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"Unrealistic" body goals

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  • IronIsMyTherapyIronIsMyTherapy Member Posts: 475 Member Member Posts: 475 Member
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    The point was to create discussion on what is considered unrealistic, spurred by seeing a few people call things unrealistic that are extremely realistic in a general sense, not to cover every eventuality and circumstance.

    Mostly what I've seen people call unrealistic are different from the things you mentioned. I haven't noticed any posts telling guys they can't get to be below 10% BF, although I'm sure all kinds of posts happen from time to time, so am not saying you are wrong. Like Novus, I feel like I can't have an opinion on what happened there without the context. Similarly, whether a woman (20s or no) can get a flat belly depends on her build and other specifics. I wouldn't discourage someone, but if someone were below the min BMI and insisting she still needed to lose because she did not have a flat stomach, I wouldn't encourage her to keep losing. Usually people link the "so you want a nice stomach" thread, or did in the past, and it has advice about how to recomp: https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1161603/so-you-want-a-nice-stomach

    And that's all fair enough. And I'm not saying that I had any more context than the people I thought were being unnecessarily negative. Again, it was more a philosophical look at when and why people slap a "unrealistic" sticker on other people's goals. Some are deserving, others are (in my opinion) people saying that because they themselves dont have the time/dedication/ability to accomplish it.


    Please provide links to places where people have projected their own limitations on others so we can agree with you on how bad that is.

    We are not having a philosophical discussion. You are commenting on some posts and how you interpret them. You may be interpreting them correctly but without seeing them I can't tell.

    What would you have done 10 years ago if someone said your goal was unrealistic? Would you have given up? Or would you have used that adversity as additional motivation to prove them wrong? If a goal shrivels and dies under the first sign of trouble was it ever really a goal or just a daydream?

    I've already said I'm not going to call out individuals so if that's not good enough, not sure what to tell you.

    If I thought the person telling me so was more knowledgeable or experienced than me, it would have had a negative effect. Maybe once I realized it wasn't true, it would have had the opposite effect.

    This is not the old west. This board is meant to be for adult aged posters only. If someone gives bad advice then it should be handled with disagrees or direct comments. I have yet to use the disagree function and prefer to comment directly when I feel strongly about it.

    This is more passive aggressive going behind someone's back. Doesn't that seem more wrong to you?

    Common Internet Saying:

    LINK OR IT NEVER HAPPENED

    So someone on the internet might have been able to shake you from a goal you spent 10 years in the process of accomplishing? I am not buying that either.

    BTW, there would have been nothing wrong if you just wanted to brag about your accomplishment. You didn't need to create a debate. Just post a success story. Many have done so to inspire others.

    This is not me bragging and my point is not to take issue with these people, it's to have a conversation about that kind of behavior. You're pretty determined to misunderstand though so have a nice day.
  • IronIsMyTherapyIronIsMyTherapy Member Posts: 475 Member Member Posts: 475 Member
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    The point was to create discussion on what is considered unrealistic, spurred by seeing a few people call things unrealistic that are extremely realistic in a general sense, not to cover every eventuality and circumstance.

    Mostly what I've seen people call unrealistic are different from the things you mentioned. I haven't noticed any posts telling guys they can't get to be below 10% BF, although I'm sure all kinds of posts happen from time to time, so am not saying you are wrong. Like Novus, I feel like I can't have an opinion on what happened there without the context. Similarly, whether a woman (20s or no) can get a flat belly depends on her build and other specifics. I wouldn't discourage someone, but if someone were below the min BMI and insisting she still needed to lose because she did not have a flat stomach, I wouldn't encourage her to keep losing. Usually people link the "so you want a nice stomach" thread, or did in the past, and it has advice about how to recomp: https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1161603/so-you-want-a-nice-stomach

    And that's all fair enough. And I'm not saying that I had any more context than the people I thought were being unnecessarily negative. Again, it was more a philosophical look at when and why people slap a "unrealistic" sticker on other people's goals. Some are deserving, others are (in my opinion) people saying that because they themselves dont have the time/dedication/ability to accomplish it.


    Please provide links to places where people have projected their own limitations on others so we can agree with you on how bad that is.

    We are not having a philosophical discussion. You are commenting on some posts and how you interpret them. You may be interpreting them correctly but without seeing them I can't tell.

    What would you have done 10 years ago if someone said your goal was unrealistic? Would you have given up? Or would you have used that adversity as additional motivation to prove them wrong? If a goal shrivels and dies under the first sign of trouble was it ever really a goal or just a daydream?

    I've already said I'm not going to call out individuals so if that's not good enough, not sure what to tell you.

    If I thought the person telling me so was more knowledgeable or experienced than me, it would have had a negative effect. Maybe once I realized it wasn't true, it would have had the opposite effect.

    This is not the old west. This board is meant to be for adult aged posters only. If someone gives bad advice then it should be handled with disagrees or direct comments. I have yet to use the disagree function and prefer to comment directly when I feel strongly about it.

    This is more passive aggressive going behind someone's back. Doesn't that seem more wrong to you?

    Common Internet Saying:

    LINK OR IT NEVER HAPPENED

    So someone on the internet might have been able to shake you from a goal you spent 10 years in the process of accomplishing? I am not buying that either.

    BTW, there would have been nothing wrong if you just wanted to brag about your accomplishment. You didn't need to create a debate. Just post a success story. Many have done so to inspire others.

    https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10812557/looking-for-motivation#latest
  • snowflake954snowflake954 Member Posts: 6,375 Member Member Posts: 6,375 Member
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    The point was to create discussion on what is considered unrealistic, spurred by seeing a few people call things unrealistic that are extremely realistic in a general sense, not to cover every eventuality and circumstance.

    Mostly what I've seen people call unrealistic are different from the things you mentioned. I haven't noticed any posts telling guys they can't get to be below 10% BF, although I'm sure all kinds of posts happen from time to time, so am not saying you are wrong. Like Novus, I feel like I can't have an opinion on what happened there without the context. Similarly, whether a woman (20s or no) can get a flat belly depends on her build and other specifics. I wouldn't discourage someone, but if someone were below the min BMI and insisting she still needed to lose because she did not have a flat stomach, I wouldn't encourage her to keep losing. Usually people link the "so you want a nice stomach" thread, or did in the past, and it has advice about how to recomp: https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1161603/so-you-want-a-nice-stomach

    And that's all fair enough. And I'm not saying that I had any more context than the people I thought were being unnecessarily negative. Again, it was more a philosophical look at when and why people slap a "unrealistic" sticker on other people's goals. Some are deserving, others are (in my opinion) people saying that because they themselves dont have the time/dedication/ability to accomplish it.


    Please provide links to places where people have projected their own limitations on others so we can agree with you on how bad that is.

    We are not having a philosophical discussion. You are commenting on some posts and how you interpret them. You may be interpreting them correctly but without seeing them I can't tell.

    What would you have done 10 years ago if someone said your goal was unrealistic? Would you have given up? Or would you have used that adversity as additional motivation to prove them wrong? If a goal shrivels and dies under the first sign of trouble was it ever really a goal or just a daydream?

    I've already said I'm not going to call out individuals so if that's not good enough, not sure what to tell you.

    If I thought the person telling me so was more knowledgeable or experienced than me, it would have had a negative effect. Maybe once I realized it wasn't true, it would have had the opposite effect.

    This is not the old west. This board is meant to be for adult aged posters only. If someone gives bad advice then it should be handled with disagrees or direct comments. I have yet to use the disagree function and prefer to comment directly when I feel strongly about it.

    This is more passive aggressive going behind someone's back. Doesn't that seem more wrong to you?

    Common Internet Saying:

    LINK OR IT NEVER HAPPENED

    So someone on the internet might have been able to shake you from a goal you spent 10 years in the process of accomplishing? I am not buying that either.

    BTW, there would have been nothing wrong if you just wanted to brag about your accomplishment. You didn't need to create a debate. Just post a success story. Many have done so to inspire others.

    I agree entirely. Tired of hearing about "some posters", but no links. Keeps dancing away by saying we have to believe him---I don't.
  • NovusDiesNovusDies Member, Premium Posts: 8,815 Member Member, Premium Posts: 8,815 Member
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    The point was to create discussion on what is considered unrealistic, spurred by seeing a few people call things unrealistic that are extremely realistic in a general sense, not to cover every eventuality and circumstance.

    Mostly what I've seen people call unrealistic are different from the things you mentioned. I haven't noticed any posts telling guys they can't get to be below 10% BF, although I'm sure all kinds of posts happen from time to time, so am not saying you are wrong. Like Novus, I feel like I can't have an opinion on what happened there without the context. Similarly, whether a woman (20s or no) can get a flat belly depends on her build and other specifics. I wouldn't discourage someone, but if someone were below the min BMI and insisting she still needed to lose because she did not have a flat stomach, I wouldn't encourage her to keep losing. Usually people link the "so you want a nice stomach" thread, or did in the past, and it has advice about how to recomp: https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1161603/so-you-want-a-nice-stomach

    And that's all fair enough. And I'm not saying that I had any more context than the people I thought were being unnecessarily negative. Again, it was more a philosophical look at when and why people slap a "unrealistic" sticker on other people's goals. Some are deserving, others are (in my opinion) people saying that because they themselves dont have the time/dedication/ability to accomplish it.


    Please provide links to places where people have projected their own limitations on others so we can agree with you on how bad that is.

    We are not having a philosophical discussion. You are commenting on some posts and how you interpret them. You may be interpreting them correctly but without seeing them I can't tell.

    What would you have done 10 years ago if someone said your goal was unrealistic? Would you have given up? Or would you have used that adversity as additional motivation to prove them wrong? If a goal shrivels and dies under the first sign of trouble was it ever really a goal or just a daydream?

    I've already said I'm not going to call out individuals so if that's not good enough, not sure what to tell you.

    If I thought the person telling me so was more knowledgeable or experienced than me, it would have had a negative effect. Maybe once I realized it wasn't true, it would have had the opposite effect.

    This is not the old west. This board is meant to be for adult aged posters only. If someone gives bad advice then it should be handled with disagrees or direct comments. I have yet to use the disagree function and prefer to comment directly when I feel strongly about it.

    This is more passive aggressive going behind someone's back. Doesn't that seem more wrong to you?

    Common Internet Saying:

    LINK OR IT NEVER HAPPENED

    So someone on the internet might have been able to shake you from a goal you spent 10 years in the process of accomplishing? I am not buying that either.

    BTW, there would have been nothing wrong if you just wanted to brag about your accomplishment. You didn't need to create a debate. Just post a success story. Many have done so to inspire others.

    This is not me bragging and my point is not to take issue with these people, it's to have a conversation about that kind of behavior. You're pretty determined to misunderstand though so have a nice day.

    So let's sum this up.

    I am at a store and I hear someone say something inappropriate.

    I go to the next store and start instructing people there about how it is wrong to have said whatever was said at the first store. They have NO idea who or what I am talking about. They do not know if they need to adjust their behavior because they do not know if any of them were at the first store or involved in the conversation or have ever had a similar conversation.

    I do not think I am misunderstanding anything. If you want to have a real conversation then context is needed otherwise this is pointless.

    Was this just a boredom thread or do you actually feel strongly about this subject? If so, step up.

    If I was part of the original potentially bad advice I would welcome correction. That is how growth happens. That is how wisdom works.



  • IronIsMyTherapyIronIsMyTherapy Member Posts: 475 Member Member Posts: 475 Member
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    The point was to create discussion on what is considered unrealistic, spurred by seeing a few people call things unrealistic that are extremely realistic in a general sense, not to cover every eventuality and circumstance.

    Mostly what I've seen people call unrealistic are different from the things you mentioned. I haven't noticed any posts telling guys they can't get to be below 10% BF, although I'm sure all kinds of posts happen from time to time, so am not saying you are wrong. Like Novus, I feel like I can't have an opinion on what happened there without the context. Similarly, whether a woman (20s or no) can get a flat belly depends on her build and other specifics. I wouldn't discourage someone, but if someone were below the min BMI and insisting she still needed to lose because she did not have a flat stomach, I wouldn't encourage her to keep losing. Usually people link the "so you want a nice stomach" thread, or did in the past, and it has advice about how to recomp: https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1161603/so-you-want-a-nice-stomach

    And that's all fair enough. And I'm not saying that I had any more context than the people I thought were being unnecessarily negative. Again, it was more a philosophical look at when and why people slap a "unrealistic" sticker on other people's goals. Some are deserving, others are (in my opinion) people saying that because they themselves dont have the time/dedication/ability to accomplish it.


    Please provide links to places where people have projected their own limitations on others so we can agree with you on how bad that is.

    We are not having a philosophical discussion. You are commenting on some posts and how you interpret them. You may be interpreting them correctly but without seeing them I can't tell.

    What would you have done 10 years ago if someone said your goal was unrealistic? Would you have given up? Or would you have used that adversity as additional motivation to prove them wrong? If a goal shrivels and dies under the first sign of trouble was it ever really a goal or just a daydream?

    I've already said I'm not going to call out individuals so if that's not good enough, not sure what to tell you.

    If I thought the person telling me so was more knowledgeable or experienced than me, it would have had a negative effect. Maybe once I realized it wasn't true, it would have had the opposite effect.

    This is not the old west. This board is meant to be for adult aged posters only. If someone gives bad advice then it should be handled with disagrees or direct comments. I have yet to use the disagree function and prefer to comment directly when I feel strongly about it.

    This is more passive aggressive going behind someone's back. Doesn't that seem more wrong to you?

    Common Internet Saying:

    LINK OR IT NEVER HAPPENED

    So someone on the internet might have been able to shake you from a goal you spent 10 years in the process of accomplishing? I am not buying that either.

    BTW, there would have been nothing wrong if you just wanted to brag about your accomplishment. You didn't need to create a debate. Just post a success story. Many have done so to inspire others.

    I agree entirely. Tired of hearing about "some posters", but no links. Keeps dancing away by saying we have to believe him---I don't.

    https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10812557/looking-for-motivation#latest
  • IronIsMyTherapyIronIsMyTherapy Member Posts: 475 Member Member Posts: 475 Member
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    The point was to create discussion on what is considered unrealistic, spurred by seeing a few people call things unrealistic that are extremely realistic in a general sense, not to cover every eventuality and circumstance.

    Mostly what I've seen people call unrealistic are different from the things you mentioned. I haven't noticed any posts telling guys they can't get to be below 10% BF, although I'm sure all kinds of posts happen from time to time, so am not saying you are wrong. Like Novus, I feel like I can't have an opinion on what happened there without the context. Similarly, whether a woman (20s or no) can get a flat belly depends on her build and other specifics. I wouldn't discourage someone, but if someone were below the min BMI and insisting she still needed to lose because she did not have a flat stomach, I wouldn't encourage her to keep losing. Usually people link the "so you want a nice stomach" thread, or did in the past, and it has advice about how to recomp: https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1161603/so-you-want-a-nice-stomach

    And that's all fair enough. And I'm not saying that I had any more context than the people I thought were being unnecessarily negative. Again, it was more a philosophical look at when and why people slap a "unrealistic" sticker on other people's goals. Some are deserving, others are (in my opinion) people saying that because they themselves dont have the time/dedication/ability to accomplish it.


    Please provide links to places where people have projected their own limitations on others so we can agree with you on how bad that is.

    We are not having a philosophical discussion. You are commenting on some posts and how you interpret them. You may be interpreting them correctly but without seeing them I can't tell.

    What would you have done 10 years ago if someone said your goal was unrealistic? Would you have given up? Or would you have used that adversity as additional motivation to prove them wrong? If a goal shrivels and dies under the first sign of trouble was it ever really a goal or just a daydream?

    I've already said I'm not going to call out individuals so if that's not good enough, not sure what to tell you.

    If I thought the person telling me so was more knowledgeable or experienced than me, it would have had a negative effect. Maybe once I realized it wasn't true, it would have had the opposite effect.

    This is not the old west. This board is meant to be for adult aged posters only. If someone gives bad advice then it should be handled with disagrees or direct comments. I have yet to use the disagree function and prefer to comment directly when I feel strongly about it.

    This is more passive aggressive going behind someone's back. Doesn't that seem more wrong to you?

    Common Internet Saying:

    LINK OR IT NEVER HAPPENED

    So someone on the internet might have been able to shake you from a goal you spent 10 years in the process of accomplishing? I am not buying that either.

    BTW, there would have been nothing wrong if you just wanted to brag about your accomplishment. You didn't need to create a debate. Just post a success story. Many have done so to inspire others.

    This is not me bragging and my point is not to take issue with these people, it's to have a conversation about that kind of behavior. You're pretty determined to misunderstand though so have a nice day.

    So let's sum this up.

    I am at a store and I hear someone say something inappropriate.

    I go to the next store and start instructing people there about how it is wrong to have said whatever was said at the first store. They have NO idea who or what I am talking about. They do not know if they need to adjust their behavior because they do not know if any of them were at the first store or involved in the conversation or have ever had a similar conversation.

    I do not think I am misunderstanding anything. If you want to have a real conversation then context is needed otherwise this is pointless.

    Was this just a boredom thread or do you actually feel strongly about this subject? If so, step up.

    If I was part of the original potentially bad advice I would welcome correction. That is how growth happens. That is how wisdom works.



    https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10812557/looking-for-motivation#latest
  • IronIsMyTherapyIronIsMyTherapy Member Posts: 475 Member Member Posts: 475 Member
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    The point was to create discussion on what is considered unrealistic, spurred by seeing a few people call things unrealistic that are extremely realistic in a general sense, not to cover every eventuality and circumstance.

    Mostly what I've seen people call unrealistic are different from the things you mentioned. I haven't noticed any posts telling guys they can't get to be below 10% BF, although I'm sure all kinds of posts happen from time to time, so am not saying you are wrong. Like Novus, I feel like I can't have an opinion on what happened there without the context. Similarly, whether a woman (20s or no) can get a flat belly depends on her build and other specifics. I wouldn't discourage someone, but if someone were below the min BMI and insisting she still needed to lose because she did not have a flat stomach, I wouldn't encourage her to keep losing. Usually people link the "so you want a nice stomach" thread, or did in the past, and it has advice about how to recomp: https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1161603/so-you-want-a-nice-stomach

    And that's all fair enough. And I'm not saying that I had any more context than the people I thought were being unnecessarily negative. Again, it was more a philosophical look at when and why people slap a "unrealistic" sticker on other people's goals. Some are deserving, others are (in my opinion) people saying that because they themselves dont have the time/dedication/ability to accomplish it.


    Please provide links to places where people have projected their own limitations on others so we can agree with you on how bad that is.

    We are not having a philosophical discussion. You are commenting on some posts and how you interpret them. You may be interpreting them correctly but without seeing them I can't tell.

    What would you have done 10 years ago if someone said your goal was unrealistic? Would you have given up? Or would you have used that adversity as additional motivation to prove them wrong? If a goal shrivels and dies under the first sign of trouble was it ever really a goal or just a daydream?

    I've already said I'm not going to call out individuals so if that's not good enough, not sure what to tell you.

    If I thought the person telling me so was more knowledgeable or experienced than me, it would have had a negative effect. Maybe once I realized it wasn't true, it would have had the opposite effect.

    This is not the old west. This board is meant to be for adult aged posters only. If someone gives bad advice then it should be handled with disagrees or direct comments. I have yet to use the disagree function and prefer to comment directly when I feel strongly about it.

    This is more passive aggressive going behind someone's back. Doesn't that seem more wrong to you?

    Common Internet Saying:

    LINK OR IT NEVER HAPPENED

    So someone on the internet might have been able to shake you from a goal you spent 10 years in the process of accomplishing? I am not buying that either.

    BTW, there would have been nothing wrong if you just wanted to brag about your accomplishment. You didn't need to create a debate. Just post a success story. Many have done so to inspire others.

    This is not me bragging and my point is not to take issue with these people, it's to have a conversation about that kind of behavior. You're pretty determined to misunderstand though so have a nice day.

    So let's sum this up.

    I am at a store and I hear someone say something inappropriate.

    I go to the next store and start instructing people there about how it is wrong to have said whatever was said at the first store. They have NO idea who or what I am talking about. They do not know if they need to adjust their behavior because they do not know if any of them were at the first store or involved in the conversation or have ever had a similar conversation.

    I do not think I am misunderstanding anything. If you want to have a real conversation then context is needed otherwise this is pointless.

    Was this just a boredom thread or do you actually feel strongly about this subject? If so, step up.

    If I was part of the original potentially bad advice I would welcome correction. That is how growth happens. That is how wisdom works.



    https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10812557/looking-for-motivation#latest

    Could I ask why you did not step up and encourage this young man?

    I should've but his request was for friend adds and I don't really have a desire to accumulate friend connections on here. The direction some of the responses went bugged me so I started this because I wanted to see what others thought. You're not addressing the context now that I've provided it though...

    Edit: I replied. Thanks for calling me out on that.
    edited October 2020
  • IronIsMyTherapyIronIsMyTherapy Member Posts: 475 Member Member Posts: 475 Member
    J72FIT wrote: »
    It's hard to blame someone for having unrealistic body goals. The whole diet and fitness culture is filled with liars. Let's take 200 pics and post the best we have, not the other 199 that looked like crap. Let's brag about our sub 10% body fat (if it really is, most lie about their body fat as if it matters) and leave out that we are most likely on gear. Let's bask in the glory of our flat stomach but leave out that we had a tummy tuck but just tell people how we work out like crazy.

    Here is an example. You look at a magazine of a celebrity who got in killer shape for a movie. Much like a body builder or fitness competitor leading up to a competition so they can peak at the right moment. For them it's the stage, for the actor it's for filming. The magazine tells us what the actor did, of course leaving out the stuff they don't want to admit (steroids etc...). Now your average person reads this, wants to look like this and proceeds to make a lifestyle out of what a celebrity did for say 12 weeks leading up to filming. It's a false narrative from the very beginning...

    I know what you mean, but even if the IG picture is filtered and whatever, they STILL accomplished a physique that was able to be improved slightly via filters/lighting/flexing that resulted in the picture that was posted. Its really no different than women with makeup; they're accentuating what already exists. So, I feel like if you arm yourself with the realization that you're not going to wake up and see that IG picture in the mirror, but with a lot of work you CAN wake up with a physique that can look like it with that filter, it's the same thing. People will post flexed/unflexed pictures and if they were posted separately I feel a lot of people would call the unflexed realistic and the flexed unrealistic when they're in fact the same exact physique. Heck, my PP is about 3 weeks pre comp with a pump and good lighting so it's admittedly optimized, but it's real and therefore realistic. I'm struggling with articulating this, I hope it makes sense!

    I dunno, I'm a fan of dreaming big and when I see others doing that, it kills me to see anyone raining on that. Granted, that's my perspective and others may see what I view as "rain" to be guidance or a reality check.
    edited October 2020
  • IronIsMyTherapyIronIsMyTherapy Member Posts: 475 Member Member Posts: 475 Member
    NovusDies wrote: »
    Other than the sarcastic comment I saw advice warning about the difficulties. I saw people encourage him to see how far he could go.

    I am not a believer in untempered rah rah support. I would rather tell someone that the road will have some tough sections in it than just be a cheerleader. There is something to be said for preparing oneself mentally for the challenges ahead instead of being blindsided by them.

    I am not knowledgeable enough to have advised this young man one way or another. I would also be pretty hesitant to give a total stranger advice that requires a high level of food and exercise discipline. Perhaps I have read too many really tough stories here from people with disorders to risk it.

    There was both and yes, it was my perspective on intent in the responses, which is inherrently ambiguous. Hence this discussion and why I felt linking was largely irrelevent.
  • J72FITJ72FIT Member Posts: 5,760 Member Member Posts: 5,760 Member
    Heck, my PP is about 3 weeks pre comp with a pump and good lighting so it's admittedly optimized, but it's real and therefore realistic. I'm struggling with articulating this, I hope it makes sense!

    Makes perfect sense and I thank you for your transparency. The lie is those that would have you believe they walk around like that all year long. Some can, the genetically gifted but most can't.

    I still do however believe in reaching for the stars because you just might catch the moon...

  • IronIsMyTherapyIronIsMyTherapy Member Posts: 475 Member Member Posts: 475 Member
    J72FIT wrote: »
    Heck, my PP is about 3 weeks pre comp with a pump and good lighting so it's admittedly optimized, but it's real and therefore realistic. I'm struggling with articulating this, I hope it makes sense!

    Makes perfect sense and I thank you for your transparency. The lie is those that would have you believe they walk around like that all year long. Some can, the genetically gifted but most can't.

    I still do however believe in reaching for the stars because you just might catch the moon...

    Another lie I hate is that some supplement you can buy was the key to them looking like that. Exactly, and if you only set a goal of getting off the ground, you'll probably keep putting it off until tomorrow.
  • J72FITJ72FIT Member Posts: 5,760 Member Member Posts: 5,760 Member
    J72FIT wrote: »
    Heck, my PP is about 3 weeks pre comp with a pump and good lighting so it's admittedly optimized, but it's real and therefore realistic. I'm struggling with articulating this, I hope it makes sense!

    Makes perfect sense and I thank you for your transparency. The lie is those that would have you believe they walk around like that all year long. Some can, the genetically gifted but most can't.

    I still do however believe in reaching for the stars because you just might catch the moon...

    Another lie I hate is that some supplement you can buy was the key to them looking like that. Exactly, and if you only set a goal of getting off the ground, you'll probably keep putting it off until tomorrow.

    Oh yeah. Take this pill, or this drink and you'll bla bla bla...
  • lemurcat2lemurcat2 Member Posts: 7,117 Member Member Posts: 7,117 Member
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    The point was to create discussion on what is considered unrealistic, spurred by seeing a few people call things unrealistic that are extremely realistic in a general sense, not to cover every eventuality and circumstance.

    Mostly what I've seen people call unrealistic are different from the things you mentioned. I haven't noticed any posts telling guys they can't get to be below 10% BF, although I'm sure all kinds of posts happen from time to time, so am not saying you are wrong. Like Novus, I feel like I can't have an opinion on what happened there without the context. Similarly, whether a woman (20s or no) can get a flat belly depends on her build and other specifics. I wouldn't discourage someone, but if someone were below the min BMI and insisting she still needed to lose because she did not have a flat stomach, I wouldn't encourage her to keep losing. Usually people link the "so you want a nice stomach" thread, or did in the past, and it has advice about how to recomp: https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1161603/so-you-want-a-nice-stomach

    And that's all fair enough. And I'm not saying that I had any more context than the people I thought were being unnecessarily negative. Again, it was more a philosophical look at when and why people slap a "unrealistic" sticker on other people's goals. Some are deserving, others are (in my opinion) people saying that because they themselves dont have the time/dedication/ability to accomplish it.


    Please provide links to places where people have projected their own limitations on others so we can agree with you on how bad that is.

    We are not having a philosophical discussion. You are commenting on some posts and how you interpret them. You may be interpreting them correctly but without seeing them I can't tell.

    What would you have done 10 years ago if someone said your goal was unrealistic? Would you have given up? Or would you have used that adversity as additional motivation to prove them wrong? If a goal shrivels and dies under the first sign of trouble was it ever really a goal or just a daydream?

    I've already said I'm not going to call out individuals so if that's not good enough, not sure what to tell you.

    If I thought the person telling me so was more knowledgeable or experienced than me, it would have had a negative effect. Maybe once I realized it wasn't true, it would have had the opposite effect.

    This is not the old west. This board is meant to be for adult aged posters only. If someone gives bad advice then it should be handled with disagrees or direct comments. I have yet to use the disagree function and prefer to comment directly when I feel strongly about it.

    This is more passive aggressive going behind someone's back. Doesn't that seem more wrong to you?

    Common Internet Saying:

    LINK OR IT NEVER HAPPENED

    So someone on the internet might have been able to shake you from a goal you spent 10 years in the process of accomplishing? I am not buying that either.

    BTW, there would have been nothing wrong if you just wanted to brag about your accomplishment. You didn't need to create a debate. Just post a success story. Many have done so to inspire others.

    This is not me bragging and my point is not to take issue with these people, it's to have a conversation about that kind of behavior. You're pretty determined to misunderstand though so have a nice day.

    So let's sum this up.

    I am at a store and I hear someone say something inappropriate.

    I go to the next store and start instructing people there about how it is wrong to have said whatever was said at the first store. They have NO idea who or what I am talking about. They do not know if they need to adjust their behavior because they do not know if any of them were at the first store or involved in the conversation or have ever had a similar conversation.

    I do not think I am misunderstanding anything. If you want to have a real conversation then context is needed otherwise this is pointless.

    Was this just a boredom thread or do you actually feel strongly about this subject? If so, step up.

    If I was part of the original potentially bad advice I would welcome correction. That is how growth happens. That is how wisdom works.



    https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10812557/looking-for-motivation#latest

    Could I ask why you did not step up and encourage this young man?

    I should've but his request was for friend adds and I don't really have a desire to accumulate friend connections on here. The direction some of the responses went bugged me so I started this because I wanted to see what others thought. You're not addressing the context now that I've provided it though...

    Edit: I replied. Thanks for calling me out on that.

    I think your contribution to that thread was great. Mostly I saw in the thread a mix of some discouragement at the beginning, but mostly people calling him on the idea that he needs others to give him the motivation and hard truths that what he needs is discipline and a plan and that it may take a while, plus a couple of people who had achieved the goal and found it not worth the effort (or not good for them). I find the discipline-related posts, as well as those from people with experience, even if not positive, to be helpful contributions to the thread.

    If I had the experience to contribute to a thread like that (which I do not), I'd probably have said that it's a great goal, but he doesn't yet know how his body will look at feel at different BF%s, so rather than making sub 9% the one successful result, why not get started and have a plan, but also have some intermediate goals and take stock of how he looks and feels at different %ages. I don't think that would be discouraging. I also would suggest (if there were experienced people on the thread) that if he wants to talk through his plan here, it might be a great way to get feedback on a plan and timetable.
  • IronIsMyTherapyIronIsMyTherapy Member Posts: 475 Member Member Posts: 475 Member
    I did not see anyone tell the poster in that thread that they were being unrealistic (maybe inferred from the victoria secret response, but that's it). Just people being honest about the time, effort and discipline needed to achieve that look and that it's difficult to keep. Looked like most people were saying go for it, just know it's going to be difficult and you will need more than motivation.

    I think if you have achieved something similar and did NOT find the process hard or long and can easily maintain everyday, its good for you to chime in with your experience so that the poster can get a different perspective. I frequently chime in on people who think you have to only eat "healthy" food to look at certain way. I eat a ton of crap food and have a fairly low BF for a female. I always qualify that it may not be the best thing for your long term health, but has nothing to do with weight/how you look.

    There's a comment indicating it's reliant on rare genetics (which I disagree with) which insinuates it's out of his control. Yes, genetics will affect your structure, how much muscle you'll put on and so on, but I believe most genetic limitations can be overcome with regards to getting lean. Anecdotal, but I personally have horrible genetics.
    edited October 2020
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