc.0 -
Picking up on my previous post, it seems to me there are only 2 reasons to post on the forums (3 if you want to count trolling. I choose not to):
1.You are looking for some answers/help from others.
2. You are looking to provide answers/help to others.
Given this, my question to the OP is, why are you posting in the weight loss and weight gain forums at all if you already know all the answers, and you are annoyed with the (wrong in your opinion) questions and answers posted by others?0 -
Picking up on my previous post, it seems to me there are only 2 reasons to post on the forums (3 if you want to count trolling. I choose not to):
1.You are looking for some answers/help from others.
2. You are looking to provide answers/help to others.
Given this, my question to the OP is, why are you posting in the weight loss and weight gain forums at all if you already know all the answers, and you are annoyed with the (wrong in your opinion) questions and answers posted by others?
Good question, I'd also like to know how the OP survives on only milk going by his diary.0 -
Picking up on my previous post, it seems to me there are only 2 reasons to post on the forums (3 if you want to count trolling. I choose not to):
1.You are looking for some answers/help from others.
2. You are looking to provide answers/help to others.
Given this, my question to the OP is, why are you posting in the weight loss and weight gain forums at all if you already know all the answers, and you are annoyed with the (wrong in your opinion) questions and answers posted by others?
He's trying to play bad cop, because so many people come on here for the THIRD reason:
3. To make themselves feel better about their own lack of progress by identifying with other people also not making progress.
That kind of "support", I believe, is really about how one feels when handing it out. Unfortunately it's only helping to perpetuate frustration in the long run, so it does the recipient no favors.
Yes, OP needs a better approach, and I'm as guilty as he is, but on the other hand, HIS heart is actually in the right place.0 -
If I learned one thing in this thread,
it's that I hope I die before I grow so old that I turn senile and delusional with my head stuck up so far up my own buttocks
If my (rapidly approaching mid forties) other half could do this, he wouldn't need me - but only if he taught the dog to cook0 -
Lots of people disagreeing are just wrong on the terms. "Eating at a deficit" is not the same as "thinking you are eating at a deficit".
this is so true. Calories in v calories out is true for everyone, because no-one's body breaks the laws of physics.
By calories in, I mean calories absorbed by the body via the digestive system (or intravenously, e.g. a drip)
By calories out, I mean calories utilised by the cells to produce energy to stay alive and move around.
if more calories are going in than out, the excess will be stored as fat (or in some cases as glycogen) - if more calories are going out than coming in, the body will draw on fat reserves (or sometimes glycogen reserves) to make up the energy shortfall. Glycogen is short term energy storage, fat is long term energy storage. Your body can also make up the shortfall from lean tissue e.g. muscle.... to ensure the shortfall is made up of mostly fat (some utilisation of glycogen is inevitable, but not harmful to you) then you need a small, sensible deficit sustained for a long period of time.
Problems like PCOS or thyroid don't mean that someone's body suddenly breaks the laws of physics... conditions like this mean that the cells use fewer calories than they should be, so even though they may be eating what may, for another person of their height, weight and lean body mass, be eating less than they burn... for them at that amount it's still more than they burn off, because their cells are not using (burning) the energy from the food they eat as much as they should be. So the calories in versus calories out equation is still correct.......... just that their medical condition skews the calories out bit so it's much harder for them to create a deficit and start losing fat.
Also, if this is the problem, it's necessary to get it corrected, as lowering the calories to the point where weight loss becomes possible may result in making the metabolic problem worse, not better, and the total number of calories eaten may not be enough to get all the nutrition needed.
For PCOS, moderately low carb (but not zero or very low carb) plus exercise is what seems to help. So the "eat more burn more" advice is actually good, but you should add in "be more careful about carbs, both the amount and type eaten"
For thyroid issues, you need to get thyroid medication from the doctor... the problem with your cells utilising too little energy creates problems in how your body works, i.e. the symptoms of hypothyroidism, and this needs to be corrected for good health, before you even start worrying about losing weight. Once the thyroid problem is corrected, weight loss should be relatively easy, as your cells will be burning a lot more energy, so creating a deficit will be much easier.
Also, regarding the OP, what he says is correct.... I really don't think he was directing his message at people with hormonal issues that affect the metabolism.... it seems it was more aimed at people who are following a whole bunch of rules like don't eat after xpm, thou shalt eat 6 small meals a day, only eat carbs on the 2nd tuesday of each month, only eat off plates with a diameter of less than six and three eights inches, or other silly rules like that, which are totally not necessary. For weight loss the only thing necessary is a calorie deficit. For health, eating all the nutrients your body needs and exercising is necessary. Everything else is just flotsam that just confuses people and makes things much more difficult than they need to be. So really, the message of stripping everything back to the basics does need to be out there.0 -
Haven't read the whole thread, just the first page, but speaking for someone with a "hormonal challenge" the theory of weight loss commonly presented for the average person is no different to the theory I used to achieve the loss you see in dat dere sig, down there.
The fact I had to monitor my intake religiously and not rely on churn-out calorie allowances makes no difference. I found my maintenance calories and I ate to a sensible deficit. Voila, weight loss.
I still have struggles with food choices, that will probably never go away, but 9 times out of 10 I eat foods as whole and natural as possible and it's due to habit. Habit creates willpower. You have to just grin and bear it until it becomes second nature and sometimes to do that you have to hit rock-bottom, and physically hurt for it to result in change.
The point is that the theory remains the same, no matter who you are. The complications come from pre-designating excuses.
"I can't achieve x, because y, but I'll do my best and get as close as I can."
Insert "hormone imbalance", "thyroid issue", "food intolerance" etc. etc. in place of 'y'...
Might it be harder for you? it might. But stop lamenting about what your weight/body/relationship with food would be "if..."
Because it isn't, and you have to frickin' deal with it. Your problems with weight loss are less physiological and more psychological. Physically you are as capable of adjusting your weight and body as someone in "perfect health".
Monitor your food, monitor your weight, figure out if the calories you're getting are making you lose, gain or maintain, and then adjust accordingly. It really is that simple.0 -
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The tone and approach of this thread indicates it was created by a child.
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That is what scorches my tortillas. It's not what is said, because it is true ( even though there was no use for posting something that is common knowledge in this community for the 4227th time), but what bothered me was the tone.
We are not all idiots that must be told over and over again, but many of us have a hard time to manage this new " lifestyle " after often decades of nutritional self abuse. But to recognize that one needs a certain amount of maturity, which is missing in much what is posted.
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if the tone of the thread bothered you then you are being way too sensitive...0 -
First I didn't want to comment but really.. Losing weight is easy.. Well I am so happy its easy for you but you are you and not everyone else.. Why are you here??? YOU Obviously need some kind of help with your health and fitness or just here to make people feel like **** cause its not easy.. If it bothers you don't read the posts, that's easy!!
Please read the rest of the thread. OP and everyone else weren't saying that losing weight is easy, in fact many of us said it was difficult. But the concept and process of losing weight are easy.It's your mind that makes it difficult.
DING DING DING!!!!! YES!!!! THANK YOU! Whew... I should've said that a few minutes ago... see how complicated we make things? Exactly my point.
Mind over Matter. Yes.
Let me get this straight, people who disagree with the simplicity and arrogance of OP are the ones who are wrong?
Yep. That's backpedaling. Sorry, you're not going to convince me by bombarding the board with ridiculous immature digs. :huh: Seriously, don't care a whole lot. :laugh:
What is this backpedaling you keep talking about because I'm completely lost. OP and everyone that agrees with him have been saying the exact same thing throughout this thread and using our knowledge of fitness and nutrition to prove our points, while some people like you keep posting ignorant comments about OP's age and "backpedaling". I was so wrong when I thought that adults would be mature and actually think about the information presented to them.0 -
It's true that weight loss really is not complicated. Everybody knows that all you have to do to successfully lose weight is sip the tears of a baby unicorn every other Tuesday precisely at daybreak. Duh...
ehhh? you are saying calorie deficit is equal to unicorn tears?
attempted sarcasm failed, evacuate thread...0 -
Since you guys seem really knowledgable and this calorie deficit thing is interesting...Will a lemon water detox cleanse help get my metabolism jump started to a calorie deficit? Are there too many carbs in the lemon?
yes, but you have to do it will standing on your head ...and drink cauliflower protein shake at 6pm every night..0 -
I see threads all the time on here with some crazy nonsense like "eat 6 small meals a day" or here's a funny one "gaining weight after I quit smoking" the list goes on though.
Smoking - You will not gain weight if you quit smoking unless you binge eat after quitting, that's all there is to it.
Losing weight is very easy - Just eat under your maintenance and do cardio, hell you don't even need to do cardio to burn fat, you can do it all through diet. I recommend you do some type of cardio though for your heart.
Gaining muscle - Eat over your maintenance by anywhere from 200-500 calories, while lifting 3-4x a week and you will gain muscle, unless you have super low testosterone levels.
Losing fat and gaining muscle - Lift while you lose weight. If you feel like you don't have enough muscle when you lose the fat, then eat at a low surplus like 200-300 calories over maintenance for a few months. Then cut fat again, it's really that simple.(just posted this last part in another thread)
You honestly don't even need to eat super clean foods like rice and chicken every meal to lose weight, Although it will probably make you feel better. I don't want people to be turned off from fitness and being healthy because of this stuff.
inb4 people with PHD's in broscience post
Of course this is true in general, but you don't take into account all the other factors. Cost, time, willpower, health, the mind etc. If it really were that easy don't you think we'd all be thin. And all the other threads you talk of are there for help, support and advice.
Well said. This is exactly what I take issue with.
This diet & fitness evangelism can be tough to tolerate when, as you said, there are additional factors to consider, not just simple math. Don't know why it hasn't occurred to OP & others who agree with him but it's not as if those who oppose them aren't speaking from their experience.
If you're lucky enough to be healthy, & simple diet & exercise works for you, FANTASTIC. However, to those of us who disagree because that has NOT been our experience, it's a load of hooey. It's off-putting to say the least.
To say that folks are overcomplicating things is to dismiss the idea that people who struggle aren't doing what they need to, in order to meet their goals.:huh: Comes across judgey, arrogant.
Also to say that the people in this thread that are healthy are like that because they are "lucky" to be healthy is a completely childish thought. I guarantee that they have all put in more work than you ever have. Yes there are people with hormonal issues and other medical problems that make it more difficult for them to lose weight. for the 100th time, THIS THREAD IS NOT ABOUT THEM. They are a small percentage of the population, but at least in America a large percent of the population is overweight, and many of them feel like they can't do it because they have some special issue when they don't. I feel like OP meant for this thread to be a wake up call for them.0 -
I see threads all the time on here with some crazy nonsense like "eat 6 small meals a day" or here's a funny one "gaining weight after I quit smoking" the list goes on though.
Smoking - You will not gain weight if you quit smoking unless you binge eat after quitting, that's all there is to it.
Losing weight is very easy - Just eat under your maintenance and do cardio, hell you don't even need to do cardio to burn fat, you can do it all through diet. I recommend you do some type of cardio though for your heart.
Gaining muscle - Eat over your maintenance by anywhere from 200-500 calories, while lifting 3-4x a week and you will gain muscle, unless you have super low testosterone levels.
Losing fat and gaining muscle - Lift while you lose weight. If you feel like you don't have enough muscle when you lose the fat, then eat at a low surplus like 200-300 calories over maintenance for a few months. Then cut fat again, it's really that simple.(just posted this last part in another thread)
You honestly don't even need to eat super clean foods like rice and chicken every meal to lose weight, Although it will probably make you feel better. I don't want people to be turned off from fitness and being healthy because of this stuff.
inb4 people with PHD's in broscience post
Of course this is true in general, but you don't take into account all the other factors. Cost, time, willpower, health, the mind etc. If it really were that easy don't you think we'd all be thin. And all the other threads you talk of are there for help, support and advice.
I did not know when creating a thread that you have take every medical consideration into consideration before posting said thread ...I think the thread was directed at healthy people with no medial condition who keep looking for short cuts...0 -
EVERYONE STOP FIIIIIIIGHTIIIING!!!! THINK OF THE KITTEHS!!!!0
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Welcome to the internet. There are also cats.
That made me laugh out loud. Thanks!
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Lol look at that, as soon as someone brings up a real point they all leave0
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