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What are your unpopular opinions about health / fitness?
Replies
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A calorie might be a calorie in a bomb calorimeter but they're certainly not when it comes to nutrition. I can understand why people bang the calorie-is-a-calorie drum here on MFP because for the sake of counting calories it's all just an estimation and it's not helpful to differentiate between 500 calories of steak versus 500 calories of a sundae. But no one credible in nutrition research thinks a calorie is a calorie - if they did there would be no reason to hold things like protein constant in isocaloric studies. There wouldn't be new findings that nuts having fewer calories than we previously thought.
Foods are different yes but so are calories.5 -
Carlos_421 wrote: »I finally have a place to say this
Not all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
You are confusing calories with food.
The calories in the sundae and the calories in the steak and broccoli would be exactly the same (assuming proportionate amounts of food to provide an equal number of calories) in that the calories from each would provide the same amount of energy (calories are nothing but a measurement of energy) to fuel the body.
Thus, either food choice would have the exact same impact on weight loss/gain/maintenance as they would result in an identical energy balance.
The difference between a sundae and a steak lies not in the calories but in the nutritional profile. A sundae will not have as much fiber or micronutrients as the broccoli and not as much protein as the steak. This has nothing to do with calories and nothing to do with weight loss.
If the calorie count between two diets is equal, the weight loss from both diets will be equal (assuming activity levels remain equal as well).
Saying "all calories are equal" does not mean that all foods are equal or that all foods have similar nutritional profiles or that all foods will leave you equally satiated. It means that 2,000 calories from candy and 2,000 calories from vegetables will have equal impacts on body weight. That is all.
ETA: This reply is not a death threat against you. Simply an explanation for why your statement is incorrect.
I understand calories is the unit of measurement that raises 1 gram of water 1c. How ever I was using the term as used by fitness community and by the whole CICO crowd.
Your longer explanation basically said what I was trying to say. People say eat what ever you want as long as you count that calories it doesn't matter what it is. But really it does matter because the food you are getting the calories from have different nutritional values. So we are on the same page I just didn't go into it as in depth as you did and maybe I should have.
See, that's the thing. The way you were using the term is NOT how "the whole CICO crowd" uses it. They use it in the way that I just explained and you agreed with.7 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak.
Calories is often misused to mean food, but that's not what it means. It's a unit of measurement for energy.
OBVIOUSLY (and it's not an unpopular opinion, everyone agrees), a sundae is different in many ways from a steak or from broccoli. They have different macros, different calories per volume and serving, are not identically satiating (although that differs person to person), have different micros, may trigger a specific person to eat more, may be tasty or not for a person, so on and so on.
NONE of this means, however, that the calories are not equal, as a calorie is just energy, a specific unit thereof.
There's not really such a thing as a "calorie of hot fudge sundae" or a "steak calorie." The steak and the broccoli and the sundae provide your body with a bunch of things, that your body breaks down, including calories. Your body cannot tell that a particular calorie is from a particular food.
I think -- and this may or may not be an unpopular opinion, again -- that most people who claim that not all calories are equal are confusing "calorie" with "food" or using it as a metaphor for food without realizing it's just a metaphor.
I also think that most people who complain that their view that foods are different are unpopular are misreading what other people say, and I am always confused about how they manage to do this after all the many, many explanations. I think it's just that they cannot get their head around the fact that calorie means something other than "unit of a specific food" and indeed, that using calorie to mean food is an imprecise, metaphorical usage and not a particularly helpful one.
You also shouldn't assert something hyperbolic like getting death threats when that's not at all true, it's defamatory and harms discussion. (In the off chance I'm wrong here, you should alert MFP, as someone is mentally screwed up and it has nothing to do with views on nutrition.)
I am aware of what a calorie is. Just saying 100 calories of hot fudge is going to have a different affect on someone from 100 calories of steak. But the CICO crowd says nope its all the same. At least for me it will have a very differn't affect. I didn't realize I was going to have to be so specific. I am sorry I didn't elaborate more.
Also the death threat thing is obviously an exaggeration. I was just saying how passionate about it people can be. Some do get nasty about it. Not to me because I really don't post much but from what I read. As far as this topic goes I hope I am not comping across as overly passionate I really don't care one way or another.
No, they don't. They say that it has the same effect on weight loss. That's all.7 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Carlos_421 wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Carlos_421 wrote: »RAD_Fitness wrote: »HeliumIsNoble wrote: »stormcrow2 wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »
Not literally :P
I guess I don't understand how someone who understands how much energy their body needs and consistently consumes that amount of energy is still a fatty on the inside. I became fat because I disregarded how much energy my body needed. Adjusting that changed the situation. But you're arguing that if I don't meet certain nutritional standards (as determined by you), I might still be considered fat?
sounds like he is making the mythical connection that anyone who says it is OK to eat within your calories and you will still lose weight, is advocating for a diet of 100% oreos, or something...
I want this mythical 100% Oreo diet.
Here's a menu!
14 Oreos (one packet) for breakfast
14 Oreos (one packet) for lunch
14 Oreos (one packet) for dinner
Total: 2226 calories
Nutritional information
Fat: 992.4g
of which saturates: 46.2g
Carbohydrate: 319.2g
of which sugars: 172.2g
Fibre: 12.6g
Protein 21g
Salt: 4.2g
Haha just have to ask, not to say this was ever recommended or ever happened, so both sides are equally an educated guess; but do you think this would result in equal FAT loss if compared to a balanced and more nutrient dense diet with less sugar, more protein and less fat, but with the exact same calorie intake? How about weight loss?
Fat loss, specifically? No, because a diet higher in protein would (assuming a progressive lifting routine) prevent muscle loss, resulting in a greater proportion of weight loss to be from fat.
Weight loss in general? Yes. Weight loss/gain/maintenance is determined solely by energy balance (science).
More/less sugar and more/less fat have no bearing on whether there would be a difference in weight OR fat loss from one diet to another.
This doesn't sound correct. Weight loss is about more than energy balance because weight is comprised of more than just fat and muscle.
My bad, I forgot my disclaimer "excluding water retention, constipation and/or amputations."
No problem. Why bother with all the facts?
To satisfy the pedantic crowd, apparently...6 -
diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
@Rivers2k Did you truly get death threats on this board for expressing that? That's something I'd take very seriously. Deets?
No I was exaggerating. I don't post often I mostly lurk and now I know I have to be so careful of what and how I say things. I was saying the CICO people are very passionate about saying there is no difference in calories so eat what ever you want.
As part of the CICO crowd I can say that there is no difference in calories for weight loss only. For general health, hunger, satiety, energy levels, etc. different foods in different combinations will have different effects. But CICO is only meant to be applied for weight loss. And as part of the CICO crowd, I'm not fond of the suggestion, even in jest, that we're handing out death threats. Posts like that, imo, are why so many people here read the advice they get as hostile, angry, or bullying.
Many times it does come across as bullying. case in point I made a light hearted post about calories and people felt the need to defend the almighty Carb. Trust me when I say I don't really care, my feelings aren't hurt. I am sure you are all really great people and I truly mean that. but if a bunch of people jump on someone with a different opinion then it comes accross as bullying. I am not saying this time it was like that but I do see it on here allot. one of the many reasons I dont post much.
People need to understand what the person is trying to say instead of picking apart every word.9 -
diannethegeek wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
@Rivers2k Did you truly get death threats on this board for expressing that? That's something I'd take very seriously. Deets?
No I was exaggerating. I don't post often I mostly lurk and now I know I have to be so careful of what and how I say things. I was saying the CICO people are very passionate about saying there is no difference in calories so eat what ever you want.
And you were completely taking them out of context.3 -
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AlabasterVerve wrote: »A calorie might be a calorie in a bomb calorimeter but they're certainly not when it comes to nutrition. I can understand why people bang the calorie-is-a-calorie drum here on MFP because for the sake of counting calories it's all just an estimation and it's not helpful to differentiate between 500 calories of steak versus 500 calories of a sundae. But no one credible in nutrition research thinks a calorie is a calorie - if they did there would be no reason to hold things like protein constant in isocaloric studies. There wouldn't be new findings that nuts having fewer calories than we previously thought.
Foods are different yes but so are calories.
Still confusing calories with nutrients, I see...10 -
diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
@Rivers2k Did you truly get death threats on this board for expressing that? That's something I'd take very seriously. Deets?
No I was exaggerating. I don't post often I mostly lurk and now I know I have to be so careful of what and how I say things. I was saying the CICO people are very passionate about saying there is no difference in calories so eat what ever you want.
As part of the CICO crowd I can say that there is no difference in calories for weight loss only. For general health, hunger, satiety, energy levels, etc. different foods in different combinations will have different effects. But CICO is only meant to be applied for weight loss. And as part of the CICO crowd, I'm not fond of the suggestion, even in jest, that we're handing out death threats. Posts like that, imo, are why so many people here read the advice they get as hostile, angry, or bullying.
Many times it does come across as bullying. case in point I made a light hearted post about calories and people felt the need to defend the almighty Carb. Trust me when I say I don't really care, my feelings aren't hurt. I am sure you are all really great people and I truly mean that. but if a bunch of people jump on someone with a different opinion then it comes accross as bullying. I am not saying this time it was like that but I do see it on here allot. one of the many reasons I dont post much.
People need to understand what the person is trying to say instead of picking apart every word.
Pointing out the inaccuracies of your statement is not bullying. Not even close.
And we understand your point. Your point is that CICO proponents claim that nutrition doesn't matter and you can eat all the junk food with no consequences so long as you count the calories.
Your claim is false.13 -
diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
@Rivers2k Did you truly get death threats on this board for expressing that? That's something I'd take very seriously. Deets?
No I was exaggerating. I don't post often I mostly lurk and now I know I have to be so careful of what and how I say things. I was saying the CICO people are very passionate about saying there is no difference in calories so eat what ever you want.
As part of the CICO crowd I can say that there is no difference in calories for weight loss only. For general health, hunger, satiety, energy levels, etc. different foods in different combinations will have different effects. But CICO is only meant to be applied for weight loss. And as part of the CICO crowd, I'm not fond of the suggestion, even in jest, that we're handing out death threats. Posts like that, imo, are why so many people here read the advice they get as hostile, angry, or bullying.
Many times it does come across as bullying. case in point I made a light hearted post about calories and people felt the need to defend the almighty Carb. Trust me when I say I don't really care, my feelings aren't hurt. I am sure you are all really great people and I truly mean that. but if a bunch of people jump on someone with a different opinion then it comes accross as bullying. I am not saying this time it was like that but I do see it on here allot. one of the many reasons I dont post much.
People need to understand what the person is trying to say instead of picking apart every word.
So honesty is bullying now?
C'mon, you are full of hyperbole, aren't' you?
Do you know what actual bullying is?
Here's the thing. If twenty people say the same thing, maybe it's you who are misunderstanding. Is that possible?16 -
Carlos_421 wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
@Rivers2k Did you truly get death threats on this board for expressing that? That's something I'd take very seriously. Deets?
No I was exaggerating. I don't post often I mostly lurk and now I know I have to be so careful of what and how I say things. I was saying the CICO people are very passionate about saying there is no difference in calories so eat what ever you want.
As part of the CICO crowd I can say that there is no difference in calories for weight loss only. For general health, hunger, satiety, energy levels, etc. different foods in different combinations will have different effects. But CICO is only meant to be applied for weight loss. And as part of the CICO crowd, I'm not fond of the suggestion, even in jest, that we're handing out death threats. Posts like that, imo, are why so many people here read the advice they get as hostile, angry, or bullying.
Many times it does come across as bullying. case in point I made a light hearted post about calories and people felt the need to defend the almighty Carb. Trust me when I say I don't really care, my feelings aren't hurt. I am sure you are all really great people and I truly mean that. but if a bunch of people jump on someone with a different opinion then it comes accross as bullying. I am not saying this time it was like that but I do see it on here allot. one of the many reasons I dont post much.
People need to understand what the person is trying to say instead of picking apart every word.
Pointing out the inaccuracies of your statement is not bullying. Not even close.
And we understand your point. Your point is that CICO proponents claim that nutrition doesn't matter and you can eat all the junk food with no consequences so long as you count the calories.
Your claim is false.
YES! exactly what I was saying! It might be false but that is the way it comes across I don't see anyone trying to clarify it. Someone made a post here about breakfast wraps she described some symptoms I have with carbs. I suggested leaving out the wrap and people jumped all over me chanting carbs for energy! I was just making a suggestion. That was one of my last posts.
People need to take the intent of message and not pick apart every word. I even agreed with your first post.
I know the difference between calories and nutrition
I know carbs play apart in fueling your body (and how this went from calories to carbs I don't know)
I am not a low carb person
I just think that people can get out of hand with CICO. I may be wrong that is just what I see. And wow I try to point out the error in what is bolded above heaven help me.8 -
double post
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Carlos_421 wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
@Rivers2k Did you truly get death threats on this board for expressing that? That's something I'd take very seriously. Deets?
No I was exaggerating. I don't post often I mostly lurk and now I know I have to be so careful of what and how I say things. I was saying the CICO people are very passionate about saying there is no difference in calories so eat what ever you want.
As part of the CICO crowd I can say that there is no difference in calories for weight loss only. For general health, hunger, satiety, energy levels, etc. different foods in different combinations will have different effects. But CICO is only meant to be applied for weight loss. And as part of the CICO crowd, I'm not fond of the suggestion, even in jest, that we're handing out death threats. Posts like that, imo, are why so many people here read the advice they get as hostile, angry, or bullying.
Many times it does come across as bullying. case in point I made a light hearted post about calories and people felt the need to defend the almighty Carb. Trust me when I say I don't really care, my feelings aren't hurt. I am sure you are all really great people and I truly mean that. but if a bunch of people jump on someone with a different opinion then it comes accross as bullying. I am not saying this time it was like that but I do see it on here allot. one of the many reasons I dont post much.
People need to understand what the person is trying to say instead of picking apart every word.
Pointing out the inaccuracies of your statement is not bullying. Not even close.
And we understand your point. Your point is that CICO proponents claim that nutrition doesn't matter and you can eat all the junk food with no consequences so long as you count the calories.
Your claim is false.
YES! exactly what I was saying! It might be false but that is the way it comes across I don't see anyone trying to clarify it. Someone made a post here about breakfast wraps she described some symptoms I have with carbs. I suggested leaving out the wrap and people jumped all over me chanting carbs for energy! I was just making a suggestion. That was one of my last posts.
People need to take the intent of message and not pick apart every word. I even agreed with your first post.
I know the difference between calories and nutrition
I know carbs play apart in fueling your body
I am not a low carb person
I just think that people can get out of hand with CICO. I may be wrong that is just what I see. And wow I try to point out the error in what is bolded above heaven help me.
Maybe don't take things so seriously?
Or maybe communicate more clearly and with less absolute phrases? I didn't see your post about the wrap, but judging by what you've said in this thread...
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diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
@Rivers2k Did you truly get death threats on this board for expressing that? That's something I'd take very seriously. Deets?
No I was exaggerating. I don't post often I mostly lurk and now I know I have to be so careful of what and how I say things. I was saying the CICO people are very passionate about saying there is no difference in calories so eat what ever you want.
As part of the CICO crowd I can say that there is no difference in calories for weight loss only. For general health, hunger, satiety, energy levels, etc. different foods in different combinations will have different effects. But CICO is only meant to be applied for weight loss. And as part of the CICO crowd, I'm not fond of the suggestion, even in jest, that we're handing out death threats. Posts like that, imo, are why so many people here read the advice they get as hostile, angry, or bullying.
Many times it does come across as bullying. case in point I made a light hearted post about calories and people felt the need to defend the almighty Carb. Trust me when I say I don't really care, my feelings aren't hurt. I am sure you are all really great people and I truly mean that. but if a bunch of people jump on someone with a different opinion then it comes accross as bullying. I am not saying this time it was like that but I do see it on here allot. one of the many reasons I dont post much.
People need to understand what the person is trying to say instead of picking apart every word.
You accused us all of making death threats. That doesn't come across as light hearted.8 -
diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
@Rivers2k Did you truly get death threats on this board for expressing that? That's something I'd take very seriously. Deets?
No I was exaggerating. I don't post often I mostly lurk and now I know I have to be so careful of what and how I say things. I was saying the CICO people are very passionate about saying there is no difference in calories so eat what ever you want.
As part of the CICO crowd I can say that there is no difference in calories for weight loss only. For general health, hunger, satiety, energy levels, etc. different foods in different combinations will have different effects. But CICO is only meant to be applied for weight loss. And as part of the CICO crowd, I'm not fond of the suggestion, even in jest, that we're handing out death threats. Posts like that, imo, are why so many people here read the advice they get as hostile, angry, or bullying.
Many times it does come across as bullying. case in point I made a light hearted post about calories and people felt the need to defend the almighty Carb. Trust me when I say I don't really care, my feelings aren't hurt. I am sure you are all really great people and I truly mean that. but if a bunch of people jump on someone with a different opinion then it comes accross as bullying. I am not saying this time it was like that but I do see it on here allot. one of the many reasons I dont post much.
People need to understand what the person is trying to say instead of picking apart every word.
You accused us all of making death threats. That doesn't come across as light hearted.
No I didn't your putting words in my mouth. And that is the one thing extract from all of this?9 -
.snafu1
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All of you have a nice a day. I need to get back to work spending to much time on this.2
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That ALL forms of calorie counting, weight loss dieting, food restriction that is not based on DOCTOR DIAGNOSED allergies or orders to cut a food from your diet, exercise intended for "body sculpting", and the like are forms of eating/body dysmorphic disorders that cause anywhere from mild to severe mental and social consequences for those engaging in them; and can (although do not always) lead to severe physical effects in those practicing them. I believe most of the people who use MFP have unrecognized eating or body dysmorphic disorders, mostly orthorexia.20
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Need2Exerc1se wrote: »snickerscharlie wrote: »dancefit2015 wrote: »I don't believe humans were necessarily meant to eat grain nor dairy... Maybe some have adapted but I know many people and myself feel terrible after eating any gluten or dairy.
Apples give me a stomachache. Therefore people aren't necessarily meant to eat apples?
Well, what evidence can you provide that we were meant to eat apples?
Adam and Eve.
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diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
@Rivers2k Did you truly get death threats on this board for expressing that? That's something I'd take very seriously. Deets?
No I was exaggerating. I don't post often I mostly lurk and now I know I have to be so careful of what and how I say things. I was saying the CICO people are very passionate about saying there is no difference in calories so eat what ever you want.
As part of the CICO crowd I can say that there is no difference in calories for weight loss only. For general health, hunger, satiety, energy levels, etc. different foods in different combinations will have different effects. But CICO is only meant to be applied for weight loss. And as part of the CICO crowd, I'm not fond of the suggestion, even in jest, that we're handing out death threats. Posts like that, imo, are why so many people here read the advice they get as hostile, angry, or bullying.
Many times it does come across as bullying. case in point I made a light hearted post about calories and people felt the need to defend the almighty Carb. Trust me when I say I don't really care, my feelings aren't hurt. I am sure you are all really great people and I truly mean that. but if a bunch of people jump on someone with a different opinion then it comes accross as bullying. I am not saying this time it was like that but I do see it on here allot. one of the many reasons I dont post much.
People need to understand what the person is trying to say instead of picking apart every word.
You accused us all of making death threats. That doesn't come across as light hearted.
No I didn't your putting words in my mouth. And that is the one thing extract from all of this?I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
Nope, those were your words.5 -
seekingdaintiness wrote: »That ALL forms of calorie counting, weight loss dieting, food restriction that is not based on DOCTOR DIAGNOSED allergies or orders to cut a food from your diet, exercise intended for "body sculpting", and the like are forms of eating/body dysmorphic disorders that cause anywhere from mild to severe mental and social consequences for those engaging in them; and can (although do not always) lead to severe physical effects in those practicing them. I believe most of the people who use MFP have unrecognized eating or body dysmorphic disorders, mostly orthorexia.
So there's no reason to desire to be a healthy weight? IYHO?5 -
I think there is some kind of miscommunication. It's very helpful if you look at the context where people say eat what you want and you will lose weight. In the vast majority of cases it is said to someone who is is in distress because they failed to follow a certain arbitrary rule. Things like "I ate a cookie, will I regain all of my weight?" or something like "this food I really love has too many carbs and I feel bad that I can't eat it", "I'm eating clean but not losing weight", or "is bread really bad for me?".... You get the idea.
I'm willing to bet that most instances where people said all foods were equal for weight loss tackled is particular type of food anxiety. Getting a person to relax is very helpful to their dieting. If they're constantly stressing about food they are less likely to stick to it. This kind of statement puts their mind at ease, that they can have some of the foods they love in appropriate portions without sabotaging their weight loss process. Even then, a note about nutrition is also appended, which I find silly because most adults don't need to be told to "eat their vegetables". It's stated anyway just to set their mind at ease that a sugar in their tea will not magically remove all of their nutrients and if the rest of their diet is adequately nutritionally diverse they're going to be fine health wise.
It's not a generalizing statement, it's a factual statement most often used in specific contexts.7 -
stanmann571 wrote: »seekingdaintiness wrote: »That ALL forms of calorie counting, weight loss dieting, food restriction that is not based on DOCTOR DIAGNOSED allergies or orders to cut a food from your diet, exercise intended for "body sculpting", and the like are forms of eating/body dysmorphic disorders that cause anywhere from mild to severe mental and social consequences for those engaging in them; and can (although do not always) lead to severe physical effects in those practicing them. I believe most of the people who use MFP have unrecognized eating or body dysmorphic disorders, mostly orthorexia.
So there's no reason to desire to be a healthy weight? IYHO?
The desire to reach a "healthy weight" at all costs has become an absolute obsession in society. I see people daily on here who believe they are behaving in a healthy manner talking about weighing every bite of food they eat on a digital scale, even taking the scale to restaurants, cutting entire food groups from their diet because they believe the food is "bad", deciding all of the modern food processing developments that have been made in society are across the board evil and all food made by that manner should be avoided, backstabbing all their friends and relatives for "being unfit". I see regular threads about people wanting to dump a partner because they lost weight and feel they are better than their partner now and people encourage them. No one seems to recognize this is sick behavior.16 -
Carlos_421 wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »diannethegeek wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
@Rivers2k Did you truly get death threats on this board for expressing that? That's something I'd take very seriously. Deets?
No I was exaggerating. I don't post often I mostly lurk and now I know I have to be so careful of what and how I say things. I was saying the CICO people are very passionate about saying there is no difference in calories so eat what ever you want.
As part of the CICO crowd I can say that there is no difference in calories for weight loss only. For general health, hunger, satiety, energy levels, etc. different foods in different combinations will have different effects. But CICO is only meant to be applied for weight loss. And as part of the CICO crowd, I'm not fond of the suggestion, even in jest, that we're handing out death threats. Posts like that, imo, are why so many people here read the advice they get as hostile, angry, or bullying.
Many times it does come across as bullying. case in point I made a light hearted post about calories and people felt the need to defend the almighty Carb. Trust me when I say I don't really care, my feelings aren't hurt. I am sure you are all really great people and I truly mean that. but if a bunch of people jump on someone with a different opinion then it comes accross as bullying. I am not saying this time it was like that but I do see it on here allot. one of the many reasons I dont post much.
People need to understand what the person is trying to say instead of picking apart every word.
Pointing out the inaccuracies of your statement is not bullying. Not even close.
And we understand your point. Your point is that CICO proponents claim that nutrition doesn't matter and you can eat all the junk food with no consequences so long as you count the calories.
Your claim is false.
YES! exactly what I was saying! It might be false but that is the way it comes across I don't see anyone trying to clarify it. Someone made a post here about breakfast wraps she described some symptoms I have with carbs. I suggested leaving out the wrap and people jumped all over me chanting carbs for energy! I was just making a suggestion. That was one of my last posts.
People need to take the intent of message and not pick apart every word. I even agreed with your first post.
I know the difference between calories and nutrition
I know carbs play apart in fueling your body (and how this went from calories to carbs I don't know)
I am not a low carb person
I just think that people can get out of hand with CICO. I may be wrong that is just what I see. And wow I try to point out the error in what is bolded above heaven help me.
It gets clarified repeatedly in every thread where the subject comes up...4 -
seekingdaintiness wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »seekingdaintiness wrote: »That ALL forms of calorie counting, weight loss dieting, food restriction that is not based on DOCTOR DIAGNOSED allergies or orders to cut a food from your diet, exercise intended for "body sculpting", and the like are forms of eating/body dysmorphic disorders that cause anywhere from mild to severe mental and social consequences for those engaging in them; and can (although do not always) lead to severe physical effects in those practicing them. I believe most of the people who use MFP have unrecognized eating or body dysmorphic disorders, mostly orthorexia.
So there's no reason to desire to be a healthy weight? IYHO?
The desire to reach a "healthy weight" at all costs has become an absolute obsession in society. I see people daily on here who believe they are behaving in a healthy manner talking about weighing every bite of food they eat on a digital scale, even taking the scale to restaurants, cutting entire food groups from their diet because they believe the food is "bad", deciding all of the modern food processing developments that have been made in society are across the board evil and all food made by that manner should be avoided, backstabbing all their friends and relatives for "being unfit". I see regular threads about people wanting to dump a partner because they lost weight and feel they are better than their partner now and people encourage them. No one seems to recognize this is sick behavior.
So being 5'4 and 300 lbs isn't a bad thing?13 -
Tacklewasher wrote: »People say eat what ever you want as long as you count that calories it doesn't matter what it is.
This is a huge strawman. Link to a thread where this is what is said. Not your interpretation of what was said, but the actual text of a post where someone is advocating this.
And a calorie is a calorie regardless of what food is being eaten. Calories and nutrition are 2 different concepts and it does no good to try to make them about the same thing.
I can't believe we're back here again when literally the page before went over what utter nonsense it is that calorie counting isn't further qualified within the context of overall diet.3 -
Also just like not all calories are the same not all Carbs are the same (simple vs complex). I don't see athletes carbo loading with hotfudge they tend to use complex carbs.
But at the end of the day is my unpopular opinion nobody else has to like it.
False. If I "carbo" loaded with complex carbs before a hard ride I'd run out of stomach space and feel like garbage before the end. Simple carbs are critical for rapid digestion and metabolism for use by your muscles during a hard effort.
Feel free to hold unpopular opinions. Stop projecting them unto others like you know what's best for them.12 -
stevencloser wrote: »Carlos_421 wrote: »quiksylver296 wrote: »Carlos_421 wrote: »I finally have a place to say thisNot all calories are equal. Calories from a hot fudge brownie sundae is going to affect your body differently than equivalent amount of calories from broccoli and a nice piece of steak. one is going to satiate and make you energized the other will leave you hungry and lethargic. The whole world knows this (even if they don't practice it) but you get death threats if you express this on MFP. So that is my "unpopular health/fitness opinion" wow that feels good. LOL
You are confusing calories with food.
The calories in the sundae and the calories in the steak and broccoli would be exactly the same (assuming proportionate amounts of food to provide an equal number of calories) in that the calories from each would provide the same amount of energy (calories are nothing but a measurement of energy) to fuel the body.
Thus, either food choice would have the exact same impact on weight loss/gain/maintenance as they would result in an identical energy balance.
The difference between a sundae and a steak lies not in the calories but in the nutritional profile. A sundae will not have as much fiber or micronutrients as the broccoli and not as much protein as the steak. This has nothing to do with calories and nothing to do with weight loss.
If the calorie count between two diets is equal, the weight loss from both diets will be equal (assuming activity levels remain equal as well).
Saying "all calories are equal" does not mean that all foods are equal or that all foods have similar nutritional profiles or that all foods will leave you equally satiated. It means that 2,000 calories from candy and 2,000 calories from vegetables will have equal impacts on body weight. That is all.
ETA: This reply is not a death threat against you. Simply an explanation for why your statement is incorrect.
I was thinking, when @Rivers2k first posted, was that the sundae would actually fuel my heavy lifting better than the steak. Carbs for energy!
And I was thinking that the sundae would leave me feeling full longer than the steak. Meat and veggies alone don't leave me feeling full for very long (important to note since most of the "not all calories are equal" people tend to forget that "not all people's experiences with satiety are equal").
That is very true, not all people work the same. Carbs give me to much of a rush in to short of a time leaving me feeling depleted. Be careful lumping people because I never once said everyone has the same experience. I could say the same about the CICO crowd and they are very vocal about it.
Also just like not all calories are the same not all Carbs are the same (simple vs complex). I don't see athletes carbo loading with hotfudge they tend to use complex carbs.
But at the end of the day is my unpopular opinion nobody else has to like it.
I have yet to see an endurance cyclist pulling out 10 pounds of celery from their backpack instead of a pack of gummy bears or those glucose gels.I'm Haribo Gummy Bears and Tootsie Pops kinda guy. Best fuel out there.Carlos_421 wrote: »
First off, I don't at all agree with any of the rest of what @Rivers2k is saying. However, you all aren't really talking about carb-loading, are you?
My understanding is that carb-loading specifically refers to attempting to maximize liver glycogen in preparation for the event. That'd be the meals you eat prior, not the Gus or jelly beans you eat during. And for those meals, most of the recommendations I see are complex carbs (pasta, bread, potatoes, rice, etc).
Though to be honest, the reason I wouldn't eat a hot fudge sundae the day before a race has nothing to do with the type of carb anyway. Dairy (and a lot of other foods) are dodgy for my intestinal system during a long, hard run. The day before would not be enough time to ensure it wouldn't cause gastrointestinal distress.0 -
stevencloser wrote: »
I have yet to see an endurance cyclist pulling out 10 pounds of celery from their backpack instead of a pack of gummy bears or those glucose gels.
Thank you for this.
Bahahahhaa2 -
seekingdaintiness wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »seekingdaintiness wrote: »That ALL forms of calorie counting, weight loss dieting, food restriction that is not based on DOCTOR DIAGNOSED allergies or orders to cut a food from your diet, exercise intended for "body sculpting", and the like are forms of eating/body dysmorphic disorders that cause anywhere from mild to severe mental and social consequences for those engaging in them; and can (although do not always) lead to severe physical effects in those practicing them. I believe most of the people who use MFP have unrecognized eating or body dysmorphic disorders, mostly orthorexia.
So there's no reason to desire to be a healthy weight? IYHO?
The desire to reach a "healthy weight" at all costs has become an absolute obsession in society. I see people daily on here who believe they are behaving in a healthy manner talking about weighing every bite of food they eat on a digital scale, even taking the scale to restaurants, cutting entire food groups from their diet because they believe the food is "bad", deciding all of the modern food processing developments that have been made in society are across the board evil and all food made by that manner should be avoided, backstabbing all their friends and relatives for "being unfit". I see regular threads about people wanting to dump a partner because they lost weight and feel they are better than their partner now and people encourage them. No one seems to recognize this is sick behavior.
I'm going to say these behaviours are largely of the minority. This is the weirdest post I've seen for a while directed at those taking control of their physical health. So I weigh the food I make myself. And? Hardly disordered. I just like the accuracy and sometimes it actually allows me to eat more. Imagine!
And people that post about their blatantly unhealthy behaviour do get called out here.
Seems the issue is more about your own issues than anyone elses.14
This discussion has been closed.
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