Coronavirus prep

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  • ythannah
    ythannah Posts: 4,365 Member
    lokihen wrote: »
    Sad news here. I got to know a lot of the nursing home residents while working at the hospital. They locked down early and hard, keeping the virus out for months. Then a young worker went to a July 4th party where stupid was happening, including sharing vape pens. Now there are active cases in other workers and the residents.

    I'm appalled that a health care worker could be so utterly thoughtless. :(

    Hoping everyone makes it through okay.
  • debtay123
    debtay123 Posts: 1,327 Member
    yes- what a mess
    I mean- where is our feelings for our fellowman!
  • TonyB0588
    TonyB0588 Posts: 9,520 Member
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    janejellyroll wrote: »
    T1DCarnivoreRunner wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    hipari wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    hipari wrote: »
    baconslave wrote: »
    rheddmobile wrote: »
    hipari wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    TonyB0588 wrote: »
    hipari wrote: »
    TonyB0588 wrote: »

    Which practices? The ones that many parents taught their children while growing up? Wash your hands before eating. Cover your nose when you sneeze. Wash your hands after using the toilet. Cover your mouth when you cough. Wash your hands after touching money. Don't lie in bed with clothes you wore outdoors. By the way, did I mention wash your hands?

    Why are normal civilized people no longer doing these things??

    After returning to the office for 4 days this week, I’m pretty confident half my coworkers have spent their summer doing drugs or something else to wipe off all brain cells that carry learned human decency and guidelines. It has consistently always been the rule, first as general human decency and then as official HR policy, that you wash your hands with water and soap when you come in to any space from outdoors. We have hand sanitizer bottles all around the office, but at this point everyone should know water and soap are better and hand sanitizer should be used as complementary add-in or when proper hand-washing isn’t available. Some of the discussions I’ve had this week include:

    ”Please wash your hands first, you just came in from outside”
    ”But I only touched a few doorknobs”
    ”Still.” (Me in my head: yeah, you went outside, probably touched your face while smoking, and then used the doors and elevators in this 11-floor office building that has quite a lot of people)

    ”Please wash your hands with water and soap”
    ”But I’m using hand sanitizer”
    ”That’s great as an addition, but doesn’t replace soap”
    ”Huh, since when?”
    ”It never has...”

    After referencing these discussions the CEO gave me permission to start giving personal office bans at my discretion for those who can’t or won’t follow the hygiene rules. At this point being allowed to leave home and come to work at the office is a privilege and those who don’t follow the rules to make it safe for others won’t be allowed to use it. If people want to ignore hygiene and safety rules, they can do it in the privacy of their own home where they won’t risk their colleagues. They just have to deal with focusing on work with their kids jumping around etc., but life is full of choices and everyone is welcome to continue working from home if hand-washing at the office is too much trouble.

    Wow!! I wouldn't want to be the one sending workers back home, but I guess you need to take action if people are so dumb.

    In our workplace there are handwashing signs everywhere, and extra taps and sinks have been installed. It is also mentioned at every huddle or staff meeting. It just simply is the new normal.

    Masks, distancing, and temperature checks are also part of the daily routine. Everything is being done to protect everyone else and keep the workplace safe.

    IMO, to be honest, if grown *kitten* adults need to be told to wash their hands the train has already left the station and no amount of HR signs and announcements will do any good.

    Yep. The thing that bothers me most about those discussions is that the reaction isn’t ”oh crap I spaced out, will wash immediately” but instead some sort of complaining about not wanting to do it for reason X.

    The rules are in place for a reason, and as head of HR I will be enforcing them. It’s not fair to let the few idiots run wild at the office and risk those who want to come in, focus on their work without at-home distractions, and follow the rules to keep themselves and everyone around the as safe as possible. The office is not a playground for misbehaving children, it’s a workplace where people should be able to be safe and focus on their work like adults.

    From HR viewpoint, people get used to signs so fast they are only useful for a day or two, after that they’re really just virtue signaling that we care and have plans in place, and they show the right message for the few guests that do come in. I’m hoping I don’t have to start actually banning people, hopefully having 1-on-1 discussions about rules being enforced and bans being issued for further non-compliance is enough of a threat.

    (Yeah, I probably shouldn’t call my colleagues idiots or misbehaving children, but I’m human and they’re risking my health too.)
    Goodness, I don’t envy you having to enforce those rules, but good on you for trying.

    As I’ve mentioned before, I have been aware of other people’s germ-spreading behaviors for a while now, due to periodically being on immune-suppressing medication. It’s not a surprise to me that most adults don’t wash their hands, won’t cover their mouths during a cough or sneeze, and are downright hostile if someone suggests that they should avoid others while symptomatic. I work from home and don’t go out much, and caught four separate colds last winter due to others. I can probably pinpoint the exact person who gave me each illness, since they typically came on two to four days after being near the child with fever and a cough lying down on a restaurant booth during an adult drinking party because “I couldn’t leave him with a sitter when he’s sick,” or the lady with a rattling chest cough not covering her mouth and bumping me from behind in line at the grocery. Or the young fireman staring vacantly into space coughing constantly not covering his mouth in the packet pickup tent at a race. In each case I removed myself from the vicinity as soon as I could and it wasn’t good enough. I don’t have servants, it’s not possible for me to avoid all other people, so when a substantial number of them are determined to spread illness, I get sick.

    If this epidemic has any silver lining, I hope it is that it becomes much less socially acceptable to kill other people with your germs. Because doing this kills people, and not just when covid is around. Fragile elderly and immune compromised people exist at all times, and your fever and lingering cough may be someone else’s death sentence.

    One of my kids was sick recently and a doctor had to get involved. We had a conversation and I told her, that even though I am a very conscientious person, I really used to feel that getting sick was inevitable with my little germ-nuggets. And that I didn't think twice on going around when I had sick kids at home. Complete thoughtlessness! :rage: But COVID has brought home that though I'm not currently sick, I could be a carrier and spread it to others outside the family. So I will definitely be more careful in the future when illness is in my family to not be a jerkface carelessly spreading it everywhere.

    One of my friends has a prematurely born daughter with lugn issues so regular flus were extremely dangerous to her as a baby. They couldn’t take her anywhere with public transportation because of the infection risk and every invitation to their home included a ”stay the *kitten* away if you have any symptoms whatsoever” reminder. I admit that pre-covid I thought smaller symptoms like a runny nose or a little cough weren’t a reason to stay home and isolate if I felt otherwise fine and was able to go on about my regular day, and things like her case were the exception. In the future I will definitely stay home with smaller symptoms, and I hope this pandemic permanently changes the current (pre-covid) culture where showing up was more important than knowing when to not show up.

    Now that many workplaces have tried working from home and seen it can be done, I hope in the future ”I feel like I might be getting sick” is a good enough reason to stay home and work from there without employers questioning it. Unrelated, I also hope handshaking will become a thing of the past.

    Saw something recently in the Wall Street Journal that WFH isn't as good as advertised.

    Also, i disagree and hope handshakes, fists bumps etc come back when this is behind us. People are social animals and an appropriate touch is part of that socialization.

    This is the article discussing the perhaps WFH isn't as good on a long term basis. Fine for when people are sick IMO.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/companies-start-to-think-remote-work-isnt-so-great-after-all-11595603397

    It's popping up behind a paywall now but I was able to read it a few days ago.

    Headline:
    Companies Start to Think Remote Work Isn’t So Great After All
    Projects take longer. Collaboration is harder. And training new workers is a struggle. ‘This is not going to be sustainable.’

    Re: training new workers. We had 4 new employees start during lockdown, and 4 started less than a month before lockdown started. All 4 who started during lockdown and completely from home said it was surprisingly easy and they felt actually more connected to their coworkers since Teams communication and video meetings require people to be more intentional and present than at the office where you can more easily ignore your surroundings. Apparently it’s also helpful to NOT meet everyone on your first day, because you can actually get to know colleagues one by one, and even in large meetings everyone automatically has their name displayed so there’s no awkwardness about being expected to remember the names of all 30 people you were introduced to on your first day.

    2 of the workers who started just before lockdown are entry level. They struggled more because they need more hands-on guidance and training about the actual work than more experienced professionals, and they’re also less confident to speak up and ask in Teams if they’re struggling or need more advice.

    Interesting. Where I work (multi-billion $, multi-national corporation) standard practice is people have the camera off/piece of Post-It Note over the camera so all that is seen in a Teams meeting is the material being presented and pictures of the participants from our corporate directory or blank space. A person in a Teams meeting could be doing Lord knows what and nobody on the meeting would know. Meeting "live" in a conference room it's pretty easy to see who is really engaged IMO.

    We do Zoom meetings, but everyone is visible. It would be considered weird/not acceptable to cover the camera. We don't do lots of meetings in general, however, and lots of team stuff is handled by phone (and pretty easy to tell who is participating, as everyone is supposed to be contributing to the discussion).

    We also have a new lawyer who started just before the stay at home order, who had been a judicial clerk before. It's been pretty impossible to give him the kind of feedback/training he would have received in person in the office.

    Nobody uses video on our Skype meetings. In fact, when at the office, my computer is on the docking station and closed. I couldn't display video in that position anyway.

    We use Zoom, I would say about 50% of the people use their video and 50% don't. There's been no direction or feedback for those of us who aren't using it (I usually don't have it on). Our meetings typically involve lots of presentations of spreadsheets, software details, or blueprints so that's usually what people are focused on.

    I'd been working remotely since 2011. We didn't have formal presentations per se, but we always had a screenshare of the computer of the person driving the meeting, and never used video of participants.

    We usually have video on, and if a participant has theirs off, there would usually be a gentle reminder. But I've seen it all - untidy houses which really shouldn't have been displayed for everyone to see, and those who knew their surroundings weren't suitable and explained why they couldn't switch video on. I always sit with my back to a blank wall for Zoom meetings.
  • mockchoc
    mockchoc Posts: 6,573 Member
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    Drove through the local university campus early evening. Lines at the bars, beer pong in yards groups walking around not a mask to be seen unless it was around someone's neck. Place will be shut down before classes even start.

    I'm not sure what to think about that. Aren't people that go to university supposed to be smarter than the average person? Guess not then.
  • mockchoc
    mockchoc Posts: 6,573 Member
    JustSomeEm wrote: »
    TonyB0588 wrote: »
    jenilla1 wrote: »
    Anybody else here notice their house/yard gradually getting more unkempt during this pandemic? It's the opposite of what I would expect. I'm already a stay at home person. I figured with extra time from curtailed outside activities, I'd get more done at home - DIYs, deep cleaning, major yardwork. That's not what's happening, though. I'm actually doing less than before. Letting stuff go. Just recently started realizing it. Better formulate a plan to fix this before it becomes habit!

    Is it just me, or is this a thing?

    Yes, same here. I never got the extra yardwork done as expected. Work from home became more like work a lot more and have less time for myself.

    Yeah, totally get this. I had to set hard limits for myself with times/behaviors with regard to work and home life when I was doing most of my working from home. And even now with those hard limits, on work from home days extra work time has a tendency to creep into my 'home time'.
    mockchoc wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    Drove through the local university campus early evening. Lines at the bars, beer pong in yards groups walking around not a mask to be seen unless it was around someone's neck. Place will be shut down before classes even start.

    I'm not sure what to think about that. Aren't people that go to university supposed to be smarter than the average person? Guess not then.

    As someone currently in school (belatedly) to get a Master's degree, I'm going to go with "no" here. Take that for what you will. :p

    I'm sure in this case you are wrong ;) Good luck with it, you'll be fine I'm sure.
  • mockchoc
    mockchoc Posts: 6,573 Member
    AnnPT77 wrote: »
    mockchoc wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    Drove through the local university campus early evening. Lines at the bars, beer pong in yards groups walking around not a mask to be seen unless it was around someone's neck. Place will be shut down before classes even start.

    I'm not sure what to think about that. Aren't people that go to university supposed to be smarter than the average person? Guess not then.

    Don't confuse IQ with judgement (and I'm not necessarily saying they have higher IQs, either). People of undergrad age do not yet have fully-developed judgement and self-control brain circuitry yet, and it shows, on average. I worked at a big (40,000+ student) university for around 30 years: That's a lot of opportunity to observe this age group. They are not grown-ups yet, not really.

    Some of us (me included), if we honestly think back to our own age 18-22 age period, may acknowledge that we did some pretty dumb stuff, too (not everyone did, I'm sure - this is not an accusation).

    I'd also point out that any university has a big bundle of students. As with any other group, the ones you see en masse out in public doing Stupid Stuff are not necessarily the whole population, perhaps not even a majority of it, numerous though they may be. The more careful, prudent undergraduates are in their dorm rooms, watching Netflix or something, not out playing maskless beer pong.

    Yes I guess that is correct.
  • moonangel12
    moonangel12 Posts: 971 Member
    AnnPT77 wrote: »
    mockchoc wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    Drove through the local university campus early evening. Lines at the bars, beer pong in yards groups walking around not a mask to be seen unless it was around someone's neck. Place will be shut down before classes even start.

    I'm not sure what to think about that. Aren't people that go to university supposed to be smarter than the average person? Guess not then.

    Don't confuse IQ with judgement (and I'm not necessarily saying they have higher IQs, either). People of undergrad age do not yet have fully-developed judgement and self-control brain circuitry yet, and it shows, on average. I worked at a big (40,000+ student) university for around 30 years: That's a lot of opportunity to observe this age group. They are not grown-ups yet, not really.

    Some of us (me included), if we honestly think back to our own age 18-22 age period, may acknowledge that we did some pretty dumb stuff, too (not everyone did, I'm sure - this is not an accusation).

    I'd also point out that any university has a big bundle of students. As with any other group, the ones you see en masse out in public doing Stupid Stuff are not necessarily the whole population, perhaps not even a majority of it, numerous though they may be. The more careful, prudent undergraduates are in their dorm rooms, watching Netflix or something, not out playing maskless beer pong.
    I have always said book sense and common sense don’t always go hand in hand... and I agree that it likely was just a snippet, unfortunately that small sampling of people can spoil the whole bunch in terms of spreading through the campus. I would have been the one holed up in my room, but I had suite mates that would have been the ones out on the town, living their life, frat parties galore.
  • mockchoc
    mockchoc Posts: 6,573 Member
    moonangel12 wrote: »
    AnnPT77 wrote: »
    mockchoc wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    Drove through the local university campus early evening. Lines at the bars, beer pong in yards groups walking around not a mask to be seen unless it was around someone's neck. Place will be shut down before classes even start.

    I'm not sure what to think about that. Aren't people that go to university supposed to be smarter than the average person? Guess not then.

    Don't confuse IQ with judgement (and I'm not necessarily saying they have higher IQs, either). People of undergrad age do not yet have fully-developed judgement and self-control brain circuitry yet, and it shows, on average. I worked at a big (40,000+ student) university for around 30 years: That's a lot of opportunity to observe this age group. They are not grown-ups yet, not really.

    Some of us (me included), if we honestly think back to our own age 18-22 age period, may acknowledge that we did some pretty dumb stuff, too (not everyone did, I'm sure - this is not an accusation).

    I'd also point out that any university has a big bundle of students. As with any other group, the ones you see en masse out in public doing Stupid Stuff are not necessarily the whole population, perhaps not even a majority of it, numerous though they may be. The more careful, prudent undergraduates are in their dorm rooms, watching Netflix or something, not out playing maskless beer pong.
    I have always said book sense and common sense don’t always go hand in hand... and I agree that it likely was just a snippet, unfortunately that small sampling of people can spoil the whole bunch in terms of spreading through the campus. I would have been the one holed up in my room, but I had suite mates that would have been the ones out on the town, living their life, frat parties galore.

    I would have been one out on the town too but pretty sure I wouldn't have in a pandemic. I would have just had a party for two with husband :) Boyfriend back then. We could get into enough trouble alone lol.
  • debtay123
    debtay123 Posts: 1,327 Member
    Well let's hope and pray for the best- i STILL wish- it was online for ALL schools in USA(pre-k though college) for a while longer- until we get a better handle on things- but yeah a FEW always mess it up for the majority of folks
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,876 Member
    jenilla1 wrote: »
    Anybody else here notice their house/yard gradually getting more unkempt during this pandemic? It's the opposite of what I would expect. I'm already a stay at home person. I figured with extra time from curtailed outside activities, I'd get more done at home - DIYs, deep cleaning, major yardwork. That's not what's happening, though. I'm actually doing less than before. Letting stuff go. Just recently started realizing it. Better formulate a plan to fix this before it becomes habit!

    Is it just me, or is this a thing?

    My yard is pretty much the same as always...it's very low maintenance to begin with living in the desert...mostly xeriscape rock and gravel paths with desert shrubbery and the pool. I get up around 6 every morning and do a check of the pool chem while I'm having my coffee...throw the robot into vacuum if necessary, and that's about it on that side. Most of the yard really only needs maintenance a couple times per year.

    The house is dirtier and just more unkempt looking, which is to be expected IMO...we went from having two adults and an 8 and 10 year old in the house for three or four hours per day during the week before going to bed to having that same ratio in the house basically 24/7...so of course it's going to be a bit more chaotic and unkempt. There's no way to keep up with all of that when you're also working from home and kids are distance learning, etc...there really isn't that much extra time...it's the same time, it's just spent at home doing the things you would normally be doing at work/school. I can't meet deadlines if I'm spending my days making sure the bathrooms are spic and span, etc.

    For a great many, there isn't time for deep cleaning, major yard work, etc...because life is going on as usual, it just happens to be that it's happening from home instead of an office or school. Our only curtailed activities are things like going out to eat and certain entertainment options on the weekend...otherwise life remains the same except I'm not in an office building everyday...but my obligations to the company don't change just 'cuz I'm at home.
  • moonangel12
    moonangel12 Posts: 971 Member
    Went to McDonald’s for drinks today, after our first library trip since 3/10... kids were ecstatic! (Library visits were something they always looked forward to - they devour books). I had to go in because the drive thru was out into the road. The girl at the fry station had a black mask with hot pink “THIS IS STUPID” - I guess it could go a couple directions in terms of meaning, but I assumed she didn’t like having to wear it. Funny thing is, even with her (assumes) opinion being stated loud and proud, she was one of only a couple people in a busy kitchen wearing one correctly. So glad I wasn’t getting food.
  • mockchoc
    mockchoc Posts: 6,573 Member
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    mockchoc wrote: »
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    Drove through the local university campus early evening. Lines at the bars, beer pong in yards groups walking around not a mask to be seen unless it was around someone's neck. Place will be shut down before classes even start.

    I'm not sure what to think about that. Aren't people that go to university supposed to be smarter than the average person? Guess not then.

    Going into or getting into college has nothing to do with someone being smart or not. People entering college are generally 18 year old kids who's frontal lobes have still yet to fully develop. Going to college allows one to be educated in an area of expertise...like anything, there will be people who graduate with minimum qualifications and people with exemplary qualifications, and everything in between. I'm an accountant that graduated cume laude...I spent a lot of time in school tutoring others...there were also a lot of other accountants that graduated with C's...

    For a lot of college students, the first couple years are largely a party with classes before things get serious....there's also a huge flunk/drop ratio during this time. The notion that everyone who gets into college is supposed to be smarter is ridiculous...coming out the other end better educated doesn't mean smarter...it means you received the education.

    PS...even as a cume laude I did stupid *kitten*...'cuz young people do stupid *kitten*...I just happened to be a brain wizard at accounting. That didn't ever keep me from keggers, growing weed in my closet, jumping motor bikes, etc.

    ETA: I'm biased, but my kids are really damned smart, particularly in mathematics...but they're 8 and 10...and everyday I see some of the dumbest *kitten* ever done that makes me pound my head on the table...every friggin' day...they outdo themselves. Smart has nothing to do with actually being aware/socially aware...it just means they rock the *kitten* out of fractions and division...If they lived on their own they would eat Bagel Bites and do nose dives into a 6' pool while drinking copious amounts of Dr. Pepper and maybe having some Ramen here and there, then jumping their mountain bikes off the roof into the pool...

    Over here (Australia) I thought it is the smarter ones goes to university and then the rest either do TAFE (college)or other regular jobs. Not sure if it's different to there. I certainly didn't think I was up to going to uni. I know I was a lot more sensible than some of my friends that went to uni and totally had no common sense even in later life now.

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